Why radioactive decay dates beyond around 4300 years are invalid

[The Barbarian]

I bother to look things up in science journals

1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said:

Science journals are useless when discussing Genesis, or any other aspect of the Bible.

They are quite useful for debunking creationist revisions of Genesis and other books of the Bible.

I pointed out to the ICR writer that those ages were limited to patriarchs and prominent people in the Bible and were never given as an average age for people of that time.

1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said:

You have no evidence whatever to that effect.

You posted it for me.   Just a few people, no everyday ordinary people.    You assumed that God extended the lifetimes of everyone, ignoring what  He actually said about it.

1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said:

In neither those places nor any other did God say that anyone was promised to live that long or could not live longer. 

You don't believe Him, because He doesn't agree with your new doctrines.   But I believe Him.    Is there anything in the Bible that you accept as it is?

the "days" of creation are not literal days.   The text itself says they are not. 

1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said:

The only person you ever convinced with that lie is yourself.

God says it is.   I believe Him.   You should, too.

 

[RV_Wizard]

55 minutes ago, The Barbarian said:

I pointed out to the ICR writer that those ages were limited to patriarchs and prominent people in the Bible and were never given as an average age for people of that time.

The Bible doesn't say that, so you pointed out a lie.  There is nothing in the book of Genesis or elsewhere that says that only those named in Genesis lived hundreds of years.

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

Just a few people, no everyday ordinary people.  

Lack of specific mention does not equal exclusion.  Your name isn't listed in the Constitution, but I presume you believe your rights are protected.  Actually, other than Able, who was murdered, there is no mention of anyone NOT living for centuries before the flood. Why would anyone think they had short lifespans?

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

You don't believe Him, because He doesn't agree with your new doctrines.  

I wonder if anyone here has ever seen you post something truthful.  I can't remember seeing it.

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

God says it is.  

Then cite the verse.  You keep trying to prove the Bible is wrong, but all you prove is that you don't know what you're talking about.

[The Barbarian]

I pointed out to the ICR writer that those ages were limited to patriarchs and prominent people in the Bible and were never given as an average age for people of that time.

28 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

The Bible doesn't say that

That's what I just said.   You printed out a lie.

28 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

There is nothing in the book of Genesis or elsewhere that says that only those named in Genesis lived hundreds of years.

But we do have God's word on human lifespan, and it's not hundreds of years.    Why don't you just believe Him?

29 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

Lack of specific mention does not equal exclusion. 

Nor does it mean that it wasn't.   We have no reason to think that God was wrong when He mentioned how long a human lifetime was then.    What is your evidence that He was wrong?

30 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

Your name isn't listed in the Constitution, but I presume you believe your rights are protected. 

My name isn't listed in the roll of presidents of the United States..    That doesn't mean I was president of the United States.    Likewise, only a few people are listed by God as having ages of hundreds of years.    That doesn't mean that God was wrong when He said 120 or 70 for a human life span.   Why do you think He's wrong?  

And you've apparently never read the Constitution, if you think I'm not covered by it.   It doesn't mention a few important people who have rights.   It says all persons.

34 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

I wonder if anyone here has ever seen you post something truthful.  I can't remember seeing it.

You should be very careful with that kind of accusation.    It suggests unflattering things about you.

35 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

Actually, other than Able, who was murdered, there is no mention of anyone NOT living for centuries before the flood. Why would anyone think they had short lifespans?

Because God said otherwise.    You admitted that He said 120 as a human lifespan.   Why won't you just believe Him?

And as you learned, the fact that the creation story mentions mornings and evenings without a sun to have them, makes it very clear that the days are not literal 24 hour days.

Why not just accept it God's way?    Once you let it be His way, it won't trouble you any longer.

 

 

 

[RV_Wizard]

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

But we do have God's word on human lifespan, and it's not hundreds of years.    Why don't you just believe Him?

Perhaps it's because you don't have the slightest clue about which you speak.  There is a word you should learn called chronology.  It means that things happen along a progressive timeline.  Some things happen earlier, some things happen later.  When things are read out of sequence or out of context, it's easy for people who dedicate their time to distorting the Scriptures to misinterpret what is said.

Genesis 6:1-7 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart. And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

Care to guess what major event happened to end the days of man?

