Come! See the light!

[Guest ZealofGod]

Daniel 1:4 says

[jc49]

Daniel 1:4 says “Children in whom had no blemish, but well was favored, and skilful in all wisdom, and cunning in knowledge, and understanding science, and such as had ability in them to stand in the king’s palace, and whom they might teach the language of the Chaldeans.” God wants Christians to understand science and learn about it, like Daniel who was a godly man, and people have to realize that before they lose all knowledge. 2 Cor. 13:8 – “For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth.”

Hebrews 10 – “For the law is only a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very thing itself.

Science and Religion have stirred up trouble many times throughout history. Although, evolution and the Bible may not be as contradictory as people seem to think. If anyone did some real research on the theory of evolution they would find that there are mountains of evidences to prove that it did really occur on earth. Well for people who believe that God created the world in 7 days like it says in Genesis then they have to either accept one or the other. Unless you think that science is in opposition to the bible.

First, I would like to state that the purpose of this paper is not to only show many evidences that prove the evolutionary process, but I would also like to show how it corresponds with the Bible. I will be using a King James Version bible for my references because it is a word for word translation, unlike other versions which just sum the phrase and give you their idea of what it means.

When Nicholaus Copernicus purposed the heliocentric theory, the church claimed that his work was satanic and false and that it was opposing Christianity. This happened even though there is not anything that is stated in the bible that says anything different. Today, history is just repeating itself with this full-size evolution debate. Science and Religion have has created many conflicts, but its time people realize that if you believe in God, then you also believe he created everything in existence.

Before I start to break down these things I want to let the reader know that I am a Christian who believes in God, and that God created all things.

To be able to argue a point you need not only your opinion, backed with proof, but the opinion of the counterpart. You need to understand evolution before you label it ‘True’ or ‘False’. Every year there is a new flu shot out and do you know why? Because in just one year that virus has evolved to defend against the vaccine. If the DNA of that virus changed so much in that one year, then think about 1000 years. The older virus would be almost a completely different virus. Virus’s are not the only thing that evolves. Every living creature does and must evolve so that it can survive in the wild.

When people make the claim that life could not have occurred by accident and that the chances are too small, they just haven’t really studied the subject. A virus can move about as it needs, it has DNA, it reproduces, but it is NOT a living organism. It is not because in order to reproduce it must use a living host cell to manufacture its parts. Since it is not an organism, it is just a collection of certain elements that is stuck in a cycle of in taking and turning it into energy to continue the cycle. All life is a certain arrangement of molecules with energy flowing through it.

Spontaneous Combustion is the theory that living things can come from non-living things. This means that if the elements required to begin life are present and it was charged with energy, then life could start. Who knows how long the earth existed void of life before life started. All the required elements were present and there were sources of energy such as volcanoes, earthquakes, and lightning.

Some common myths that people believe about evolution is that it’s a random process and that there is a missing link between humans and chimps. This is not true, but is an idea people created to discredit evolution. Human DNA is %98 identical. This means that if you altered that 2 percent you would end up with an exact replica of human DNA. This doesn’t imply that humans evolved from apes or that an ape will ever evolve into a human. This means we share a common ancestor.

There are a few different ways a species can evolve. Natural Selection is the most common method taken advantage of. It is the main component of Darwin’s ‘Survival of the Fittest’. Every individual organism has its own uniqueness and each one has certain aspects that are more efficient or less efficient. One person may have a better body type to be a runner than another. Another may have a body type that suits them well for football. Humans aren’t the only creature with these variations. In the wild, two rabbits may be born in the litter. One may be faster than the other. When a predator sees them and starts to chase either one, the slower one would lag behind and be eaten, now only the faster rabbit survived and it can reproduce and pass on it’s genes. This is an example of how the more ‘fit’ organism is the one who survives and reproduces so that the more ‘fit’ traits are passed on. Separation is a way to adapt that one population split into two separate groups that do not inter-breed. This method causes the separate groups to evolve individually because they are not inter-breeding. One way this can occur is if a population of foxes is cut in two by a river. The two groups would evolve seperately and eventually you would see notable variations and over time the variation can become more prominent such as it creating two separate species.

