Should Christians own "Dream-Catchers?"

[LivingbyFaith]

6 minutes ago, Davida said:

Your welcome LbF! May God bless you. I do my best to help & warn but like you described, those that like the looks of a dream catcher or think it's cool don't want to hear any different. I learned the fear of GOD and there is nothing I own in this world that I wouldn't toss, burn or walk away from if I thought for a second it was unpleasing to God. Reading through this thread has helped me to see some things clearer also, Praise the Lord! 

I feel the same way, thanks!

[frienduff thaylorde]

5 minutes ago, Davida said:

Your welcome LbF! May God bless you. I do my best to help & warn but like you described, those that like the looks of a dream catcher or think it's cool don't want to hear any different. I learned the fear of GOD and there is nothing I own in this world that I wouldn't toss, burn or walk away from if I thought for a second it was unpleasing to God. Reading through this thread has helped me to see some things clearer also, Praise the Lord! 

EXACTLY .   

[discipler777]

13 hours ago, Yowm said:

What I meant was no one is thinking or has mentioned offering worship to a dreamcatcher.

Not the issue. If one keeps it in their home the question is WHY?

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DEUTERONOMY.7:5-6 & 25-26 (NKJV) = 5 But thus you shall deal with them: you shall destroy their altars, and break down their sacred pillars, and cut down their wooden images, and burn their carved images with fire.

6 “For you are a holy people to the Lord your God; the Lord your God has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth. ...

25 You shall burn the carved images of their gods with fire; you shall not covet the silver or gold that is on them, nor take it for yourselves, lest you be snared by it; for it is an abomination to the Lord your God. 26 Nor shall you bring an abomination into your house, lest you be doomed to destruction like it. You shall utterly detest it and utterly abhor it, for it is an accursed thing.

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Christians or Jews keeping idols in their homes is against the law/commandment of God. There is no excuse of a WHY or WHYs which would allow them to break God's Law by keeping idols in their homes. It's like "false" Christians who feel that they can have a good enough reason WHY to go and commit murder or adultery/sexual immorality or other wilful sins/evil-works/law-breaking.

Edited November 3, 2018 by discipler777

[discipler777]

9 hours ago, Yowm said:

I never knew what a dream catcher was until after this thread got started (I had to Google it lol). 

So if I had seen one in a thrift store a month ago and liked the way it looked, took it home and hung it up, are you saying its demons would pounce on me?

.

Ignorance of the Law is no excuse.

Bad things will happen to Christians who take and keep Dreamcatchers or idols in their homes, whether ignorantly or wilfully, unless they repent. Bad things can be directly caused by Satan/demons or indirectly by the permissive will of God ala the Story of Job. ...

PROVERBS.1: (NKJV) = Shun Evil Counsel

8 My son, hear the instruction of your father, And do not forsake the law of your mother;
9 For they will be a graceful ornament on your head, And chains about your neck. ...

²³ Turn at my rebuke; Surely I will pour out my spirit on you; I will make my words known to you.
²⁴ Because I have called and you refused, I have stretched out my hand and no one regarded,

²⁵ Because you disdained all my counsel, And would have none of my rebuke,
²⁶ I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your terror comes,
²⁷ When your terror comes like a storm, And your destruction comes like a whirlwind, When distress and anguish come upon you.

²⁸ “Then they will call on me, but I will not answer; They will seek me diligently, but they will not find me.
²⁹ Because they hated knowledge And did not choose the fear of the Lord,
³⁰ They would have none of my counsel And despised my every rebuke.
³¹ Therefore they shall eat the fruit of their own way, And be filled to the full with their own fancies.
³² For the turning away of the simple will slay them, And the complacency of fools will destroy them;
³³ But whoever listens to me will dwell safely, And will be secure, without fear of evil.”

 

Edited November 3, 2018 by discipler777

[discipler777]

18 hours ago, walla299 said:

 I live in the southwest US and there are a lot of dream catchers hanging on walls around here. They're just feathers, line, and wood strung together unless someone wants to attribute some kind of power to them. Similar situation in Corinthians that Paul wrote about. Hang one on the wall, or don't. Its your choice - but don't denigrate someone who does.

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Just a FYI, 1CORINTHIANS.8:4-8 where Paul permitted "strong" Gentile Christians to eat foods/things offered to idols(= were seen as inanimate objects to them) when no weak Christians were present, had been superceded by the later decision of the Jerusalem Council at ACTS.15:24-29 & 21:20-25 where Gentile Christians were completely forbidden from eating foods/things offered to idols, ie whether weak Christians were present or not, eg not allowed to eat them at home or outside. Jews and Jewish Christians already did not eat foods/things offered to idols, as per the Law. Similarly for the keeping of idols at home.

Imagine a scenario where "strong" Gentile Christians keep idols or Dreamcatchers at home as inanimate objects and then having to hide the "inanimate" objects when weak Christians come for a visit or are present. What a burdensome life.! How are strong and weak Gentile Christians determined.?

Edited November 3, 2018 by discipler777

[other one]

22 hours ago, Yowm said:

For conscience sake of the weaker brother and for what it represents yes. But my point all along is that the object in and of itself is not intrinsically evil. It's the meaning attached to it that is evil.

I'd like for us to build up the strength of our weaker brothers.

[Peavey]

On 11/2/2018 at 9:45 AM, Davida said:

Moccasins are just shoes and they are worn as such.  Shoes or mittens are not used or  taught as a way  to CONNECT to spiritual beings or to hold any spiritual power ,  or magical beliefs that a Dream Catcher holds.  

These things have no power over you if you are in Christ. Why be afraid? They supposedly connect to gods that are no gods. There is only one God and He is all powerful.

