Ezekiel 38 "...land of unwalled villages..."

[Diaste]

12 hours ago, WilliamL said:

It is not the last 3.5 years, but it is the Armageddon war.

The portrayal here is of Israel as a pastoral people, nothing like the present-day Israel. Because at this far-future time, decades after the Rapture, the earth will have been depopulated, with "few men left." Is. 24:6 Due to all the death and destruction brought about by all of the Seals and the Trumpets.

Partial evidence for this timing is here:

65. Egypt, Part 1: Its Coming 40-Year Desolation

Provides the evidence, from rarely-quoted biblical End Time prophecies, that reveals the length of, and the details about, God’s coming judgment and later healing of Egypt.

https://www.worthychristianforums.com/blogs/entry/2753-egypt-part-1-its-coming-40-year-desolation/

Thanks. I'll check it out.

[Keras]

The attack of Gog from Magog:  

Ezekiel 38 & 39 refers to an alliance of Northern peoples, formed to invade the holy Land, sometime during these latter days. Scholars differ as to who these peoples/nations are, but no reference is made to Israel’s present immediate neighbours – the Arab Islamic nations and entities, such as Hamas. The reason why they are not included in this alliance, is the fact that they will have already suffered an earlier massive defeat, the Psalms 83 fire from the Lord; His Day of wrath. Revelation 6:12-17

The passage in Ezekiel 38:11-13 describe Israel as:

1/ A people dwelling securely – not the case at present.

2/ A nation at peace – all of the nations surrounding are outright or potential enemies.

3/ Dwelling without walls – in modern terms: undefended borders.

4/ An extremely wealthy and prosperous nation, blessed by the Lord – none of these are  true of the Jewish State of Israel.

This shows that His people, Christian Israelites, will be in the Land after this clearance.

 

Ezekiel 38 & 39 are both describing the same event, an attack upon the Lord’s people, by a leader known as Gog, from the ‘far reaches of the North’. He is mentioned again in Revelation 20:8-9 which uses Ezekiel’s prophecy to portray another, final attack against Israel. The result of this later battle is that all are destroyed by fire and Satan is finally judged. Some differences are:    

1/ The first battle involves only a few nations, the last will be every nation.

2/ There is no mention of Satan in Ezekiel 38-39, but in Revelation 20, he is the primary character.

3/ The Ezekiel battle says the dead will be gathered and buried for 7 months. The armies at the end of the Millennium are cremated instantly, by fire from heaven.

4/ The battle in Ezekiel is used by God to display His power. In Revelation, people have  been faithful to God for 1000 years. Those in Rev 20:7-10 who are rebellious are killed without any more opportunity for repentance.

The second chapter of Joel up to verse 28, is a sequence of events:

Verse 1- 11 -  Is the Day of the Lord’s vengeance/ Middle East devastation, the Sixth Seal worldwide devastation. 

V 12-17 A call for the repentance of His people.   V 18-19 They gather into the Land.

V 20 The Gog and Magog war. V 21-26 People of Zion, rejoice, I shall recompense you.

V 27 You will know that I am present in Israel and I am your God. This verse parallels Ezekiel 39:28 It is by His deeds that He is known, not by His presence, until His Return, after the Tribulation, therefore, all the above happens before that.

Joel 2:18-20 Then, the Lord showed His ardent love for His Land and was moved with compassion for His people. He answered their appeal and gave them food in plenty. I shall expose you to the danger of attack no longer. I shall remove the Northern peril [Gog and Magog] far from you, into the desert areas. The leading troops will be near the Dead Sea and the rearguard by the Mediterranean. Their rotting stench will rise up!        The Lord has done great things!                               

[Diaste]

On 8/7/2022 at 2:27 PM, WilliamL said:

It is not the last 3.5 years, but it is the Armageddon war.

The portrayal here is of Israel as a pastoral people, nothing like the present-day Israel. Because at this far-future time, decades after the Rapture, the earth will have been depopulated, with "few men left." Is. 24:6 Due to all the death and destruction brought about by all of the Seals and the Trumpets.

Partial evidence for this timing is here:

65. Egypt, Part 1: Its Coming 40-Year Desolation

Provides the evidence, from rarely-quoted biblical End Time prophecies, that reveals the length of, and the details about, God’s coming judgment and later healing of Egypt.

https://www.worthychristianforums.com/blogs/entry/2753-egypt-part-1-its-coming-40-year-desolation/

I read the article. Not really making those same associations. Maybe I'm just missing it. 

 

[Revelation Man]

On 8/6/2022 at 8:31 AM, Diaste said:

Is this from Ezekiel 38:11

"a land of unwalled villages; I will come against a tranquil people who dwell securely, all of them living without walls or bars or gates—"

A prophecy of what Israel will be like or is it just "thoughts will arise in your mind, and you will devise an evil plan."

