Completed Israelite Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Junior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 113 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 34 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/20/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 I know everyone is of the belief that When they die they then goto Heaven. but there is no such verse in the Bible anywhere I can find. From what I've seen the promise is ...eventually,..Eternal Life on Earth, and then the New earth, But nothing says while a person is dead they ascend into the Heavens. There is no dead people in Heaven. But people of God while dead get true peace and rest, a state of repose. Until the ressurection of the dead. Then the reward of Eternal life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Completed Israelite Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Junior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 113 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 34 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/20/2020 Status: Offline Author Share Posted November 30, 2020 9 minutes ago, Chicken coop2 said: Good point. It has always looked like this to me too. Amen to that brother, Truth comes first, which just means scripture comes first haha. God bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desopixi Seilynam Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,004 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 305 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/12/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 What about 1 Samuel 28:15-19 and Luke 16:23-28? Souls certainly go somewhere. 2 Corinthians 5:6-8 "whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: ...We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord." "And the armies which were in heaven followed Him on white horses..." Rev 19:14 In the end, heaven comes down: "And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven..." Rev 21:2 ------- It's all better understood when we realize that the sky is hard as a molten looking glass Job 37:18 No mere man has been outside of the sky. John 3:13 Modern 'science' is mainly a deception. In the end this sky will melt and roll back as a scroll, and the heavenly city that is currently on top of it, will come down. "Blessed are they that do His commands, that they may have right to the tree of life and may enter through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desopixi Seilynam Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,004 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 305 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/12/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Chicken coop2 said: So, do you think the moon walk was fake? Yes, seek out and watch the full video of them supposedly taking off from the moon, the 4th or so mission. It can not fool modern eyes, but fooled 70's eyes. Also 'astronauts gone wild' is another good one to see. Also simply watching the initial moon landing press conference with the astronauts is good. Yes, and also the modern mars rover press conference is good to watch closely, note how many times the one guy calls out to the audience for people who are magically not there. Astronaut. Astro - Not. Alien. A lie (n) Nasa in Hebrew Nasha means: 'to deceive'. "[There are] breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of truth's protective layers" Neil Armstrong. During a presentation with Bill Clinton and others. Edited November 30, 2020 by Desopixi Seilynam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotAllThere Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 462 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 335 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/27/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 3 hours ago, Desopixi Seilynam said: No mere man has been outside of the sky. John 3:13 Modern 'science' is mainly a deception. But not the science that produce computers and the internet presumably. Or modern cars and aircraft. Or medicine. I mean, apart from those things, what has science ever done for us? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glff Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 35 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 27 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/06/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 I consider New Jerusalem to be heaven, where the Father will sit on a great white throne under an emerald rainbow and whose presence will be the light of the whole of the new earth, even the far side of the planet will be brightly illuminated by the Lord's presence and there will be no darkness or night ever! And to take it a bit further, we are eternal kings and priests even on the new earth. I suspect that as kings, we'll need kingdoms, especially since the leaves from the tree of life are for the healing of nations and that's the only reason that I can think of for there to be any nations at all on the new earth. The top of New Jerusalem will be 5 times higher than the height that the space shuttle orbits this earth. And again, I suspect that the permanent new earth will be a lot larger than this earth to accommodate it. If the Lord made this temporary creation in such detail, with stars that are over 8 billion light years away with no end in sight; imagine what he'll do in the heavens then. Funny note: I used to pray that the Lord give me my mansion at the top corner of New Jerusalem so I could look down upon the new earth in two directions and with a sky light, I could see the new heavens; but then I realized that that room would be the furthest from the throne room that I could possibly get. : ( I stopped asking for such a room after that. lol@me... glf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keet Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 72 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 61 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/01/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 I believe that we will be resurrected and go to the new earth, and agree that the Bible does not say that we will go to Heaven. However, if I am at a funeral and someone familiar with the deceased says, 'She's happy in Heaven now', I probably won't argue and say something like "Actually, she's still dead right now and 'sleeping', but some time in the future she'll be resurrected and go to the perfect restored new earth." I'll just agree because it's close enough. It's an unfortunate misconception that many Christians have, but it's far from the worst. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Speks Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 192 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 145 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/03/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 12 hours ago, Chicken coop2 said: ...do you think the moon walk was fake? Off-topic, but... I'm definitely not a fan of 80% of our ventures into space, but anybody who wonders about the opinions of moon/flat earth-related conspiracists should get themselves "Moon Hoax: Debunked! Dispelling doubts about the Moon landings, celebrating courage and ingenuity" by Paolo Attivissimo. A fascinating read that gets you thinking seriously about the unsettling traits in some people's personalities that leave their minds open to fringe speculations and untenable scientific worldviews. The main problem we face is dealing with why and how this happens, especially within the true Church. A secondary consideration is the impact it makes on an impressionable global population that exchanges information so easily and freely (and carelessly). The mature and enriching wisdom of Christ is greatly needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GandalfTheWise Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 24 Topic Count: 40 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,459 Content Per Day: 0.59 Reputation: 2,377 Days Won: 2 Joined: 08/23/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 18 minutes ago, Speks said: Off-topic, but... [Edited for space] The main problem we face is dealing with why and how this happens, especially within the true Church. A secondary consideration is the impact it makes on an impressionable global population that exchanges information so easily and freely (and carelessly). The mature and enriching wisdom of Christ is greatly needed. A few years ago there were a few vocal Christians on this site who believed the earth was flat. The primary reason was a literal interpretation of verses that referred to the 4 corners of the earth and similar things. For them, it is about biblical authority and perfection. If the bible is wrong about the shape of the earth, none of the bible can be trusted. This means any scientific "evidence" which contradicts biblical revelation has to be in error and any scientific "evidence" which confirms it had to be correct. For them, it is a matter of salvation because the authority of scripture itself is at stake. Anyone who disagrees is rejecting scripture. I didn't realize this at first and initially attempted to address this from the standpoint of physics. I also did not realize I should have been treading much more carefully and gently because I was running the risk of completely shaking someone's faith in scripture because if I disproved the earth being flat, what else of what they believed the Bible to say might be wrong. Here's a thread some time ago where I attempted (as a physicist) to deal with points a flat-earth believing Christian had been raising as proof of a flat earth. https://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic/212853-examples-of-applied-physics/ I suspect some people espousing these views online are trolls, but my sense is that there are a Christians who sincerely hold them as a matter of faith in scripture. Now I approach this from the difference between having faith in scripture versus having faith in our own fallible interpretation of scripture and the difference between having trust and confidence in God Himself versus trying to eliminate all intellectual doubts about everything we think we are supposed to believe. This is a complete discussion and thread on it's own. If there are further questions, it'd probably be better to start a new thread though there are probably some old threads dealing with this. [End of sidetrack] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GandalfTheWise Posted November 30, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 24 Topic Count: 40 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,459 Content Per Day: 0.59 Reputation: 2,377 Days Won: 2 Joined: 08/23/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2020 2 hours ago, keet said: I believe that we will be resurrected and go to the new earth, and agree that the Bible does not say that we will go to Heaven. However, if I am at a funeral and someone familiar with the deceased says, 'She's happy in Heaven now', I probably won't argue and say something like "Actually, she's still dead right now and 'sleeping', but some time in the future she'll be resurrected and go to the perfect restored new earth." I'll just agree because it's close enough. It's an unfortunate misconception that many Christians have, but it's far from the worst. I like the gentleness of your approach on this. Bottom line is that when we close our eyes for the last time on earth, the next opening of them will be in the presence of the Lord. Be that instantaneous in the spiritual realm or after we've been physically resurrected, the net result from our perspective is the same. Whether we came into existence as eternal beings at the moment of conception or whether our eternal life springs from Christ through the Holy Spirit making us alive throughout eternity through Him, the net result is the same. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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