The saints (wise virgins) shall be snatched to the cloud means Jesus has not returned yet.

[R. Hartono]

11 hours ago, seeking the lost said:

Jesus taught in the parable of the wheat and the tares that the tares are gathered out first and burned.  How do you reconcile the parables that seem to indicate that the saints remain after the unrighteous are taken out?  

Matt 3:12 His winnowing fork is in His hands and He will clean His threshing floor, gathering the wheat into His barn n burning up the chaff.....

Every where in agriculture practice of the world, the crop is gathered first n then the chaff is burnt up in the field otherwise u will also destroy the crop.

Luke21:34 Do not let the day catch you unaware 

The foolish virgins are the example who were caught unaware, not the wise virgins.

Edited March 19, 2021 by R. Hartono

[Retrobyter]

7 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Which is it?

It's BOTH! Both are true; one just has to follow the time sequence: First, Yeshua` died. In reaction to His death, several things occurred. Look at it again:

Matthew 27:

50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. 51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; 52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

1) the veil in the Temple was ripped in two from the top to the bottom
2) the earth quaked
3) the rocks broke in the violence of the quake
4) the tombs were opened when the rocks broke
5) many bodies of the saints which slept arose

HOWEVER, verse 53 is set off with a Greek "semicolon," a single dot, like a period, only halfway up the letter height, not at the bottom of the letter. In Greek, it's not a FULL STOP, like the period, but it is a CHANGE, a PARTIAL STOP.

So, AFTER His resurrection,

6) those saints left the tombs
7) the saints went into the holy city (Jerusalem), and
8) the saints appeared to many people.

And, that's as much as we know about them! No more is said about them, and we are not told their fate. So, anything more than that we might believe about them is simply conjecture.

7 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Who closed the graves back up once they were opened?  Would seem that PASSING THROUGH DEATH TO LIFE would require they stay that way.  

Oh, please, think practically! Once opened and unoccupied, they were available for the next deaths! They were REUSED! 

Regarding the saints themselves, their resurrection was similar to that of Eleazar ("Lazarus"), Yeshua`s friend. And, this is what we read about him:

John 12:1-11 (KJV)

1 Then Jesus six days before the passover came to Bethany, where Lazarus was which had been dead, whom he raised from the dead. 2 There they made him a supper; and Martha served: but Lazarus was one of them that sat at the table with him. 3 Then took Mary a pound of ointment of spikenard, very costly, and anointed the feet of Jesus, and wiped his feet with her hair: and the house was filled with the odour of the ointment. 4 Then saith one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, Simon's son, which should betray him, 

5"Why was not this ointment sold for three hundred pence, and given to the poor?"

6 This he said, not that he cared for the poor; but because he was a thief, and had the bag, and bare what was put therein. 7 Then said Jesus,

"Let her alone: against the day of my burying hath she kept this. 8 For the poor always ye have with you; but me ye have not always."

9 Much people of the Jews therefore knew that he was there: and they came not for Jesus' sake only, but that they might see Lazarus also, whom he had raised from the dead. 10 But the chief priests consulted (plotted) that they might put Lazarus also to death; 11 Because that by reason of him many of the Jews went away, and believed on Jesus.

So, Eleazar could DIE, again, and probably did die again, whether at the hand of these Sons of Belial, or from natural causes!

7 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Ephesians 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.

Ephesians 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

Ephesians 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

Perhaps you missed my explanation for this passage of Scripture, but the KEY is to go back to where this quote in Ephesians 4:8 is found in previous Scripture:

Psalm 68:1-35 (KJV)

1 {To the chief Musician, A Psalm or Song of David.}

Let God arise, let his enemies be scattered: let them also that hate him flee before him.
2 As smoke is driven away, so drive them away: as wax melteth before the fire, so let the wicked perish at the presence of God.
3 But let the righteous be glad; let them rejoice before God: yea, let them exceedingly rejoice.
4 Sing unto God, sing praises to his name: extol him that rideth upon the heavens by his name JAH, and rejoice before him.
5 A father of the fatherless, and a judge of the widows, is God in his holy habitation.
6 God setteth the solitary in families: he bringeth out those which are bound with chains: but the rebellious dwell in a dry land.
7 O God, when thou wentest forth before thy people, when thou didst march through the wilderness; Selah:

