Only Those Who Pass Through GT are Resurrected or Gathered.

[Shilohsfoal]

I remember as a child watching the ten commandments on TV.I sure loved that movie.I remember watching where they carried the bones of Joseph to the land promised to his fathers.Jacob and Joseph both made sure they would be buried in the land of Canaan  for a reason.

 

Jacob

²⁸ And Jacob lived in the land of Egypt seventeen years: so the whole age of Jacob was an hundred forty and seven years.

²⁹ And the time drew nigh that Israel must die: and he called his son Joseph, and said unto him, If now I have found grace in thy sight, put, I pray thee, thy hand under my thigh, and deal kindly and truly with me; bury me not, I pray thee, in Egypt:

³⁰ But I will lie with my fathers, and thou shalt carry me out of Egypt, and bury me in their buryingplace. And he said, I will do as thou hast said.

³¹ And he said, Swear unto me. And he sware unto him. And Israel bowed himself upon the bed's head.

 

Joseph

²⁴ And Joseph said unto his brethren, I die: and God will surely visit you, and bring you out of this land unto the land which he sware to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob.

²⁵ And Joseph took an oath of the children of Israel, saying, God will surely visit you, and ye shall carry up my bones from hence.

²⁶ So Joseph died, being an hundred and ten years old: and they embalmed him, and he was put in a coffin in Egypt.

 

 

They made sure they were buried in the right place.

[Diaste]

19 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Whole world?

You believe the whole world followed the little horn into the pleasant land?

 

Daniel 8:9

And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

 

All 7.8 billion going to fit in the pleasant land or is it just some from all over the world who followed the beast into the pleasant land?

Wow, super literal. Not sure that's called for here. 

But in fact all the people on earth fit into Jacksonville, Florida. 

Jacksonville has about 874 mile² of total area.

Israel is about 8000 miles². So they could literally fit. 

Not that I think they would or it will happen.

Edited September 17, 2023 by Diaste

[Diaste]

19 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

From what scripture says,only Israel reigns over the nations in jesus's land.

 

Isaiah 14:2

Nations will take them and bring them to their own place. And Israel will take possession of the nations and make them male and female servants in the LORD’s land. They will make captives of their captors and rule over their oppressors.

At some point, sure. When? The above is one of the reasons Israel is looking for an earthly king. They want the power over the world. The mistake is avoiding the context. 

19 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

 

Kinda hard to avoid the facts. The remnant of Israel is the only people who are faced with the beast.

Anyone outside of Israel is not faced with the beast. Thats why the nations christians in Israel flee for the wilderness from the face of the dragon. He can't reach her outside Israel borders.

I've already posted the scriptures. The above does not align with the prophecy.

19 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

 

Revelation 12

¹⁴ And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

 

The only people in the entire world that face the beast are those who remain in Israel with the beast.The remnant of Israel who keep the comandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

How is there a remnant in Israel? If the woman is Israel, and the woman is flown to the wilderness, safe from the serpent/dragon/beast, how is there any left? Did she forget an arm or something? 

If the woman is protected Israel, the faithful God fearing, and has just been hidden from the serpent/dragon/beast, who would still bear testimony and keep commandments? No one in Israel, apparently. Israel, all Israel, has just been transported to safety. 

19 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

 

Revelation 12

¹⁷ And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

What about all the other people all across the earth that keep the commands and testify of Jesus? There's like 2.6 billion of them on the face of the earth. This could in no way be referencing them?

[Diaste]

19 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

³⁵ That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

 

Revelation 18:24

And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.
 

Jerusalem is responsible for ALL the righteous blood shed upon the earth.Not some but all.

 

ALL

Word: paj

Pronounce: pas

Strongs Number: G3956

Orig: including all the forms of declension; apparently a primary word; all, any, every, the whole:--all (manner of, means), alway(-s), any (one), X daily, + ever, every (one, way), as many as, + no(-thing), X thoroughly, whatsoever, whole, whosoever.

 

That would be in ALL,as in all from beginning to end.ALL

 

And the world does not commit her sins.

Revelation 18:4

Then I heard another voice from heaven say: “’Come out of her, my people,’ so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues;

 

So here it's 'all' in the whole world across the whole existence of people, but in Rev 13 it's not 'all' as in all the people of earth? 

