dad2 Posted January 29, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,504 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 184 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted January 29, 2020 1 hour ago, The Barbarian said: That's an addition to scripture, which is not found in God's actual words. God told Adam that he would die the day he ate from the tree. Not "eventually", not "and then you'll die another death." If you have to change it to make it fit your narrative, isn't that an important clue? No one said that eventually was a word from Scripture. It was used as an adjective describing how physical death or life follows spiritual death or life. Our new eternal bodies do not come right when we are born again. His light shines more and more till the perfect day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Barbarian Posted January 30, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,051 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 969 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/20/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted January 30, 2020 That's an addition to scripture, which is not found in God's actual words. God told Adam that he would die the day he ate from the tree. Not "eventually", not "and then you'll die another death." If you have to change it to make it fit your narrative, isn't that an important clue? 4 hours ago, dad2 said: No one said that eventually was a word from Scripture. It was used as an adjective describing how physical death or life follows spiritual death or life. Our new eternal bodies do not come right when we are born again. How does stand against God's word in Genesis? It's just man's imagination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dad2 Posted January 30, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,504 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 184 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted January 30, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, The Barbarian said: That's an addition to scripture, which is not found in God's actual words. God told Adam that he would die the day he ate from the tree. Not "eventually", not "and then you'll die another death." If you have to change it to make it fit your narrative, isn't that an important clue? How does stand against God's word in Genesis? It's just man's imagination. That does not stand against God's word anywhere. The bible makes it clear that we get our eternal bodies later. Not when we fist come to believe. We know there is a physical and a spiritual aspect to life. Adam started to die the moment he disobeyed. Spiritually, yes he did die, but Adam also died physically later. So both were involved spiritual and physical. The physical came later. Edited January 30, 2020 by dad2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Barbarian Posted February 2, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,051 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 969 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/20/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted February 2, 2020 If you have to change it to make it fit your narrative, isn't that an important clue? How does stand against God's word in Genesis? It's just man's imagination. On 1/30/2020 at 2:13 AM, dad2 said: That does not stand against God's word anywhere. It doesn't, but YE creationists think it does. They assume their new doctrines are more reliable than God's word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dad2 Posted February 3, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,504 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 184 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted February 3, 2020 (edited) 20 hours ago, The Barbarian said: If you have to change it to make it fit your narrative, isn't that an important clue? How does stand against God's word in Genesis? It's just man's imagination. It doesn't, but YE creationists think it does. They assume their new doctrines are more reliable than God's word. You have an opinion. So if physical life is not included with spiritual life, what, we never will get eternal bodies like Jesus? Adam was a body also, not just a spirit. What is your attempted point here, is is just to claim there was no real creation, but that evolution really made us, or...what? Edited February 3, 2020 by dad2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTC Posted February 3, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 200 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 2,795 Content Per Day: 0.65 Reputation: 1,502 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/25/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/26/1952 Share Posted February 3, 2020 When it comes to God's teachings on morality I believe we must take His words quite literally. But when it comes to what God told man about creation we have to give God a lot of slack. The important thing about the creation is that however He did it, God created all that exists. When I was young God and science seemed to be at irreconcilable odds with each other. But the more advanced science becomes the more likely it seems that some super intelligent & super powerful Being created everything. I call that Being God but I guess to some atheistic scientists God is a dirty word. I laugh when these atheistic scientists call God "nature". They'll say things like, nature in it's wisdom caused the earth to form at the perfect distance from the Sun to allow man to evolve and survive. Now I'm even hearing that astrophysicists are realizing that if we didn't have huge planets like Jupiter and Saturn towards the outer parts of our solar system earth would probably be getting bombarded by asteroids that would continually be wiping out almost all life. Wowee, mother nature is 1 smart cookie. I should try to hire her to do my taxes, I'd save a fortune... These scientists need to get their heads straight on this. If they believe an intelligence was involved in creation then that intelligence was God. I suppose they don't want to accept that because they can't prove God is real. That's true, they can't prove God is real. But God can prove to them He's real. I know this because 40 yrs ago I asked Him to prove to me He's real. He did it too, but not in the way I expected. Furthermore, God has proven He's real to many of us on this board. I believe God will prove His reality to anyone who asks with humility and a sincere desire to know. Scientists need more humility, maybe then they won't be atheistic anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dad2 Posted February 4, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,504 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 184 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted February 4, 2020 10 hours ago, JTC said: When it comes to God's teachings on morality I believe we must take His words quite literally. But when it comes to what God told man about creation we have to give God a lot of slack. Quote God is not slack concerning His promises and what He states. We ought to seek to not be slack in believing it. The important thing about the creation is that however He did it, God created all that exists. Quote It is important that we believe He is not a Liar and that He told us the truth in Scripture. When I was young God and science seemed to be at irreconcilable odds with each other. But the more advanced science becomes the more likely it seems that some super intelligent & super powerful Being created everything. Quote Belief in Jesus as creator is not belief in some god doing it, or helping it happen. Belief in God creating all things includes, for example believing that Eve was created from an already created man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTC Posted February 4, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 200 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 2,795 Content Per Day: 0.65 Reputation: 1,502 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/25/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/26/1952 Share Posted February 4, 2020 10 hours ago, dad2 said: When it comes to God's teachings on morality I believe we must take His words quite literally. But when it comes to what God told man about creation we have to give God a lot of slack. dad2, based on simply the 2 passages you quoted, one of which was mine, I already know you won't be able to understand me. 10 hours ago, dad2 said: God is not slack concerning His promises and what He states. We ought to seek to not be slack in believing it. I used the word slack to mean "a broader understanding". But in the scripture you quoted the word slack is used to mean "slow", and probably excessively slow. So you're comparing apples & pineapples. Just because the names of those 2 fruits share the letters a p p l e s, doesn't mean they look or taste alike. Have you ever said something like Mary was blue today. But her skin didn't turn blue, she was in a depressed mood. I like to believe that God created the world exactly as Genesis says it happened, but it may not have happened that way which doesn't matter as long as we remember that God caused it. Would Moses have understood God if He said, millions of years ago I first created inorganic molecules. But then I wanted life, and btw Moses, the fruits I let you eat are made of living molecules, but not the same kind I used to make you & Eve. So first I had to create a new kind of organic molecule and then I made you. Could Moses have understood that, of course not. But I'm sure I lost you 2 paragraphs ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Barbarian Posted February 4, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,051 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 969 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/20/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted February 4, 2020 On 2/2/2020 at 8:16 PM, dad2 said: You have an opinion. Yes. It is my opinion that God is always truthful. He told Adam that he would die the day he ate from the tree. And yet Adam lived on physically for many years thereafter. If I am right about God being truthful then the death that came into the world by Adam's disobedience, was not a physical death. No way to dodge that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dad2 Posted February 5, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,504 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 184 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted February 5, 2020 9 hours ago, JTC said: Quote dad2, based on simply the 2 passages you quoted, one of which was mine, I already know you won't be able to understand me. I used the word slack to mean "a broader understanding". Not believing in Eve is not a broad understanding. It is unbelief in the word of God. Quote I like to believe that God created the world exactly as Genesis says it happened, but it may not have happened that way which doesn't matter as long as we remember that God caused it. It matters whether the whole bible says one thing and it is not actually true. The job of believers is to believe, not to revise what is said until it is unrecognizable. Quote Would Moses have understood God if He said, millions of years ago I first created inorganic molecules. Yes. But He said nothing remotely similar to that, and in fact totally opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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