8 The earth shook, the heavens also dropped at the presence of God: even Sinai itself was moved at the presence of God, the God of Israel.
9 Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful rain, whereby thou didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was weary.
10 Thy congregation hath dwelt therein: thou, O God, hast prepared of thy goodness for the poor.
11 The Lord gave the word: great was the company of those that published it.
12 Kings of armies did flee apace: and she that tarried at home divided the spoil.
13 Though ye have lien among the pots, yet shall ye be as the wings of a dove covered with silver, and her feathers with yellow gold.
14 When the Almighty scattered kings in it, it was white as snow in Salmon.
15 The hill of God is as the hill of Bashan; an high hill as the hill of Bashan.
16 Why leap ye, ye high hills? this is the hill which God desireth to dwell in; yea, the LORD will dwell in it for ever.
17 The chariots of God are twenty thousand, even thousands of angels: the Lord is among them, as in Sinai, in the holy place.
18 THOU HAST ASCENDED ON HIGH, THOU HAST LED CAPTIVITY CAPTIVE: THOU HAST RECEIVED GIFTS FOR MEN; yea, for the rebellious also, that the LORD God might dwell among them.
19 Blessed be the Lord, who daily loadeth us with benefits, even the God of our salvation. Selah.

20 He that is our God is the God of salvation (deliverance; rescue); and unto GOD the Lord belong the issues from death.
21 But God shall wound the head of his enemies, and the hairy scalp of such an one as goeth on still in his trespasses.
22 The Lord said, I will bring again from Bashan, I will bring my people again from the depths of the sea:
23 That thy foot may be dipped in the blood of thine enemies, and the tongue of thy dogs in the same.
24 They have seen thy goings, O God; even the goings of my God, my King, in the sanctuary.
25 The singers went before, the players on instruments followed after; among them were the damsels playing with timbrels.
26 Bless ye God in the congregations, even the Lord, from the fountain of Israel.
27 There is little Benjamin with their ruler, the princes of Judah and their council, the princes of Zebulun, and the princes of Naphtali.
28 Thy God hath commanded thy strength: strengthen, O God, that which thou hast wrought for us.
29 Because of thy temple at Jerusalem shall kings bring presents unto thee.
30 Rebuke the company of spearmen, the multitude of the bulls, with the calves of the people, till every one submit himself with pieces of silver: scatter thou the people that delight in war.
31 Princes shall come out of Egypt; Ethiopia shall soon stretch out her hands unto God.
32 Sing unto God, ye kingdoms of the earth; O sing praises unto the Lord; Selah:

33 To him that rideth upon the heavens of heavens, which were of old; lo, he doth send out his voice, and that a mighty voice.
34 Ascribe ye strength unto God: his excellency is over Israel, and his strength is in the clouds.
35 O God, thou art terrible out of thy holy places: the God of Israel is he that giveth strength and power unto his people. Blessed be God.

The contextual clues say that this was when YAH God led the children of Israel out of Egypt! THAT'S when He "led captivity captive!"

Furthermore, Ephesians 4:9 is worded wrongly. It shouldn't be worded "the lower parts OF the earth"; it should have been written "the lower parts, the earth." the "earth" IS the "lower parts!"

 

7 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

1Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

1Peter 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;


I don't need more on 'how you believe' on this subject later.  I UNDERSTAND we do not SEE the same.  

Which, of course, are those who were resurrected at the time of His death, still staying in their open tombs until the Messiah Yeshua` was raised from the grave!

If you don't need to see more, then why are you persisting to deny the possibility that I MAY BE RIGHT and that what I present has enough merit for one to consider accepting?

7 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

John 11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

We go to be with Him where He is and he is at the right hand of the Father.  

You want to keep/go back to your decaying corruptible body. 
I am looking forward to getting rid of it forever.  

AH! But, GOD DOESN'T LOSE WHEN IT COMES TO HIS PHYSICAL CREATION, EITHER!

We are told time and time again in Scripture that it will be THESE bodies that are raised to new life, transformed like YESHUA`S glorified body!

Just as the earth and the things on the earth "groaneth together!"

Romans 8:10- (KJV)

10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken (bring back to life) your MORTAL bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. (NOTICE HERE: He did not say WHEN, and he most CERTAINLY did not say "immediately after death!") 14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. 15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. 19 For the earnest expectation (Greek: apokaradokia = "stretched-out expectation") of the creature WAITETH for the MANIFESTATION (Greek: apokalupsin = "unveiling; uncovering; revealing") of the sons of God. 20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope (Greek: elpidi = confidence; expectation; anticipation), 21 BECAUSE THE CREATURE ITSELF ALSO SHALL BE DELIVERED FROM THE BONDAGE OF CORRUPTION INTO THE GLORIOUS LIBERTY OF THE CHILDREN OF GOD. 22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the ADOPTION, to wit, THE REDEMPTION OF OUR BODY. 24 For we are saved (rescued) by hope (anticipation): but hope (anticipation) that is seen (realized) is not hope (anticipation): for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? (why does he still anticipate it?) 25 But if we hope for that we see not, THEN DO WE WITH PATIENCE WAIT FOR IT.