Not factual but an evil plan based on some justification and not reality based?

This could bear heavily on popular eschatology.

Both are important points........

On 8/7/2022 at 2:26 AM, Diaste said:

That's what I was thinking. When God says, " On that day when My people Israel are dwelling securely, will you not take notice of this?" Initially I thought this was telling us that indeed Israel will be dwelling securely and the previous evil thought of Gog was prophetic. But the word 'securely' in Eze 38:14 has two ideas: the fact of security and confidence or trust they are secure. The latter not being secure at all, just trusting you are. 

Israel will be thinking they are secure in their own borders, so this can only mean they have come to a peace with those who have been coming against them since 1948, and we can read who they are in Psalm 83, they make up the people living all around them now, thus they are at peace with them, and via the Abraham Accords and we now see Saudi Arabi, UAE and all of the countries surrounding Israel in league with Israel because of the Iran nuclear threat. Eventually Israel will join the E.U. but this mainly tells us Israel is at peace with her surrounding neighbors so much so she doesn't even worry about her borders any more, I don't think Israel tears down any walls, in Israeli minds they simply do not feel threated by their neighbors, I think that is what it actually means. God has a way of relaying the heart of the matter, bypassing if a wall still stands when Israel's heart is TRUSTING in those surrounding her.

I don't think the Gog and Magog war is in the 70th week, I think its just before, but its semantics, it could be either way, just before or just after the 70th week, but it can't be the middle of the week conquering of Israel, they lose that war/battle to the Anti-Christ, they win the Gog and Magog war via God's intervention. Personally, I think God uses this HOOK in Gog's mouth, then the E.U. helps out Israel to the point they trust totally in the E.U. and shudder, give up their nukes so they can join the E.U. which is the Agreement (Covenant) with the Anti-Christ. 

Do you see why it can not be in the last 3.5 years? Gog LOSES, the Anti-Christ takes over Jerusalem. 

Edited August 29, 2022 by Revelation Man

[Diaste]

13 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Both are important points........

Israel will be thinking they are secure in their own borders, so this can only mean they have come to a peace with those who have been coming against them since 1948, and we can read who they are in Psalm 83, they make up the people living all around them now, thus they are at peace with them, and via the Abraham Accords we now see Saudi Arabi, UAE and all of the countries surrounding Israel in league with Israel because of the Iran nuclear threat. Eventually they will join the E.U. but this mainly tells us Israel is at peace with her surrounding neighbors so much so she doesn't even worry about her borders any more, I don't think Israel tears down walls, in Israeli minds they simply do not feel threated by their neighbors, I thin that is what it actually means. God has a way of relaying the heart of the matter, bypassing if a wall still stands when Israel's heart is TRUSTING in those surrounding her.

I don't think the Gog and Magog war is in the 70th week, I think its just before, but its semantics, it could be either way, but it can't be the middle of the week conquering of Israel, they lose that to the Anti-Christ, they win the Gog and Magog war via God's intervention. Personally, I think God uses this HOOK in Gog's mouth, then the E.U. helps out Israel to the point they trust totally in the E.U. and shudder, give up their nukes so they can join the E.U. which is the Agreement (Covenant) with the Anti-Christ. 

Do you see why it can not be in the last 3.5 years? Gog LOSES, the Anti-Christ takes over Jerusalem. 

Sure. But is the prophecy of a time of unwalled villages or is it a prophecy of an evil thought and only an evil thought?

[Revelation Man]

3 hours ago, Diaste said:

Sure. But is the prophecy of a time of unwalled villages or is it a prophecy of an evil thought and only an evil thought?

God gives us the heart of the matter, Example, no one or very few Worship the Dragon via the Rev 13 scriptures, it is God expressing what people actually do in this evil world 24/7/365 by choosing evil over good, this world has 2 billion Christians and seemingly only 1 billion makes the rapture, so 7 billion people in God's eyes have chosen to love evil, lying, hate, lust, over the ways of God so in essence they "Worship Satan". Most of these end time clowns who join in with the Anti-Christ/False Prophet will be atheist types, they are deceived by the A.C./F.P. and Satan. 

