120 Ways to Celebrate Christmas!

[Greenie]

I would like to make a comment , in all my years of celebrating Christmas I never once thought I was celebrating nimrod or any other false gods. We always made it about jesus' birth and how it was the greatest gift to mankind. We read Luke ch.2 and pray and invite the Lord's presence into our day. We'd then eat breakfast as a family and afterwards open gifts, and spend the day with family.

 

Now on the other hand , the older I got the more I questioned things about Christmas. 

I always thought , if Jesus is King of the jews and followed Jewish traditions why don't we as Christians do the same?!? 

Also I have to admit that @Bawb shows some pretty good evidence on the topic and backs it up with scripture. When I ask the same kinda questions I get the same kinda responses he gets (although I don't believe as he does) it just strikes me as odd when asked to show scriptural proof about Christmas in the Bible,  you find none. The responses I seem to get when I ask people is the tap dance around scripture and more of their own interpretation. I've gone back and forth now for weeks about whether or not to celebrate Christmas as I have in the past or to shut it down completely. 

 

I have this year told my oldest that santa isn't real.. (I had to find that out for myself when I was young) and all the YouTube videos I watch on Christmas being a pagan holiday seem to make sense to me and alot of what bawb says seems to make sense to me as well. 

@Bawb I see your seed being planted and I take what you're saying into consideration. 

 

also on the other hand I do see the rebuttal scripture Roman 14:4 to be a good counterpoint to what you're saying. 

 

All in all I'm still learning and taking all scripture into prayer and pray that the holy spirit leads me into truth. 

 

Love you all , be blessed 

Greenie 

[appy]

11 hours ago, Greenie said:

I would like to make a comment , in all my years of celebrating Christmas I never once thought I was celebrating nimrod or any other false gods. 

 

11 hours ago, Greenie said:

We'd then eat breakfast as a family and afterwards open gifts, and spend the day with family.

(I quoted the above for discussion, nothing against you Greenie.)

Exactly Greenie !! When I was growing up, no unbelieving friends and relatives ever talked about pagan gods or even thought of the day as about pagan rituals. I was taught that it was a special day in which we spent time with family, relatives and friends exchanging gifts and having meals together. Kids played with toys and the adults spent the day talking about what was going on in their lives and how they were doing. Certainly NOTHING about pagan rituals.

Many, many unbelievers can fondly recall songs like “joy to the world” or “The first noel”. “what “child is this?” “Come all ye faithful” ”Hark the herald angels sing” “O Holy night” “Silent night”etc...

There is nothing evil about these songs, they are all about Christ and his coming. And that is exactly what we are thankful for... His birth. Salvation is available because Jesus came. Even atheists regard Christmas as a Christian holiday.

If I regard Christmas as a day in which I honor the Lord and am thankful for Jesus' coming, and what he means to me, why complain?

If the rituals and laws in the Old testament could bring salvation, then there would have been no need for Jesus to come and die on the cross for us.

Romans 14:5-7
5 One person regards a certain day above the others, while someone else considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 He who observes a special day does so to the Lord; he who eats does so to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. 7 For none of us lives to himself alone, and none of us dies to himself alone.…

Collosians 2:16
16 Therefore let no one judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a feast, a New Moon, or a Sabbath.

[Anne2]

On 12/21/2021 at 1:41 PM, Bawb said:

If I have seemed to be abrupt with you, I apologize. Please, do not confuse my urgency with anger or dislike in the matters I have posted. These things are extremely important. As the Hebrews (YeHoVah's chosen people) were severely judged for mixing worship, how much more will the "wild olive" branches suffer in judgement for doing the same things?

The old and the new are the same and for the same people as they always were for. "Gentiles" were ALWAYS allowed into this covenant, thus the "multitudes" coming out of Egypt. Again, as scripture has stated the difference is that it is written on our hearts. Also, here is a list of the "Old Testament" scriptures that were quoted in the "New Testament". Too many people (not necessarily meaning you) believe that the New Testament abolished the Old Testament. This website should pretty much clear that misconception up.

https://www.bible.ca/manuscripts/List-of-300-Old-Testament-passage-quotes-in-New-Testament-Septuagint-Codex-Vaticanus-LXX-Masoretic-MT-Jewish-Tanakh-Bible.htm

Malachi 3:6 - “For I am the YeHoVah, I do not change; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.”.