[Retrobyter]

20 hours ago, seeking the lost said:

The parable of the virgins does not indicate that anybody is taken up or changed.  There was a separation of foolish and wise.  The foolish were on one side and the wise on the other.  The foolish are on the left out side of the door that they are knocking on.

Jesus taught in the parable of the wheat and the tares that the tares are gathered out first and burned.  How do you reconcile the parables that seem to indicate that the saints remain after the unrighteous are taken out?  

Shalom, seeking the lost.

It's important to understand the PLACEMENT IN TIME of the parable of the wheat and the tares (look-alike weeds). This parable starts with ...

Matthew 13:24-25 (KJV)

24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: 25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.

This is the Kingdom from the sky! This comes with the King when He returns:

Luke 19:11-15ff (KJV)

11 And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear. 12 He said therefore,

"A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return. 13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, 'Occupy till I come.' 14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, 'We will not have this man to reign over us!' 

15 "And it came to pass, that WHEN HE WAS RETURNED, HAVING RECEIVED THE KINGDOM, THEN HE COMMANDED these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading...."

In explanation of this parable of the wheat and the tares, Yeshua` said this:

Matthew 13:36-43 (KJV)

36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying,

"Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field."

37 He answered and said unto them,

(ELEMENTS OF THE PARABLE)
"He that soweth the good seed is (=) the Son of man; 
38 The field is (=) the world;
the good seed are (=) the children of the kingdom; but ...
the tares are (=) the children of the wicked one; 
39 The enemy that sowed them is (=) the devil;
the harvest is (=) the end of the world (age); and ...
the reapers are (=) the angels. 
(EXPLANATION)
40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world (age). 41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather OUT OF HIS (THE MESSIAH'S) KINGDOM all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire (the Lake of Fire): there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun IN THE KINGDOM OF THEIR FATHER. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear."

So, according to Yeshua` Himself, this is about the MILLENNIUM PRIOR TO THE COMING OF THE NEW JERUSALEM! This Millennium or a "Thousand Years" is yet in the future. This parable is often mistakenly said to be about the "now," but it's for the FUTURE.

[DeighAnn]

13 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

And, that's as much as we know about them! No more is said about them, and we are not told their fate. So, anything more than that we might believe about them is simply conjecture.

You do realize that God uses Laws, correct?  Either the dead rise or they don't.  If the dead don't rise, then Christ hasn't EITHER.  

 

15 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

Oh, please, think practically! Once opened and unoccupied, they were available for the next deaths! They were REUSED! 

Again, the flesh CARCASS goes into the ground.  The flesh carcass decays and goes back to dust, from which it came.  It has no spirit, no soul, no life, no memory, it knows nothing, never will, it has served it purpose, and WE go back to God.  

Could it have been explained any clearer than here?
 

Luke 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

Luke 16:23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

Luke 16:24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

Luke 16:25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

Luke 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

 

27 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

The contextual clues say that this was when YAH God led the children of Israel out of Egypt! THAT'S when He "led captivity captive!"

So you can see it there,  but no where else?  

 

31 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

If you don't need to see more, then why are you persisting to deny the possibility that I MAY BE RIGHT and that what I present has enough merit for one to consider accepting?

No,

Because  what GOD tells us about HIMSELF 

Mark 12:24 And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?

Mark 12:25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.

Mark 12:26 And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?

Mark 12:27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
 

36 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken (bring back to life) your MORTAL bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

BUT THIS IS WHILE WE ARE ALIVE, IN THE DEAD FLESH BEFORE FAITH

LET THE DEAD BURY THE DEAD, would be spoken of one who had not been SAVED.  

But once SAVED it would have to read let the LIVE bury the dead.  

Do you think there is only ONE kind of resurrection?  

Read on with what you quoted 18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. 


You do realize that we BOTH believe we go to heaven, you just don't think it is with a body

(But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body)


You go to heaven in a mist, I go to heaven in a body. 
You are all 'thought?'  I am body and soul and spirit.

I return with God as one in His army, you are brought back as a mist and go find your decaying flesh to have God 'make' it new again?  IDK. 

What about those who were blown to bits in space?  Or vaporized.  Or cremated?  or eaten by animals.  Or died 6000 years ago and became part of the soil that raised up a stalk of corn that was eaten by a pregnant woman, WHO would get to claim that 'body'?  