Even this brief passage is enough to make clear that the context of Genesis 6 is not a discussion of mankind's longevity. In fact, the subject of how long humans live is nowhere to be found in the story of the flood at all. Therefore, we must not inject that idea into the meaning of verse 3. Interpreting v.3 to be a statement about human lifespan is both nonsensical (given the context) and irrelevant to the narrative overall. It is an example of the error of eisegesis. 

As we consider the context of Genesis 6, what does v.3 mean? The only proper conclusion is God was saying something about the timeline of the flood itself, and as we look at the rest of the narrative of Genesis 6-7, we find that this conclusion fits perfectly.  source

As usual, if you are quoting the Bible, the quote is taken out of context and twisted to mean what you want it to mean.

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

We have no reason to think that God was wrong when He mentioned how long a human lifetime was then.

Other than a few people on an ark, man's lifetime ended 120 years later.  After the flood, the longevity of man decreased, as the slide I posted demonstrates.

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

My name isn't listed in the roll of presidents of the United States..    That doesn't mean I was president of the United States.   

Actually, if you were a president your name would be on the roll.

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

Likewise, only a few people are listed by God as having ages of hundreds of years.

I wonder if there is anything in the Bible you DO understand.  There are only a few people listed in Genesis 5.  ALL of them lived hundreds of years.

1 hour ago, The Barbarian said:

And you've apparently never read the Constitution,

More stupidity.  Did they not teach you anything about analogies in school?  Read this slowly.  The lack of a specific mention does not mean exclusion or non-existence.  You are arguing something you cannot POSSIBLY prove, just to be contrary to what the Bible says.  

2 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

Because God said otherwise.  

No He didn't.

2 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

You admitted that He said 120 as a human lifespan.

He said "My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years."  You seem to think that means everyone will live exactly 120 years; neither more nor less. 

2 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

And as you learned, the fact that the creation story mentions mornings and evenings without a sun to have them,

As you have been told repeatedly, light was created on day one.  You prefer to lie and distort the Scriptures to promoter your own Satanic heresy.  Read about false teachers in the Revelation, and decide if you want to continue down that path.

The light of truth lies not within you.

[The Barbarian]

But we do have God's word on human lifespan, and it's not hundreds of years.    Why don't you just believe Him?

22 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

Perhaps it's because you don't have the slightest clue about which you speak. 

He does.   And you should just believe Him.   You were the one who showed us that God said human lifetimes were not hundreds of years.  

25 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

He said "My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years."  You seem to think that means everyone will live exactly 120 years; neither more nor less. 

If you think so, you weren't reading very well.   I pointed out to you that very recently someone exceeded that age.    Whether you go with 120 years or seventy years as God says elsewhere, it contradicts your assumption that humans used to live longer than they do now.

Likewise, only a few people are listed by God as having ages of hundreds of years.

28 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

I wonder if there is anything in the Bible you DO understand. 

I just had to show you why your assumption is contradicted by God's word.   Why not just accept it His way?

29 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

Read this slowly.  The lack of a specific mention does not mean exclusion or non-existence. 

Nor is it evidence of existence.   It's more likely that it wasn't mentioned because it didn't happen.   Think.

30 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

As you have been told repeatedly, light was created on day one. 

If "Big light in the sky" was morning, then moonrise would be morning.   So your assumption fails.    There's really no way to get around God's word.   Why not just accept it as it is?

 

[RV_Wizard]

7 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

You were the one who showed us that God said human lifetimes were not hundreds of years.  

Absolutely untrue.  I showed where human longevity before the flood was much longer.  Then it began to get shorter.  I also pointed out that when America was founded, the average lifespan was 61.

7 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

  I pointed out to you that very recently someone exceeded that age. 

I pointed out that the flood already happened, and that lifespans, while now extending close to 80 years, were never promised by God nor was a hard limit ever set.

John 21:22-23  Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me.  Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?

8 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

I just had to show you why your assumption is contradicted by God's word. 

God's word in your hand is like a bazooka in the hands of a three-year-old.  It's powerful, but he has no idea how to use it.  You need to turn your life to Jesus and ask for the discernment of the Holy Spirit.  Maybe then you'll be here supporting the Bible rather than trying to contradict every word.

8 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

It's more likely that it wasn't mentioned because it didn't happen. 

So you believe that the sons of Adam listed were the ONLY children Adam had in 930 years?  The 8th and 9th days were not listed, did they happen?  How about the words and deeds of Jesus?  John 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written.  Not every event in man's history is recorded.  Lack of inclusion does not equate to lack of existence.  You can't prove or disprove what is not mentioned.