Radioactivity can cause mutations in the DNA at random. Most of the time, the mutation is harmful and causes unwanted effects and the organisms dies and does not pass it on. If the mutation is beneficial then it will be passed on and entered into the gene pool of the population.

Now that we covered the basics of evolution we can get into the religious aspect. A person who believes in God also believes that God created all things, including science. By not observing science you would be shutting out His creation. If God made the earth according to a literal interpretation then how would one explain all the fossils and evidence supporting evolution? The only explanation is that ‘I have faith’. Well, if God wanted to help a human he wouldn’t start by planting fake fossils in the ground to trick us. Those bones are their because of animals that died thousands or millions of years ago. So how do they correlate?

According to the Bible, God created the ‘heavens’ and the earth in 6 days and on the 7th he rested. Man was made on the 6th day and all this happened in a place called ‘The Garden of Eden’. If you really study the bible you would find that it uses the word “day” abstractly, to mean a time period, than literally. The first part of the bible(Old Testament) was written in Hebrew and the second part(New Testament) was written in Greek. If you look at the original texts of Genesis they use the Hebrew word ‘Yom’. Yom can be used to mean a literal day, but it is commonly used to mean an indefinite period of time. We know that the universe was not made in 7-24 hour days so we can imply that the author meant it was created in 7 eras or time periods. What is a day? A day is how long the earth takes to make a rotation around its axis. Well the author uses ‘day’ before the sun or earth was created. This means that they used ‘day’, before a ‘day’ was even possible to measure. Also, plants and trees are created before the sun. Any plant cannot live without the sun, because all its food/energy comes from the sun.

In Genesis chapter 2, it talks of the ‘generations of the heavens and the earth’ being created in the day God made the universe. The theory of evolution is formed from generations of organisms. It says God had not caused it to rain because there was not a man to till the ground. Instead a mist came up from the earth and watered the ground. In the cave of Koonalda in the Nullarbor Plains, Australia contains signs of early human activity such as cave art. Today, that area is desolate and dry, but there are caves carved all throughout the plains that were formed by acidic water percolating through the limestone. This could be the mist that came up from the earth.

Africa 6 million years ago was the perfect lush habitat for an ape or especially a hominid. (By the way 6 is the number always representing man in the Bible.) According to Gen. 2:8-31, the Garden of Eden was someplace eastward in Eden. The lush jungle in Africa was the first area to have signs of hominids. It says the Tree of Life was in the midst of the garden and interestingly enough Darwin named the structure of life the Tree of Life because it has the same structure. There are different branches of life which divide and spread out over time just like a tree. Also, it speaks of a river going though the garden that splits into four parts. The Nile river runs directly through that area and separates into two parts and then again to make four streams. It does split a few more times but it mainly consists of four parts.

After man sins, God says “Dust you are, and to dust you will return.” According to evolution we did come from the ground. Also, Homo sapiens and Homo neanderthalensis are the only species known that bury there dead. This could have been a tradition that originated from the dust you shall return quote. Also, after sin is when man first realizes he is naked. When they left the garden the were given coats of animal skins and Neanderthals were the first creature to were clothing and they wore animal skins.