DOESN'T it all seem so far fetched and COMPLICATED compared with we have 2 bodies, one for heaven and one for earth and when you leave the flesh behind it isn't as a mist but as a 'being' LIKE an angel.  WOulDn't that REALLY make 

 

Genesis 28:12 And he dreamed, and behold a ladder set up on the earth, and the top of it reached to heaven: and behold the angels of God ascending and descending on it.

Genesis 28:13 And, behold, the LORD stood above it, and said, I am the LORD God of Abraham thy father, and the God of Isaac: the land whereon thou liest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed;
 

John 1:49 Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.

John 1:50 Jesus answered and said unto him, Because I said unto thee, I saw thee under the fig tree, believest thou? thou shalt see greater things than these.

John 1:51 And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man.

[Retrobyter]

On 3/17/2021 at 2:24 PM, DeighAnn said:

Christ died and went to the Father.  I die and go to the Father.  I HAVE attained the resurrection of the dead THROUGH CHRIST if I ABIDE IN HIM.  

1 Thessalonians 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

1 Thessalonians 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

Why make it so complicated?  Remember WHO will understand what is written?  Is it 'the learned'?  

Shalom, DeighAnn.

Sorry, but you're skipping a step:

Yeshua` the Messiah died, was RESURRECTED, and went to the Father. You will die, but you must WAIT until the Messiah returns before you will be resurrected, and THEN you can go to the Father, who will be reigning in Israel through His Messiah for the next 1,000 years.

It's not complicated at all. You just don't want to read it that way.

[DeighAnn]

Ephesians 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

Ephesians 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Ephesians 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

Ephesians 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

[DeighAnn]

2 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

Yeshua` the Messiah died, was RESURRECTED, and went to the Father. You will die, but you must WAIT until the Messiah returns before you will be resurrected, and THEN you can go to the Father, who will be reigning in Israel through His Messiah for the next 1,000 years.

It's not complicated at all. You just don't want to read it that way.

NO, it is not complicated at all. AND I am not going to read it in a fashion that takes the very simple and turns it into a complicated process going from a body to no body back to a body WHEN GOD clearly states 

 

 How are the dead raised up?


and with what body do they come?


 

Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

 And that which thou sowest,

thou sowest not that body that shall be, 



THE FLESH IS JUST THE SEED

DOES GOD say 'we will be without a body'?  

But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

NOT his own spirit and soul, but body, the house of the soul and spirit of each of us.

1 Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

1 Corinthians 15:24 Then cometh the end, when HE shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when HE shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

1 Corinthians 15:25 For HE must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

1 Corinthians 15:27 For HE hath put all things under his feet. But when HE saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

1 Corinthians 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto HIM, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto HIM that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

 

Revelation 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Revelation 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and Him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[seeking the lost]

22 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

Matt 3:12 His winnowing fork is in His hands and He will clean His threshing floor, gathering the wheat into His barn n burning up the chaff.....

Every where in agriculture practice of the world, the crop is gathered first n then the chaff is burnt up in the field otherwise u will also destroy the crop.

Luke21:34 Do not let the day catch you unaware 

The foolish virgins are the example who were caught unaware, not the wise virgins.

That is logical but that is not what the parable says.  It clearly says that the tares are gathered out and burned first.

[seeking the lost]

11 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, seeking the lost.

It's important to understand the PLACEMENT IN TIME of the parable of the wheat and the tares (look-alike weeds). This parable starts with ...

Matthew 13:24-25 (KJV)

24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: 25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.

This is the Kingdom from the sky! This comes with the King when He returns:

Luke 19:11-15ff (KJV)

11 And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear. 12 He said therefore,

"A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return. 13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, 'Occupy till I come.' 14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, 'We will not have this man to reign over us!' 

15 "And it came to pass, that WHEN HE WAS RETURNED, HAVING RECEIVED THE KINGDOM, THEN HE COMMANDED these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading...."

In explanation of this parable of the wheat and the tares, Yeshua` said this:

Matthew 13:36-43 (KJV)

36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying,

"Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field."

37 He answered and said unto them,

(ELEMENTS OF THE PARABLE)
"He that soweth the good seed is (=) the Son of man; 
38 The field is (=) the world;
the good seed are (=) the children of the kingdom; but ...
the tares are (=) the children of the wicked one; 
39 The enemy that sowed them is (=) the devil;
the harvest is (=) the end of the world (age); and ...
the reapers are (=) the angels. 
(EXPLANATION)
40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world (age). 41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather OUT OF HIS (THE MESSIAH'S) KINGDOM all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire (the Lake of Fire): there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun IN THE KINGDOM OF THEIR FATHER. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear."

So, according to Yeshua` Himself, this is about the MILLENNIUM PRIOR TO THE COMING OF THE NEW JERUSALEM! This Millennium or a "Thousand Years" is yet in the future. This parable is often mistakenly said to be about the "now," but it's for the FUTURE.