So, God sees all of those who refuse to have a relationship with Him as "Worshiping Satan's Ways" even if they do not believe in God or Satan, because that unbelief in and of itself is them hearing Satan's voice over God, even if they do not realize this. The same semantics with unwalled villages exists, its a metaphor for Israel is at peace BECAUSE in days of old if you put up no wall, you were at peace with your neighbors, thus the write and reader of that day UNDERSTOOD what it meant. In these end times walls offer little resistance in an actual war anyway. I also think the Euphrates river is another metaphor, no one in the ends times needs a river to dry up to cross it, but Satan in the 6th vial needs to get the kings of the whole world and their armies to fight against God at Armageddon, but with all of the plagues of the Trumps, the 1st woe and 2nd woe combined with the first 5 vial of the 3rd woe, all of these people are scared to death, in hiding, they would not dare come out to fight against God and his angels but the A.C./F.P. and Satan tricks them because God "DRYS UP THE RIVER" or Stops the plagues for a while in order to give these three liars time to deceives these kings/armies into coming against Israel, they are told the two-witnesses who brought all these plagues have died, now we can finish Israel off and all of our problems will cease to exist. So, the Euphrates River is a metaphor for God drying up a "problem" that these kings and armies have, just like a river in olden days. Common sense tells us modern armies are not worried about crossing rivers.

[Diaste]

20 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

God gives us the heart of the matter, Example, no one or very few Worship the Dragon via the Rev 13 scriptures, it is God expressing what people actually do in this evil world 24/7/365 by choosing evil over good, this world has 2 billion Christians and seemingly only 1 billion makes the rapture, so 7 billion people in God's eyes have chosen to love evil, lying, hate, lust, over the ways of God so in essence they "Worship Satan". Most of these end time clowns who join in with the Anti-Christ/False Prophet will be atheist types, they are deceived by the A.C./F.P. and Satan. 

So, God sees all of those who refuse to have a relationship with Him as "Worshiping Satan's Ways" even if they do not believe in God or Satan, because that unbelief in and of itself is them hearing Satan's voice over God, even if they do not realize this. The same semantics with unwalled villages exists, its a metaphor for Israel is at peace BECAUSE in days of old if you put up no wall, you were at peace with your neighbors, thus the write and reader of that day UNDERSTOOD what it meant. In these end times walls offer little resistance in an actual war anyway. I also think the Euphrates river is another metaphor, no one in the ends times needs a river to dry up to cross it, but Satan in the 6th vial needs to get the kings of the whole world and their armies to fight against God at Armageddon, but with all of the plagues of the Trumps, the 1st woe and 2nd woe combined with the first 5 vial of the 3rd woe, all of these people are scared to death, in hiding, they would not dare come out to fight against God and his angels but the A.C./F.P. and Satan tricks them because God "DRYS UP THE RIVER" or Stops the plagues for a while in order to give these three liars time to deceives these kings/armies into coming against Israel, they are told the two-witnesses who brought all these plagues have died, now we can finish Israel off and all of our problems will cease to exist. So, the Euphrates River is a metaphor for God drying up a "problem" that these kings and armies have, just like a river in olden days. Common sense tells us modern armies are not worried about crossing rivers.

I don't think I can go there. Maybe I'm wrong but for many years I have based understanding of prophecy on the manifestation of the words as written. If the prophecy says the Euphrates dries up, then the water stops flowing. A prophecy of an army 200 million strong? It will happen and they will all be riding chimeras, as it is written. 

But in this case the prophecy says, "You will think an evil thought..." Thoughts are abstract constructions. Thoughts do not have be reality based nor manifest in the physical world. 

I also am convinced the security is a general national confidence in the idea of being secure, not actual security with bars and gates and armed guards and dogs. They believe they are safe but are not truly secure.

 

[Revelation Man]

On 8/30/2022 at 4:06 AM, Diaste said:

I don't think I can go there. Maybe I'm wrong but for many years I have based understanding of prophecy on the manifestation of the words as written. If the prophecy says the Euphrates dries up, then the water stops flowing. A prophecy of an army 200 million strong? It will happen and they will all be riding chimeras, as it is written. 

Except there are literally thousands of biblical texts proving God gives us riddles and metaphors just as Jesus gave the Disciples parables. In Rev. 12 the Woman is not a woman, it is Israel, a Star in Rev. and in Job and other places means an Angel. Babylon literal means the whole world, God says so in Rev. 16:19, He gives the Wine-press of His wrath unto Babylon the Great, well, we know who Jesus defeats in that verse because we can see via the 6th Vial that the Kings of the Whole Earth and their Armies are who gets defeated, so Babylon, by God's own declaration is the Kings of the whole earth and their Armies. Babel = confusion, the world is deceived by Satan to the point they try to defeat their own loving Creator, that = Confusion to the max !!

The "200,000 million" are nit even associated with Rev. 16, its in the 2nd Woe where it specifically says in verse 20 these are Plagues of God, thus the 200,000 are simply God speaking about the whole host of Heaven bringing His plagues onto mankind, REMEMBER, Satan can not cast out Satan. So, instead of trying to give us a number no ne would understand AND give out info that no one has any business having, he simply does the 10 x 10 thing, but with 1000's instead. It simply means All the Hosts pf Heaven are going to brig God's plagues onto mankind. 