When man left the garden, God placed ‘a flaming sword turned every way’ at the east of the garden. 3.5 millions years ago on the eastern side of Africa, a volcano known as Sadoman(not sure of correct spelling) erupted. Any human without a very extensive vocabulary would need metaphors to describe the subject. A volcano it flaming and shots straight up and then spreads in every direction just like the Bible described. When this happened it spread ash all over the ground for miles. Right after this it rained, and many animals that were walking across that area left footprints in the ash, and the ash hardened and still hold the prints today. There were all sorts of footprint found there including elephants, giraffe, and most importantly, two hominids. Australopithecus afarensis is the class of hominid that they belonged two. The appearance of this species is almost that of a chimp, but it is bipedal. This means it walks on two feet. A few aspects of bipedalism are the ‘big’ toe of a human or another biped is protruding to the front and is used for walking forward. A chimp’s foot have a toe further down the foot and has no use to a biped. Also, the leg bones and pelvis must be arranged a certain way to make bipedalism possible. On thing that the Bible uses over and over again is the metaphor of water and life. Ps. 114:8 says “He turned the rocks into a standing water, and flint into a fountain of waters. One characteristic separating humans from the rest is the ability to stand. A standing water is a reference to humans.

Adam and Eve had children after they were banished and the first two were named Cain and Abel. The scriptures say “And in the process of time it came to pass that Cain was a tiller of the ground and Abel was a keeper of sheep. One of the things which influenced human evolution is the time when humans had to choose hunting of scavenging. These could be what is being describes by ‘tiller of the ground’ or gardener and a herder or someone who eats the sheep. Cain eventually kills his brother and is banished to the land of Nod. There he finds a wife and bare children. Where did the wife come from if only Adam, Eve, and Cain were on the earth. It refers to his descendants as ‘seeds’ and then goes on to them having children. Cain’s first ‘seed’ named Enoch, built the first city. A city does not only contain 3 people. That means there must have been other humans. After only five ‘generations’ of ‘seeds’ the line of Cain ends. In that time, there are reverences to the first human accomplishing something. These are, the first to live in tents(first to live in shelter), the father of music, and the first brass and iron worker(first to start using metals for tools). These are all things that were existent in the Neanderthal population. And just as Cain’s line end abruptly, the Neanderthals are extinct and there is no know explanation.

Here is something I discovered while researching evolution.(On separate sheet.) I noticed the similarities and then filled in the blanks. I found this family tree on PBS’s webpage covering evolution.

As you can see from the family tree is that the bible describes the human family tree but at the time it was written, these words were needed to describe something. How could a early human describe evolution? With the words tree, root, branch, and seed the writer could give a ‘shadow’ of the full meaning. Also, note that each family of hominids that are related corresponds to the literal families in the Bible. It will be explained at the bottom of the family tree sheet.

Most everyone agrees that the Middle Eastern area and Egypt was the area man first came together and started society. If the bible were true, it wouldn’t matter where the first man was because once Noah came out of the ark it started over. Eden could have been in china and the ark floated to a different location.

Neanderthal skeletons are found all throughout Europe and in the newer levels they start to get sapiens like characteristics. This can only mean that when early modern human came into contact with Neanderthals they inter-bred. Accordingly, Genesis 6 says the “Sons of God laid with the daughters of men.” This is a clue that hints at the interbreeding. Immediately following that verse comes a verse that says there were giants in the earth at that time. A Neanderthal is a very strong hominid with thick bones and very strong arms that are supported. A giant is used to say larger than normal which the Neanderthal was. In fact, they had a larger brain size than modern humans. The Homo sapiens’s volume of its brain cavity is 1000-1700cm3 and a Homo Neanderthal’s is 1300-1750cm3. It is because a Neanderthal is not something we evolved from. It is a counterpart of the separation of species. Modern human’s going one way and ‘cave men’ going the opposite.

From all of the data I have collected and also backed by the scriptures is that the first hominid or human came out of the Egyptian and East African area. Hebrews is one of the books of the bible that has predictions in it, and I won’t go in to detail at the moment concerning all the predictions that have already come true, but it warns about people who won’t believe it when they hear it. Hebrews 3:16 “For some, when they heard the truth, provoked by saying: How can it be that not all came out of Egypt by Moses.” What it is saying is that, in later time (today), people will not believe the truth, but ask how man could not only come out of Egypt from Moses. This is being fulfilled right now that I have shown that the ‘Garden of Eden’ was in east Africa covering Egypt, people won’t believe man came out of more than one place.