I agree that this is about the end.  Does it not say that the harvest is the end of the world?

[Retrobyter]

On 3/17/2021 at 2:29 PM, DeighAnn said:

{Retrobyter had said,

You're assuming God is bringing them FROM HEAVEN with the Messiah; however, God is really bringing them FROM THEIR GRAVES to join the Messiah IN THE SKIES and THEN travel "with the Messiah."}

Says who?  THAT isn't what is written.  OR IS IT?  WHERE is that WRITTEN. 

WHERE ARE ALL YOUR GREEK DEFINITIONS?  

Shalom, DeighAnn.

It IS what is written! Where is that? I've already quoted it!

Romans 8:11 (KJV)

11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your MORTAL bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Do you need Greek definitions? IF they make a difference in your beliefs, then I can provide them, but they take time to write out and, quite frankly, you don't read them even if I include them! But, we'll try:

Pros Roomaious 8:11

11 Ei de to Pneuma tou egeirantos ton Ieesoun ek nekroon oikei en humin, ho egeiras Christon ek nekroon zoo-opoieesei kai ta thneeta soomata humoon dia tou enoikountos autou pneu matos en humin. 

11 Ei = 11 If
de = but
to = the
Pneuma = Spirit
tou = of-the-[One]
egeirantos = having-raised-up
ton = the
Ieesoun = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
ek = out/from
nekroon = dead-[ones]
oikei = dwell
en = in
humin, = you (plural),
ho = the-[One}
egeiras = having-raised-up
Christon = Messiah ("Christ")
ek = out/from
nekroon = dead-[ones]
zoo-opoieesei = shall-make-alive
kai = and/also
ta = the
THNEETA = MORTAL
soomata = bodies
humoon = of-you (plural)
dia = through
tou = the
enoikountos = in-dwelling
autou = of-Him/His
pneumatos = Spirit
en = in
humin. = you (plural). 

This next passage I didn't need to quote; it's so commonly used here (even if wrongly applied):

1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 (KJV)

13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him (Jesus). (How?) 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent (Greek: ou mee fthasoomen = "not [positively] not [negatively] we-shall-precede" = "we ... shall not in any way precede") them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord (Yeshua`) himself shall descend (Greek: katabeesetai = "shall-come-down/shall-descend" [3rd person, SINGULAR]) from heaven (Greek: ap' ouranou = "away-from [the]-sky") with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first (Greek: anasteesontai prooton = "they-will-rise [3rd person, PLURAL] first"): 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up (Greek: harpageesometha = "we-shall-be-snatched-away" [1st person, plural]) together WITH THEM in the clouds (Greek: en nefelais = "in clouds"), to meet the Lord (Yeshua`) in the air (Greek: eis aera = "into [the]-air"): and so (Greek: houtoos = "in this way") shall we ever be with the Lord (Yeshua`).

So, Yeshua` comes down from the sky ALONE and picks up the sleeping ones who are His and THEY rise first! Then, THOSE who are alive and remain are snatched away in the clouds for the meeting with the Lord into the air, and WE remain with Him from that time on.

2 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Ephesians 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

Ephesians 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Ephesians 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

Ephesians 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

How I do wish you would quote the WHOLE passage and not just as much as you THINK agrees with your theological viewpoint.

Ephesians 1:3-14 (KJV)

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: 4. According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5 Having PREDESTINATED US UNTO THE ADOPTION OF CHILDREN by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7 IN WHOM WE HAVE REDEMPTION through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; 8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; 9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: 11 In whom also WE HAVE OBTAINED AN INHERITANCE, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: 12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. 13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, YE WERE SEALED WITH THAT HOLY SPIRIT OF PROMISE, 14 WHICH IS THE EARNEST (DOWNPAYMENT) OF OUR INHERITANCE UNTIL THE REDEMPTION OF THE PURCHASED POSSESSION, unto the praise of his glory.

Yes, His promise to us is a DONE-DEAL! However, it will still TAKE TIME to realize fully!

Remember: It was the SAME MAN (Paul) with the SAME WORDS who said,

Romans 8:18-25 (KJV)

18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. 19 For the earnest expectation of the creature WAITETH FOR THE MANIFESTATION OF THE SONS OF GOD. 20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, 21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, EVEN WE OURSELVES GROAN WITHIN OURSELVES, WAITING FOR THE ADOPTION, TO WIT, THE REDEMPTION OF OUR BODY. 24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? 25 But if we hope (have expection; anticipate) for that we see not, THEN DO WE WITH PATIENCE WAIT FOR IT.