John 1:1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:2  He was in the beginning with God.
John 1:3  All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

I don't believe in the huge chasm people have placed between the 2 Testaments. The "New Testament" is witnessed documentation of the fulfillment of the "Old Testament" prophesies concerning Yeshua.

John 5:46-47 - 46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe my words?”

The Bible tells us the end from the beginning. This can also be shown with a study of the word Bereshith.  An example can be found in numerous places. This is but one: https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/bereshit-secret-in-bereshit/

Shalom...

What do you mean Gentiles were allowed into the covenant? No uncircumcised could even eat of Passover, inherit the land apart from being circumcised? (become a jew).

 

[Anne2]

On 12/21/2021 at 1:41 PM, Bawb said:

If I have seemed to be abrupt with you, I apologize. Please, do not confuse my urgency with anger or dislike in the matters I have posted. These things are extremely important. As the Hebrews (YeHoVah's chosen people) were severely judged for mixing worship, how much more will the "wild olive" branches suffer in judgement for doing the same things?

The old and the new are the same and for the same people as they always were for. "Gentiles" were ALWAYS allowed into this covenant, thus the "multitudes" coming out of Egypt. Again, as scripture has stated the difference is that it is written on our hearts. Also, here is a list of the "Old Testament" scriptures that were quoted in the "New Testament". Too many people (not necessarily meaning you) believe that the New Testament abolished the Old Testament. This website should pretty much clear that misconception up.

https://www.bible.ca/manuscripts/List-of-300-Old-Testament-passage-quotes-in-New-Testament-Septuagint-Codex-Vaticanus-LXX-Masoretic-MT-Jewish-Tanakh-Bible.htm

Malachi 3:6 - “For I am the YeHoVah, I do not change; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.”.

John 1:1  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:2  He was in the beginning with God.
John 1:3  All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

I don't believe in the huge chasm people have placed between the 2 Testaments. The "New Testament" is witnessed documentation of the fulfillment of the "Old Testament" prophesies concerning Yeshua.

John 5:46-47 - 46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe my words?”

The Bible tells us the end from the beginning. This can also be shown with a study of the word Bereshith.  An example can be found in numerous places. This is but one: https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/bereshit-secret-in-bereshit/

Shalom...[/quote]

What do you mean Gentiles were allowed into the covenant? No uncircumcised could even eat of Passover, inherit the land apart from being circumcised? (become a jew).

 

[Bawb]

On 12/20/2021 at 6:15 PM, R. Hartono said:

grafted into the olive tree means the church is spiritual Israel only.

Dont follow the red neck Amish.

Of course you know Col. 2:16 was speaking to Jew and Gentile Believers? A more apt possible translation: Let no pagan judge you in you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holy day, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days...

You take Sha'ul out of context...

Besides, this post is concerning the lie of Christ-Mass. Get back on point and stop the diversion...

 

[Bawb]

On 12/21/2021 at 9:41 PM, missmuffet said:

May I ask you again....do you celebrate birthdays?

Not relevant. I've answered this question countless times before. It has nothing to do with "celebrating" the wrong day with the abominated pagan ways.

[missmuffet]

4 minutes ago, Bawb said:

Not relevant. I've answered this question countless times before. It has nothing to do with "celebrating" the wrong day with the abominated pagan ways.

But you have not answered my question of if you celebrate birthdays. Do you have a problem with the question?

[Bawb]

On 12/21/2021 at 10:27 PM, appy said:

First of all, WCF is NOT a roman catholic site.  And neither do we endorse many of the roman catholic tenets. With that said,

It is one thing to correct people you (a collective you, no one here specifically)  know personally, and an entirely different situation to demand people you have never met in person do as you tell them to.  

