False teachers

[Heleadethme]

2 hours ago, Rosie1jack2pauline3 said:

 

We need to have our minds renewed, that’s the Holy Spirit role, there maybe obstacles in the way, in the mind, but, if it’s the will of the Father, then the renewing of the mind can’t be stopped.....all in God’s timing.🙏

Its all about submitting our will over to the will of the Father, Jesus knows how to do that perfectly.

Yes, we just need to be willing.  Aye, there's the rub, often.  Lot's of things can be in the way of our willingness.   David prayed for a willing spirit.

But faith cometh by hearing, so hearing others speak the truth on an issue can be a catalyst to help us seek that willing spirit, and ask the Lord to tweek whatever we need tweeking on, as I find in my own life.

[JohnD]

On 1/7/2022 at 8:01 AM, Starise said:

Good Morning @JohnD

I appreciate these thoughts from the word. I had a couple of thoughts on what was written here. YES we are guided by the Spirit through the scriptures. STUDY. It is in seeking we find. Not in waiting for some kind of a revelation. I see it as a mutual relationship where we study and God reveals.

 

 I did not mean to intimate we just sit back and do nothing on anything. God wants us off our duffs and busy about life and serving him / spreading the Gospel.

2 Timothy 2:15 (AV)
15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Point I made was HOW do we study the scriptures??? According to this Rabbi or that theologian or the other pastor or the denominational platforms (traditions of man)... or by the Holy Spirit who wrote the Bible...  

 

[JohnD]

Just now, JohnD said:

 I did not mean to advocate we just sit back and do nothing on anything. God wants us off our duffs and busy about life and serving him / spreading the Gospel.

2 Timothy 2:15 (AV)
15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Point I made was HOW do we study the scriptures??? According to this Rabbi or that theologian or the other pastor or the denominational platforms (traditions of man)... or by the Holy Spirit who wrote the Bible...  

 

 

[JohnD]

On 1/7/2022 at 8:01 AM, Starise said:

I think some scripture WAS prophetic because several prophesies have been fulfilled already. I'm trying to understand why it is said all scripture is prophetic? Surely not all of the whole bible is prophetic unless you are looking at the lineage of the Lord throughout scripture.The OT surely is prophetic of what was to come. Much of the NT has been fulfilled prophetically, much of it is still yet to be fulfilled.

knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation.

 

Prophetic / prophesy... does not mean strictly [predictive] prophesy / prophetic. The root meaning is the same as profess. To speak. 

Prophet / professor

profess / prophesy

What determines if it is predictive or not is the message / profession itself. In the case of God's Word it can speak to (profess) the past the present or the future.

What 2 Peter 1:20-21 refers to "no portion of scripture (which is totally prophetic) is of any private or human interpretation. 

[JohnD]

On 1/7/2022 at 8:01 AM, Starise said:

We have loads of private and semi private interpretations of everything all over the place. They are 'private' in the sense that they are exclusive to certain denominations. To those denominations they aren't private. To much of the rest of christendom they are.

What this passage does indicate- Things should not be this way. We should all come away  with the same things making discussion on them unnecessary. 

Can you expand on why this is so?

Jesus prayed 33 times in the high priestly prayer (John 17) that the Church be as 1 as the Father and he are 1.

Private and semi private interpretations and doctrines formed by the will of man have produced schisms, splits, denominations, etc. Look around and see: is the Church 1 or many times many?

Jesus opposed the Sanhedrin who invented traditions based on their interpretation of the Law of Moses.

Mark 7:1–13 (AV)
1 Then came together unto him the Pharisees, and certain of the scribes, which came from Jerusalem.
2 And when they saw some of his disciples eat bread with defiled, that is to say, with unwashen, hands, they found fault.
3 For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders.
4 And when they come from the market, except they wash, they eat not. And many other things there be, which they have received to hold, as the washing of cups, and pots, brasen vessels, and of tables.
5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands?
6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

Have we done the same in the Church?

We pride ourselves on being somewhere in the neighborhood of a billion members worldwide... but Jesus said:

Matthew 7:13–14 (AV)
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Pivoting off of Mark 7:7... in vain do they worship me...

Matthew 7:21–23 (AV)
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

I am not saying people are unsaved. That's God's business. I am saying these passages should scare the heaven into us. And we should seek the Holy Spirit's guidance to point out are we actually on the narrow path of truth or the broad way...?

2Peter 1:20-21

Test the spirits (1 John 4:1 / 1 Thessalonians 5:21) to be sure it's the Holy Spirit

By the scriptures (Acts 17:11 / 2 Timothy 3:16-17)

Proverbs 25:2  / Deuteronomy 29:29

Isaiah 28:9-13

The keys to the Kingdom.