In Rev. 9 the Locusts are Demons. 

On 8/30/2022 at 4:06 AM, Diaste said:

But in this case the prophecy says, "You will think an evil thought..." Thoughts are abstract constructions. Thoughts do not have be reality based nor manifest in the physical world. 

I also am convinced the security is a general national confidence in the idea of being secure, not actual security with bars and gates and armed guards and dogs. They believe they are safe but are not truly secure.

We agree, its not an actual wall/bars, but in this instance it can't be the Anti-Christ even though he des deceive them, but I think his help on the Russia/Gog/Iran/Turkey wars is how Satan gets his foot in the door. The Agreement will be Israel joining the E.U. With Russia, Turkey and Iran out of the way this opens up the E.U.'s path. The USA will insure the E.U. arises, even before we are wiped out via the Asteroid Impact completely in the middle of the 70th week (April 13, 2029). 

So, why are we spending so much money in the USA, inviting anyone in the world to move in, doing all kind of weird stuff never seen before? Its a Satanic led Government Entity, the USA is no longer un by the peoples, thus these weirdos (that's what they are) are led by Satan, wo needs this country to fall in order to raise up his 7th Head of the Beast (Anti-Christ). Its here now, we will soon go down, the Petro Dollar is on the way out, we will soon come apart as a nation, this will give the E.U. a reason to bring forth a standing army. 

So, while I agree the Walls don't really mean modern walls, I think the deception comes from the E.U. helping Israel out, they give up their nukes and become a part pf the E.U. and technically (and it is God's Rules lol) this VIOLATES the Covenant between God and Abraham, Israel can not do this legally in the sight of God !!

[Shilohsfoal]

The proper time period for Gog to Invade Israel is given in Revelation 20.

This is Christ revealing to you when Gog will Invade israel. 

In Revelation,Christ reveals to us the Gog will invade israel 1000 years after he has comes and raises the dead who did not worship the beast or recieved its mark and were beheaded for thier testiminy of Jesus. 

It makes perfect sence if you just except his revelation. 

Edited September 1, 2022 by Shilohsfoal

[Shilohsfoal]

17 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Except there are literally thousands of biblical texts proving God gives us riddles and metaphors just as Jesus gave the Disciples parables. In Rev. 12 the Woman is not a woman, it is Israel, a Star in Rev. and in Job and other places means an Angel. Babylon literal means the whole world, God says so in Rev. 16:19, He gives the Wine-press of His wrath unto Babylon the Great, well, we know who Jesus defeats in that verse because we can see via the 6th Vial that the Kings of the Whole Earth and their Armies are who gets defeated, so Babylon, by God's own declaration is the Kings of the whole earth and their Armies. Babel = confusion, the world is deceived by Satan to the point they try to defeat their own loving Creator, that = Confusion to the max !!

The "200,000 million" are nit even associated with Rev. 16, its in the 2nd Woe where it specifically says in verse 20 these are Plagues of God, thus the 200,000 are simply God speaking about the whole host of Heaven bringing His plagues onto mankind, REMEMBER, Satan can not cast out Satan. So, instead of trying to give us a number no ne would understand AND give out info that no one has any business having, he simply does the 10 x 10 thing, but with 1000's instead. It simply means All the Hosts pf Heaven are going to brig God's plagues onto mankind. 

In Rev. 9 the Locusts are Demons. 

We agree, its not an actual wall/bars, but in this instance it can't be the Anti-Christ even though he des deceive them, but I think his help on the Russia/Gog/Iran/Turkey wars is how Satan gets his foot in the door. The Agreement will be Israel joining the E.U. With Russia, Turkey and Iran out of the way this opens up the E.U.'s path. The USA will insure the E.U. arises, even before we are wiped out via the Asteroid Impact completely in the middle of the 70th week (April 13, 2029). 

So, why are we spending so much money in the USA, inviting anyone in the world to move in, doing all kind of weird stuff never seen before? Its a Satanic led Government Entity, the USA is no longer un by the peoples, thus these weirdos (that's what they are) are led by Satan, wo needs this country to fall in order to raise up his 7th Head of the Beast (Anti-Christ). Its here now, we will soon go down, the Petro Dollar is on the way out, we will soon come apart as a nation, this will give the E.U. a reason to bring forth a standing army. 

So, while I agree the Walls don't really mean modern walls, I think the deception comes from the E.U. helping Israel out, they give up their nukes and become a part pf the E.U. and technically (and it is God's Rules lol) this VIOLATES the Covenant between God and Abraham, Israel can not do this legally in the sight of God !!

Revelation say Babylon is a city. Not the world.