[discipler777]

16 hours ago, Yowm said:

Thanks for exposing yourself.

I am glad Jesus bore the curse of the Law in my stead...

Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: Galatians 3:13 (KJV)

Yes, but what you said is only with regards to being redeemed or saved from the curse of Adam's Original Sin or Adam's breaking of the Law/commandment, ie the curse of spiritual death or eternal separation from God.(GENESIS.2:17 & 3:17-19, ROMANS.5:12) ... and not with regards to the wilful or ignorant sins/evil-works/law-breaking committed by Christians, who will still be cursed/judged by God.(HEBREWS.10:26-31) The blood of Jesus Christ only atoned for Adam's Original Sin and other unintentional/non-wilful sins(LEVITICUS.17:11 & 4:2) = mainly saves the believers from the curse of hell when they die and does not give them the license-to-sin or to "Go and sin some more"(cf JOHN.5:14 & 8:11) without any repercussions or without being cursed/judged/chastened by God. Would a just God just simply forgive and let go or not curse/judge an unrepentant Christian murderer, adulterer, rapist, thief, extortioner or defrauder.?

Nevertheless, the resultant curses/judgments of God upon wilful/ignorant sinners/evildoers/law-breakers may still be removed by God if repented of, eg the healings, deliverances and exorcisms performed by Jesus Christ and the apostles, the pardons of Job, David and Paul, etc = God's rare and discretionary authority or power to forgive/pardon repentant wilful/ignorant sinners/evildoers/law-breakers, similar to the President's seldom-used power/authority to pardon convicted criminals. ...

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ACTS.5:3-6 =(NKJV) = 3 But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the price of the land for yourself? 4 While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”

5 Then Ananias, hearing these words, fell down and breathed his last. So great fear came upon all those who heard these things. 6 And the young men arose and wrapped him up, carried him out, and buried him.

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1CORINTHIANS.11:29-32 = 29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body. 30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we may not be condemned with the world.

1CORINTHIANS.5:4-5 = 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

1JOHN.5:16-17 = 16 If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that. 17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death.

Edited November 4, 2018 by discipler777

[discipler777]

11 hours ago, Yowm said:

Yes agreed unless or until they start pontificating against Christian freedoms. Too often we protect the legalist who moves under the cloak of a'weaker brother'.

Yes, ACTS.15:24-29 & 21:20-25 have freed Gentile Christians from burdensome laws like circumcision and eating only clean/kosher foods. But ...

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GALATIANS.5:13-15 & 19-21 = 13 For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 But if you bite and devour one another, beware lest you be consumed by one another! & ...

19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

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Gentile Christians should still keep non-burdensome laws of God, "lest a worse thing come upon you"(JOHN.5:14), ie they will be cursed/judged by God for their wilful or ignorant sins/evil-works/law-breaking with calamities(1COR.5:5 & 11:30) and may then lose faith and their salvation.(eg JOB.2:9) In contrast, Job repented and kept the faith throughout his suffering = was saved.

Edited November 4, 2018 by discipler777

[Christine]

On 10/30/2018 at 6:59 AM, LivingbyFaith said:

I have a "Christian" friend who owns a couple of dream-catchers and has them hanging in her house.  I advised her to get rid of them, but she insisted that she just liked the look of them and that she had prayed over them, therefore, it is okay and continued to have them in her house.  Since then, her husband became violent, physically abusing her boys.  Her and her husband broke up...but she still continues to have a dream-catcher, whether it's in her house or on her key-ring.

I myself, believe us Christians shouldn't own them or have them in our homes!  What do you think?

Deuteronomy 7:26

"Neither shalt thou bring an abomination into thine house, lest thou be a cursed thing like it; but thou shalt utterly detest it, and thou shalt utterly abhor it; for it is a cursed thing"

Hello there, @LivingbyFaith,

Having read through several pages of this thread (but not all) I am of the opinion that it comes down to thinking of those whose faith is weak or vulnerable to suggestion.  For example if someone has a weakness for alcohol or any other form of addictive agent, then you do not place it within their sight to bring temptation their way. If you are out in the company of others whom you know have a weakness for alcohol, you do not, for their sake, indulge in that substance yourself, even if that substance holds no power over you personally.  It is done out of love for the one you are with.  The same may apply to certain foods, which is not harmful in itself, but if it should lead to compulsive behaviour in another,  you yourself should refuse it when in their company, in order to support the friend who is having difficulty with resisting what, to them, is a form of self-harm. I think of Romans 14, and 1 Corinthians 8.

I was given a stone by my daughter, a pretty stone, blue, with layers of shading, which I love, not only because she gave it to me, but because of the colours within it, and the fact that it is a little bit of God's creation which is so wonderfully made, and so beautiful in itself, which has caused me to thank Him glorify Him for the beauty of His creation.  Yet, she also told me that the stone, by some, is considered to have the power to promote fluency of expression. Now that extra bit of information I could do without, for it has sometimes made my conscience trouble me, with such thoughts as,  'Should I therefore have it in my possession? Do I perhaps have a sneaking belief that what is claimed is true? Is that why I keep it on my bedside table? Am I deceiving myself?' All of these thoughts have invaded my mind in regard to that stone.  Yet I refuse to get rid of it, because I don't believe that a stone, of itself, has the ability to influence anything, so why should I myself be influenced by the superstitions of others.

Things that obviously have links with the occult, which of themselves are simply a form of deception, but which lead people astray: should be avoided.  Simply because they are dead ends: they lead nowhere; people spend years following supernatural phenomenon, and investigating such things, instead of spending their time in the pursuit of the truth which is in Christ Jesus.  These paths all lead to death, and bondage.

Choose life.

In Christ Jesus

Chris