[Starise]

On 1/9/2022 at 11:33 AM, JohnD said:

Point I made was HOW do we study the scriptures??? According to this Rabbi or that theologian or the other pastor or the denominational platforms (traditions of man)... or by the Holy Spirit who wrote the Bible...  

 

I believe different people study and learn in different ways all led by the Holy Spirit if we are believers. One good point recently made about the bible pointed out that there is no ideal translation form the ancient languages to English. For this reason we need comparison study tools to get the correct grasp. Most of the time the translations we have are good enough to get the meanings, but sometimes they are not.

On 1/9/2022 at 11:40 AM, JohnD said:

Prophetic / prophesy... does not mean strictly [predictive] prophesy / prophetic. The root meaning is the same as profess. To speak. 

Prophet / professor

profess / prophesy

What determines if it is predictive or not is the message / profession itself. In the case of God's Word it can speak to (profess) the past the present or the future.

What 2 Peter 1:20-21 refers to "no portion of scripture (which is totally prophetic) is of any private or human interpretation. 

It's all about context isn't it? I wasn't sure which application you were using for the word prophecy since the word does have at least two meanings. In some translations the word closely means to preach which has nothing to do with a prediction.

I like this translation-

 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation of things. 21 For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

The true 'prophets' often spoke of future events, often relaying bad messages to the children of Israel that were from the Lord about their future due to their behavior.

On one hand we have a book with words in it called the bible, yet in order to be understood God either needs to reveal it to men directly or call men to preach ( prophesy) it to others.

-Tim

 

 

[Starise]

 

On 1/9/2022 at 11:55 AM, JohnD said:

Jesus prayed 33 times in the high priestly prayer (John 17) that the Church be as 1 as the Father and he are 1.

Private and semi private interpretations and doctrines formed by the will of man have produced schisms, splits, denominations, etc. Look around and see: is the Church 1 or many times many?

Jesus opposed the Sanhedrin who invented traditions based on their interpretation of the Law of Moses.

Mark 7:1–13 (AV)
1 Then came together unto him the Pharisees, and certain of the scribes, which came from Jerusalem.
2 And when they saw some of his disciples eat bread with defiled, that is to say, with unwashen, hands, they found fault.
3 For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders.
4 And when they come from the market, except they wash, they eat not. And many other things there be, which they have received to hold, as the washing of cups, and pots, brasen vessels, and of tables.
5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands?
6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

Have we done the same in the Church?

We pride ourselves on being somewhere in the neighborhood of a billion members worldwide... but Jesus said:

Matthew 7:13–14 (AV)
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Pivoting off of Mark 7:7... in vain do they worship me...

Matthew 7:21–23 (AV)
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

I am not saying people are unsaved. That's God's business. I am saying these passages should scare the heaven into us. And we should seek the Holy Spirit's guidance to point out are we actually on the narrow path of truth or the broad way...?

2Peter 1:20-21

Test the spirits (1 John 4:1 / 1 Thessalonians 5:21) to be sure it's the Holy Spirit

By the scriptures (Acts 17:11 / 2 Timothy 3:16-17)

Proverbs 25:2  / Deuteronomy 29:29

Isaiah 28:9-13

The keys to the Kingdom.

Thanks for posting these references.

So clearly these doctrines were not of the Holy Spirit's leading. One key element here for me is these people who do these things don't try to interpret what is already in front of us. No. They would rather add something to it they themselves made up.

Who would believe men just "made things up" as they see fit when it comes to the word of God? It happens a lot.

-Tim

[MrBear]

17 minutes ago, Starise said:

Who would believe men just "made things up" as they see fit when it comes to the word of God? It happens a lot.

That’s very true 

remember the Geneva Bible had footnotes like this

The 1560 Geneva Bible translated Revelation 11:7 as, “And when they have finished their testimony, the beast that cometh out of the bottomless pit, shall make wars against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.”  The study note attached to this verse stated the following:

That is, the Pope which hathe his power out of hell and cometh thence.

needless to say the RCC didn’t receive this very well 😂

SHALOM❤️

[Starise]

10 minutes ago, MrBear said:

That’s very true 

remember the Geneva Bible had footnotes like this

The 1560 Geneva Bible translated Revelation 11:7 as, “And when they have finished their testimony, the beast that cometh out of the bottomless pit, shall make wars against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.”  The study note attached to this verse stated the following:

That is, the Pope which hathe his power out of hell and cometh thence.

needless to say the RCC didn’t receive this very well 😂

SHALOM❤️

I try not to overly focus on the RCC, but man it's really hard to ignore them when they are so very open in their apostasy. I couldn't agree with you more here.

I just watched a video yesterday where the pope met with some big Imam and they agreed to build a worship location that suits the whole world. Then the pope visited the Buddhists to promote unity.

You can't make these things up.

My Bible says light has no fellowship with darkness.

-Tim

[Guest]

There are many Internet Lists of false teachers.  The problem is you need to know where these lists come from and who is benefitting.