Once a person has heard what is said, it is then up to that individual to decide what to do with the information. No amount of badgering is going to change anyone's mind.  Just as no one can change yours.   The people that already do not  observe Christmas do not need instruction and the people who want to observe the holiday are going to observe the holiday whether you LIKE IT OR NOT.  You are NOT them, and they are NOT you.  So it is still a good day.

Romans 14:4  (LB)
They are God’s servants, not yours. They are responsible to him, not to you. Let him tell them whether they are right or wrong. And God is able to make them do as they should.

Romans 14:4 (NIV)
 Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.

 

Keep reading in Romans... What you quote is in reference to food and fasting. If you read the entire verse, you will see that. You will find I am inline with the Scriptures...

1. Christians Must Judge - Scripture specifically instructs Christians to judge other Christians. In 1 Corinthians 5, Paul commands the church "not to associate with sexually immoral people," which to obey, requires making a judgment. He further writes, "Are you not to judge those inside (the church)? . . . 'Expel the wicked person from among you.'" So not only should Christians judge other believers, they should also discipline them based on those judgments.

Similarly, Jesus says in John 7:24, "Stop judging by mere appearances, but instead judge correctly." Clearly, Jesus expects us to judge, but simply wants us to judge correctly, using proper standards.

2. Don't Apply a Double-Standard - Those who quote Matthew 7:1 as evidence that Christians should never judge need to read the context of that verse. Yes, Jesus says, "Do not judge, or you too will be judged," but he goes on to say, "For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?"

In other words, don't apply a double-standard and judge someone for a sin you're equally, or even more guilty, of committing. Instead, Jesus says, "first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye." So the solution isn't to refrain from judging; it's to fix yourself so you can help fix others.

3. Judge Actions, not Motives -Christians get themselves in a heap of trouble when they try to judge other peoples' motives. First Kings 8:39 says God alone knows what's in every human heart. And Paul in 1 Corinthians 4:5 says we should refrain from judging someone else's heart, but allow God to do that at the appointed time: "He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of the heart. At that time each will receive their praise from God."

Christians need to confine their judgments to what they can objectively discern — peoples' actions. We may think we know what another person is thinking, but we need to temper these opinions with the truth of God's Word. He is omniscient; we are not.

4. Confine Judgements to Matters That Aren't Disputable - Though God has given us clear moral boundaries, He also has given us freedom within those boundaries. For example, Scripture clearly says that sex outside of marriage is wrong, but it doesn't say whether dating couples can kiss. I have good Christian friends who strongly advise against kissing before marriage. I have other Christian friends who think refraining from kissing is unnecessarily restrictive.

Regarding these so-called "disputable matters," Scripture says we should not judge each other, or treat each other contemptuously.

Paul writes in Romans 14, "One person's faith allows them to eat anything, but another, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them."

Extending grace in these circumstances is tough to do because we often feel very strongly about our personal convictions. But this is critical if we're to honor God and our brothers and sisters in Christian community.

5. Seek to Restore - The point of judging others is not to condemn them, but to restore them. Paul said we should discipline an immoral Christian "so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord."

Similarly, in Galatians 6:1, Paul writes, "(I)f someone is caught in a sin, you who live by the Spirit should restore that person gently."

But Paul warns against pride or comparison. "(W)atch yourselves, or you may also be tempted," he says and adds, "If anyone thinks they are something when they are not, they deceive themselves."

So when we make judgments, we must do so humbly. And we must do so with the intent of helping our brother or sister escape sin and the destruction it wreaks, not to elevate ourselves. Otherwise, we become like the Pharisees who tied up "heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people's shoulders," but were not "willing to lift a finger to move them." In everything, we must be motivated by love.

[Bawb]

11 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

But you have not answered my question of if you celebrate birthdays. Do you have a problem with the question?

No I don't celebrate them... Can you tell me why this is relevant to what I've stated?

[missmuffet]

54 minutes ago, Bawb said:

No I don't celebrate them... Can you tell me why this is relevant to what I've stated?

Are you JW?