I do not find this consistent but it is selective.

I think it's called special pleading. 

[Shilohsfoal]

4 hours ago, Diaste said:

Wow, super literal. Not sure that's called for here. 

But in fact all the people on earth fit into Jacksonville, Florida. 

Jacksonville has about 874 mile² of total area.

Israel is about 8000 miles². So they could literally fit. 

Not that I think they would or it will happen.

Then perhaps it's not as literal as you think.It could just be that Jews from all over the world have followed the beast into the pleasant land as has and is still happening.

[Shilohsfoal]

5 hours ago, Diaste said:

At some point, sure. When? The above is one of the reasons Israel is looking for an earthly king. They want the power over the world. The mistake is avoiding the context. 

I've already posted the scriptures. The above does not align with the prophecy.

How is there a remnant in Israel? If the woman is Israel, and the woman is flown to the wilderness, safe from the serpent/dragon/beast, how is there any left? Did she forget an arm or something? 

If the woman is protected Israel, the faithful God fearing, and has just been hidden from the serpent/dragon/beast, who would still bear testimony and keep commandments? No one in Israel, apparently. Israel, all Israel, has just been transported to safety. 

What about all the other people all across the earth that keep the commands and testify of Jesus? There's like 2.6 billion of them on the face of the earth. This could in no way be referencing them?

You've missed the entire point of scripture.

 

² And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the Lord for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors.

³ And it shall come to pass in the day that the Lord shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve,

⁴ That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!

 

Israel will reign over the nations during the millinial kingdom after the land becomes the Lord's.After the seventh Trump.After Babylon has been destroyed.

 

 

 

I recon because you don't understand who the beast is,you also can not understand who will reign with Christ over the nations in Christs kingdom.Those who die for their testimony of Christ who also did not worship that beast or it's image or recieve it's mark 

Isaiah could not have made it any clearer who will rule over the nations in Christs kingdom.

The house of Israel .

 

Edited September 17, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Shilohsfoal]

4 hours ago, Diaste said:

So here it's 'all' in the whole world across the whole existence of people, but in Rev 13 it's not 'all' as in all the people of earth? 

I do not find this consistent but it is selective.

I think it's called special pleading. 

Which is it then ,do all get the mark as in revelation 13:16 or not all as in revelation 20:4?

 

Let's see which one you will select.Which verse are you going to say is wrong?

Make up your mind .

 

 

¹⁶ And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

¹⁷ And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

 

⁴ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

[DeighAnn]

2 Tim 

1Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

2And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.

3Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.

4No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

5And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.

6The husbandman that laboureth must be first partaker of the fruits.

7Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things.

8Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel:

9Wherein I suffer trouble, as an evil doer, even unto bonds; but the word of God is not bound.

10Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

11It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:

12If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

13If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

14Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.



Matthew 19:28-29 - And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed Me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of His glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.  And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.  


JUDGING THE TWELVE TRIBES OF ISRAEL....The eyes have been 'cracked' open...I may not 'see' the same divisions as you do,


BUT I DO SEE A division that I did not previously take into account!!!   

and that is always one of the biggest steps for me....


I may be kinda slow on the 'uptake' but at least I realize THEY are coming/unfolding/being revealed, which is leaps and bounds ahead of where I was when I started...

the next thought that came to my mind was THE WAY in which God ORDERS things...and if this is 'small' testimony to a hierarchy of government that will 'reign' on the Lords Day...lots to think about.... more info to add to the 'PICTURES' or scenes taking place... MAYBE will help with answers to the extra days or months or the year that takes place between His return and the set up of the world under His reign...

again, thank you...and to what I am referring as to order...not just with the fish and the loaves and the 5000 fed but also things like



10The LORD your God hath multiplied you, and, behold, ye are this day as the stars of heaven for multitude.

11(The LORD God of your fathers make you a thousand times so many more as ye are, and bless you, as he hath promised you!)

12How can I myself alone bear your cumbrance, and your burden, and your strife?

13Take you wise men, and understanding, and known among your tribes, and I will make them rulers over you.

14And ye answered me, and said, The thing which thou hast spoken is good for us to do.

15So I took the chief of your tribes, wise men, and known, and made them heads over you, captains over thousands, and captains over hundreds, and captains over fifties, and captains over tens, and officers among your tribes.

