Do We Still Have A Sin Nature

[Peterlag]

1 hour ago, OneLight said:

If someone quotes your post, or indicates you with the @ sign, you can certainly expect they are addressing you, but when neither happens, there's no reason to assume someone is replying to you.  Neither happened when wiggles was reply to whome, so you would not of been notified.  You were notified about my reply to you because I quoted your post.  Hope this helps.

Okay I see what happened. When I clicked on the notice the software took me to you and "Who me" was the post ahead of yours who quoted me. I just looked at what the software put in front of me and did not scroll up to see it was the one before you where the software placed me when I clicked on it.

[Peterlag]

50 minutes ago, Wayne222 said:

Are you saying a believer does not needto confess sin ?

I'm saying a believer cannot sin. Do you want a few verses on that?

[Peterlag]

4 hours ago, Who me said:

Yet 1 John  constantly uses ' we ' it does not distinguish between saved and unsaved, it is only those who would split hairs to prove umbilical ideas who do this.

Both Paul and John wrote letters addressing Christians.

I never replied to this because I replied to @Waggles by mistake. We can't have Scripture saying we cannot sin because we are born again a bunch of times and then the same Scripture saying we have sin all the time and must confess.

[Peterlag]

Romans 6
How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

For he that is dead is freed from sin.

he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin,

For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law,

Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

being made free from sin, and become servants to God,

1 John 3 & 5
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not.

[Riverwalker]

2 hours ago, Peterlag said:

Nobody can believe anybody if we are going to say whenever we don't agree or understand another that it is not the truth but rather his own views. We can disagree or see something different from another. But we dare not say your thoughts are only your own views and mine are the truth of God's Word. Because if we do... then nobody can believe anybody.

Our thoughts and intepretations are flawed and incomplete, and if one is willing to sell out the word of God, to bolster their favored belief. That is a problem.

[Peterlag]

37 minutes ago, Riverwalker said:

Our thoughts and intepretations are flawed and incomplete, and if one is willing to sell out the word of God, to bolster their favored belief. That is a problem.

Any good Apostle or Prophet that came with any new doctrine including Jesus was told that there thoughts were their interpretations and were flawed because they taught what was not the norm of their times.

[Mike Mclees]

11 hours ago, Wayne222 said:

Are you saying a believer does not needto confess sin ?

 

11 hours ago, Wayne222 said:

Are you saying a believer does not needto confess sin ?

Mike -Sorry to jump in but as long a the nature is in the world even Christion's can fall. To not take these sins to the is a great error that could hurt other believers. All sin need to be brought before the Lord or you are trying to hide something. Psalm 139 would be a good scripture to read. Also psalm 51 is Davids prayer for Gods forgiveness.

[Starise]

11 hours ago, Peterlag said:

Romans 6
How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

For he that is dead is freed from sin.

he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin,

For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law,

Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

being made free from sin, and become servants to God,

1 John 3 & 5
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not.

@Peterlag Look at the entire context of Romans 6. See verses immediately preceding. 

Let's look at the whole chapter-

[Rom 6:1-23 ESV] 1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life. 5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6 We know that our old self was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7 For one who has died has been set free from sin. 8 Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9 We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10 For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11 So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus. 12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13 Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace. 15 What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! 16 Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17 But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed, 18 and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness. 19 I am speaking in human terms, because of your natural limitations. For just as you once presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness leading to sanctification. 20 For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. 21 But what fruit were you getting at that time from the things of which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death. 22 But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the fruit you get leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life. 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

@Peterlag In looking at the entire associated passage we can see several things.

Paul is addressing an entire sequence. He addresses the end result first. What is the end result for all Christians? The eventual permanent release from the old man of sin. All who remain alive on this earth HAVE NOT yet reached this pinnacle of development.

In verse 4 baptism signifies our physical death and rebirth as a new creature. We are dying to the old man and alive to the new man. Unsaved men are spiritually dead permanently. The Christian who receives the Spirit of God has begun a journey that ends in total death and rebirth to a being of a different composition that knows no sin or inclinations to it. Eternal life is more than just living forever, it's a new improved state of being.

As Christians we are to be taking action here on this earth towards our eventual state. We are to look at ourselves and THINK of ourselves as if we are already redeemed and do our best to act accordingly. Here on this earth sin is still a part of who we are and a very real CHOICE. The more we follow the spirit and allow God to change us, the more we are like Christ yet we will have the sinful man as part of us UNTIL WE DIE. We can make the CHOICE to deny the sinful man or deny our sinful nature, or we can go against God's will and follow it. While alive on earth we will always have a CHOICE to either follow the spirit or to sin.

Very much the same as a tamed dog can bite you if you sneak up on him and pull his tail, a Christian can sin. To say we are incapable of sin is denial plain and simple.

To cap it off briefly-

Paul was showing the final eventual state of believers.

Paul was encouraging believers to think and live like the new creations we will eventually be. By doing this we take our eyes off of the old sinful nature and dwell on the things that bring life instead.

 

[Guest clancy]

12 hours ago, Peterlag said:

I'm saying a believer cannot sin. Do you want a few verses on that?

Peter,I would very much like to see those verses, where it specifically states ,that a believer cannot sin...

[Billiards Ball]

On 3/9/2021 at 5:58 PM, Peterlag said:

I see the "sin nature" as something that existed before Jesus Christ destroyed it when the spirit of Christ came within the believer. This spirit is indeed a life form that is in all Christians and it seems to me one cannot understand and therefore function or be in the spirit if our old nature (which is dead) thinks in it's unrenewed mind that it suppose to be fighting against the new nature. Paul wrote in Galatians 2:20, "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me:" That's what I'm talking about. I now understand being in Christ is being in the spirit and neither of them (in Christ or in the spirit) has anything to do with the darn flesh. It now seems perfectly clear to walk in the spirit is the same as putting on the Lord Jesus Christ.

And so in my mind the 4 verses below fit perfectly. Every single person I know has told me about Romans 7 when I tell them I do not believe Paul taught about a "sin nature" for the Christian. What Paul talks about in the seventh chapter of Romans is what occurs to the believer who still thinks the Law applies to them. They end up spiritually dying by the commandment and realize that the commandment does not produce life. The war is with their flesh because they are still believing the Law has power over them. In the eighth chapter of Romans is where it explains how we overcome this whole issue by living in the spirit and being dead to the Law. We cannot live by faith in what Christ has done for us and still think our obedience to written laws are necessary. To do so takes away from the perfect work of Christ and places salvation and righteousness back in our own hands.

Romans 6:2
How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Romans 6:6
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Galatians 5:16,18
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

The old man is destroyed, the flesh is at war with the Spirit, requiring refilling of the Spirit/wearing the Eph 6 armor, etc.