In the Bible, it says that some things are sins. If you look at them you can see how they are all evolutionarily linked. Stealing is like, one of the cells in your body stealing from another, that is what stealing money does for the population of people. Rules guarding marriage and sexual restrictions are all based on the reproduction of our species that is most healthy. Animals evolve. People evolve. Well, if you lived in a war stricken area then you are going to adapt to that. If you live lawlessly then we would pass on some genes adapted to sin and cause harm. That is the responsibility of humans. We can pass on useful traits too by working hard and reading. Everything and more I have shown you is in the Bible, you just have to be able to understand the in depth version.

Daniel 1:4 says “Children in whom had no blemish, but well was favored, and skilful in all wisdom, and cunning in knowledge, and understanding science, and such as had ability in them to stand in the king’s palace, and whom they might teach the language of the Chaldeans.” God wants Christians to understand science and learn about it, like Daniel who was a godly man, and people have to realize that before they lose all knowledge. 2 Cor. 13:8 – “For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth.”

Hebrews 10 – “For the law is only a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very thing itself.

Hebrews 8:5b - The Lord says “Make all things according to the pattern showed to you in the mount.(To get the 10 Commandments.)”

Check all these things out if you really want to understand:

#1 is very useful and it has information about all aspects of evolution.

#2 shows very in depth details about human evolution.

#3 whether you are a Christian or not, if are debating Genesis, then use a bible anyway so you know what you talking about. King James is a more accurate translation but it is harder to read and hard to understand, so you might want to start using a New KJV.

1. PBS’s - http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/

2. Human Evolution - http://www.becominghuman.org/

3. King James Version bible

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Save your breath and stick to the Word....

17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

Isa 29:14

20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.

30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

Jer 9:24

CHRIST JESUS is WISDOM,RIGHTEOUSNESS,SANCTIFICATION,REDEMPTION...

====================================================

Ist Cor:

Chapter 2

1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.

2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

3

And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.

4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:

5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

9

But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

Isa 64:4

10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

11

For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

Isa 40:14

SHALOM

[Guest Bro David™]

CHRIST JESUS is WISDOM,RIGHTEOUSNESS,SANCTIFICATION,REDEMPTION...

====================================================

Ist Cor:

Chapter 2

1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.

2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

3

And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.

4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:

5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

9

But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

Isa 64:4

10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

11

For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

Isa 40:14

SHALOM

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Amen Amen Amen ! Roberto

[nebula]

Zeal -

I am a science major myself. I, too, am more open to alternative interpretations of Genesis 1 than the conventional.

You have given several interesting interpretations; unfortunately, you have made the mistake of taking speculations and ideas and presented them as fact. Likewise, you included claims without supporting evidence.

Here are some:

Spontaneous Combustion is the theory that living things can come from non-living things.

Who still believes in this theory?

If you look at the original texts of Genesis they use the Hebrew word

[nebula]

Note to other responses:

Please don't post the entire quote unless there are many points you need to highlight, OK?

It's not necessary to scroll through the post all over again.

Thanks!

[Leonard]

It seems to me that the fact of sexual reproduction in higher animals spells the death knell to any gradualist scheme of evolution.

[jc49]

Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel:

9 Wherein I suffer trouble, as an evil doer, even unto bonds; but the word of God is not bound.

10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:

12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

17 And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus;

18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

Num 16:5, 26

20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.

21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

22 Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

26

And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will. ( 1st Tim ch 2)

SHALOM

[Guest Bro David™]

Note to other responses:

Please don't post the entire quote unless there are many points you need to highlight, OK?

It's not necessary to scroll through the post all over again.

Thanks!

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Note :

Maybe the whole Post was a quote ?

LOL

[Ovedya]

This is probably going to be a huge waste of time and energy. Obviously the OP was a cut and paste from another website.