16And I charged your judges at that time, saying, Hear the causes between your brethren, and judge righteously between every man and his brother, and the stranger that is with him.

17Ye shall not respect persons in judgment; but ye shall hear the small as well as the great; ye shall not be afraid of the face of man; for the judgment is God's: and the cause that is too hard for you, bring it unto me, and I will hear it.

18And I commanded you at that time all the things which ye should do.

THIS IS WHY I STICK WITH THESE THREADS...

So, thank you again....



Revelation 1:6 - And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.


Revelation 5:10 - And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


once you see it, it is everywhere, isn't it?



"And David assembled all the princes of Israel, the princes of the tribes, and the captains of the companies that ministered to the king by course, and the captains over the thousands, and captains over the hundreds, and the stewards over all the substance and possession of the king, and of his sons, with the officers, and with the mighty men, and with all the valiant men, unto Jerusalem." 1 Chronicles 28:1 KJV

Edited September 17, 2023 by DeighAnn

[Last Daze]

On 9/16/2023 at 5:35 PM, Diaste said:

Yes, it's that order that is most interesting. It's a succinct overview, yes?

Christ 1st, obviously.

Then those who are depicted in Rev 7:11-13 and Rev 20:4

Then 1000 years later those who are depicted in Matt 25:31-46, Rev 20:5 and Rev 20:12-15.

I agree with that definition. My question is: What does it mean to "crucify the flesh with its passions and desires."?

What does that look like? Does it look like Rev 20:4? Maybe it looks like Rev 2-3 where overcoming is the attribute that results in the rewards; overcoming the end of the age specifically. Does it look like clean living, long marriage and loyal respectful children? Quite the topic on it's own.

You are correct, there is no specific prohibition barring the in Christ population being gathered at the first resurrection from all who ever lived. 

Rev 20:4 is quite specific on who it is exactly that comes to life and lives and reigns with Christ for 1000 years. And it's not all from all time. Unless one is inclined to think that even those never having faced the beast are a part of those who did not take the mark or worship the beast. Could be but I don't hold that opinion.

One exception is enduring beheading for the testimony of Jesus and the word of God, that would not be limited to the end of the age GT worship or die beastly edict. imo.

I also do not see 

"those who had been beheaded for their testimony of Jesus and for the word of God,

those who had not worshiped the beast or its image,

not received its mark on their foreheads or hands."

as attributes each person must have in order to live and reign with Christ. As long as one is present you're in. I could be wrong.

That is not to say that just because a group with specific attributes is resurrected and gathered at the 2nd coming, that all other believers not gathered at that time are condemned to eternal flame.

At the judgement there are sheep and goats, and Jesus is letting the sheep in for even the smallest act of love; even as the love givers were unaware of what they were doing! Pretty amazing. Such mercy by the King is surely mankind's great hope.

IMO, the sheep and goat judgment of Matt 25 is the same as the GWT judgment of Rev 20.

So then all in Christ are raised at some point. Those that are Christ's at His coming is pretty general. It would seem that if Jesus is inviting you in at the sheep and goats judgment then you are also His; then Christ's people are also raised at the 2nd resurrection.

For certain scripture says:

"And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image, and had not received its mark on their foreheads or hands. And they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years."

It's not everyone that is resurrected to live and reign with Christ for 1000 years, as has been popular through the years.

And:

After this I looked and saw a multitude too large to count, from every nation and tribe and people and tongue, standing before the throne and before the Lamb.

13Then one of the elders addressed me: “These in white robes,” he asked, “who are they, and where have they come from?”

14“Sir,” I answered, “you know.”

So he replied, “These are the ones who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Again it looks like the resurrected come out from within GT at the end of the age at Jesus' 2nd coming. 

That's what I read. 

 

Yeah, I guess ultimately God decides whose resurrected at Christ's return but there does seem to be an element of martyrdom to it . . .

[Shilohsfoal]

43 minutes ago, Last Daze said:

Yeah, I guess ultimately God decides whose resurrected at Christ's return but there does seem to be an element of martyrdom to it . . .

Have you ever thought it may be Israel that is resurected when Christ comes?

 

Ezekiel 37

¹¹ Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.

¹² Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.

¹³ And ye shall know that I am the Lord, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,

 

 

Of course this resurection takes place before Gog invades the land of Israel in the following chapters.