By His stripes we are healed of what?

[Your closest friendnt]

On 2/22/2021 at 7:33 PM, Paul James said:

Jesus said quite clearly and through actual demonstration that Isaiah 53:4 was about physical healing.  Therefore, to say anything different is to contradict Jesus' interpretation of the verse.

Reading carefully the reference passage we cannot say that Jesus said that Isaiah 53:4 is about physical healings. 

This is rather someone else saying that and it was not at the time Jesus healings, and there is nothing to show that at that time or at anytime there after Jesus endorsed that statement. 

This statement was made long time there after, and there not enough information to show how Mathew was moved to put that down.

If it was his own or he heard someone else saying that and he put it down without any argument to support what is claimed. 

Maybe you can put the argument your self by analising 53:

At that time the one who was doing the healings was not on the Cross. 

Isaiah describes something that takes place at the time of the Cross and imediatly there after, after the ending of the chastisement and after the death of the one who was punished. 

If you follow the rest of the chapter. 

 

[Your closest friendnt]

On 2/22/2021 at 7:35 PM, Paul James said:

In Matthew 8:16-17 Jesus Himself contradicts you by saying that Isaiah 53:4 is fulfilled by His healing of physical sicknesses.

This is a wishful thought but (sorry it is not personal) it is not supported by the text.

We know who put it down , this is Mathew and not Jesus. 

We only know who put it down, we do not know if Jesus endorsed it, because he did not say I heard Jesus Christ saying that and I recorded it. 

It cannot be.

Isaiah sets the record straight. 

And his record is for Isaiah 53.4  comes to pass after the chastisement and the punishment of stripes took place and when "he pour his soul unto death", and his glorious raising from the dead.

He dies alone, but he raised together with those he healed from the bite of the serpent whom he found in the place of the dead. 

"O death where is your sting?".

 

[Your closest friendnt]

On 2/23/2021 at 1:30 AM, Paul James said:

Okay. I can go along with that.  What I don't go along with is the notion that the Isaiah reference refers to salvation exclusively.

It is interesting to note that there were physical disabilities that Jesus treated as if they were demons.  The woman bent over whom Jesus said that Satan had oppressed her for the last 18 years, and casting a deaf and dumb spirit out of a man, and another child who exhibited epilepsy symptoms whom had a demon cast out resulting in a total healing.  Also, there are spirits of infirmity that cause sicknesses where the doctors cannot diagnose the cause.  Also, it has been known that African witch doctors have put curses on people who have become sick and died.

So, there is a blurring of the demarcation between a sickness caused by medical issues and a sickness caused by demonic oppression.  So, in that sense, I agree with your interpretation of Isaiah 53:4-5 covering sickness and disability caused by physical and spiritual origins. 

In Mathew 8: 16,17, and not only that day people were healed from phycical ailments. BUT NON WAS HEALED FROM THE STING OF DEATH.

[Your closest friendnt]

I rest my case.

 

[Diaste]

On 2/22/2021 at 5:35 PM, Paul James said:

In Matthew 8:16-17 Jesus Himself contradicts you by saying that Isaiah 53:4 is fulfilled by His healing of physical sicknesses.

Jesus didn't say that. 

"This was to fulfill what was spoken through the prophet Isaiah: “He took on our infirmities and carried our diseases."

Matthew recorded this. Maybe Jesus said it later to Matthew or possibly Matthew concluded this was the interpretation. Maybe there is another scripture where Jesus is quoted saying this but it's not proven through in Matt 8 it was the words of Jesus.

Not saying this isn't the fulfillment, just to be clear.

[Diaste]

On 2/19/2021 at 3:05 PM, Whyme said:

This topic isn't about a spiritual gift but a certain scripture. The reason I post it here is because folks who believe in gifts use this scripture often. Its my belief that this scripture is misunderstood and I would like a friendly discussion on it. I believe Isaiah 53 isn't about physical healing but spiritual instead. Think about it, if sinners were physicaly sick we would all be phicically sick with disease but this isn't the case. We are all spiritually sick however. This Isaiah sripture is for us all too. We are all spiritually sick without Jesus to heal our spiritual man. Jesus said a sick man needs a doctor, and he was referring to spiritual sickness not physical and so is Isaiah (Mark 2:17)

I would say it's both but the idea is limited.  Jesus is healing all creation, reconciling all to the Father. The imagery is beyond mere healing, though that's important and quite obviously true, as it's the spirit realm accessible to all should they decide and it's for each person, not just believers.

It's the supremacy of Christ in all things in view in Isa 53. The acts of Christ as God incarnate in human form is the proof of that supreme lordship. 

[Whyme]

 

Isn't it odd that Isaiah talks about sin throughout chapter 53 but then randomly mentions healing? Its as if the healing is spiritual because not all sinners get sick, do they? 

 

    stricken by him, and afflicted.^(M)
5 But he was pierced^(N) for our transgressions,^(O)
    he was crushed^(P) for our iniquities;
the punishment^(Q) that brought us peace^(R) was on him,
    and by his wounds^(S) we are healed.^(T)
 

[Whyme]

15 minutes ago, Diaste said:

I would say it's both but the idea is limited.  Jesus is healing all creation, reconciling all to the Father. The imagery is beyond mere healing, though that's important and quite obviously true, as it's the spirit realm accessible to all should they decide and it's for each person, not just believers.

It's the supremacy of Christ in all things in view in Isa 53. The acts of Christ as God incarnate in human form is the proof of that supreme lordship. 

Thank you. 

[Frits]

1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said:

In Mathew 8: 16,17, and not only that day people were healed from phycical ailments. BUT NON WAS HEALED FROM THE STING OF DEATH.

Hi brother Ycf,

It is frequently stated in the Gospels that the Lord Jesus healed all sickness and all disease, without any restrictions. In Acts, Jesus' work is described as follows:

Han 10:38 KJV How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

So then all who were brought sick to the Lord Jesus were healed by Him.
All these healings say nothing about death!
But the Lord Jesus himself makes a very clear statement about this:

Joh 5:25 KJV Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

In other words, those who hear and receive the words of the Gospel of the Lord Jesus come alive at that moment!

The apostles refer to these words of the Master, including Paul:

Efe 5:14 KJV Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.

But also John:

1Jn 3:14 KJV We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.

God bless.

[Justin Adams]

25 minutes ago, Jacob75 said:

No "Pentecostal" can replicate anything in Acts ch. 2.  Not one thing.

I have witnessed healings and a very sobering exorcism. Very real. Actual.

Sadly, the church today appears to have unbelievers present that often mock the spiritual gifts.

Unbelief is an insidious thing.

John 14:12

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.”

Edited February 26, 2021 by Justin Adams