You're free to believe or disbelieve anything you want, but if you are telling people that the Bible says something you'd BETTER be able to back it up with a full reading of the passage.  What you do is to take excerpts out of context and twist the meaning.

8 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

If "Big light in the sky" was morning, then moonrise would be morning.

It's not amazing that what you posted is among the dumbest things I've ever read.  What IS amazing is that you continue to post it.  You have demonstrated an inability to learn, but for others who may not of seen this argument discredited I will again answer it.

Genesis 1, Verses 3-5 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.  And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.  And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.  Light plus darkness = 1 day.  Since Genesis is written from the perspective of the earth and since we know that a single rotation of the earth makes one day, we know that day and night functioned then as now.  The only difference is that there was a single entity called "light."  At night there was absolute darkness, because the light did not shine on that section of the earth and there was nothing else in the universe.

Verses 11-13.  And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.  And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.  And the evening and the morning were the third day.

Most of us know that 11 comes after 5, so we can understand that this, the third day, comes after the first.  So there are trees yielding fruit, grasses and herbs on day 3.  The next part is tricky because it starts with verse 14, which we must remind you, comes after 5 and after 13.

Verses 15-18 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.  And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.  And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

So now we have the sun, which is responsible for sunrise and sunset. and we have the moon and stars which give illumination to the night.  Under NO CIRCUMSTANCES would the "moonrise" EVER constitute morning.  You could call moonrise evening, but the moon isn't always visible.  The stars are also not always visible because the cloud cover can block them.  It takes very heavy cloud cover to block out the sun, and then it's only partial.  Even with an eclipse there is some sunlight.  So, morning and evening come only from the light of the sun shining onto a rotating earth.

You keep trying to point out errors in the perfect word of God, but in so doing, you only demonstrate either total ignorance or total dishonesty.

[The Barbarian]

1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said:

I showed where human longevity before the flood was much longer. 

You showed God extended the lives of a few humans beyond the three score and ten normal for humans.    But you offered no evidence for this being the norm.   Indeed,God says otherwise.   Why won't you believe Him?

You keep trying to point out errors in the perfect word of God, but in so doing, you only demonstrate either total ignorance or total dishonesty.

[RV_Wizard]

52 minutes ago, The Barbarian said:

You showed God extended the lives of a few humans beyond the three score and ten normal for humans. 

You show no evidence it was NOT the norm.  All you have is your claim based on nothing.  I showed you a chart showing the lifespans of known people

The lifespans of the unknown is anyone's guess.  However, there is no indication that these long lifespans were abnormal; no wondering of the people how their fathers could live so long and they not.  You, however, go so far as to claim that God somehow put a cap on human lifespans and now, because a woman lived to be 121, that proves God wrong?

Perhaps you're in the wrong forum,  This one is for those who believe in the Lord.

[The Barbarian]

You showed God extended the lives of a few humans beyond the three score and ten normal for humans.  But you offered no evidence for this being the norm.   Indeed,God says otherwise.   Why won't you believe Him?

19 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

You show no evidence it was NOT the norm. 

Other than God's word?   That's enough for me.   It's sad that His word isn't enough for you.

19 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

The lifespans of the unknown is anyone's guess. 

But that didn't stop you from declaring otherwise, did it?

20 minutes ago, RV_Wizard said:

You, however, go so far as to claim that God somehow put a cap on human lifespans and now, because a woman lived to be 121, that proves God wrong?

You're still a bit confused.   We know that three score and ten is a pretty good average life span.   And 120 years is close to the maximum, but God never said it was a hard limit.

Perhaps you're in the wrong forum,  This one is for those who believe in the Lord.

[RV_Wizard]

5 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

Other than God's word?  

Genesis 11: 10 These are the generations of Shem: Shem was an hundred years old, and begat Arphaxad two years after the flood:  

11 And Shem lived after he begat Arphaxad five hundred years, and begat sons and daughters.

12 And Arphaxad lived five and thirty years, and begat Salah:

13 And Arphaxad lived after he begat Salah four hundred and three years, and begat sons and daughters.

14 And Salah lived thirty years, and begat Eber:

15 And Salah lived after he begat Eber four hundred and three years, and begat sons and daughters.

16 And Eber lived four and thirty years, and begat Peleg:

17 And Eber lived after he begat Peleg four hundred and thirty years, and begat sons and daughters.

18 And Peleg lived thirty years, and begat Reu:

19 And Peleg lived after he begat Reu two hundred and nine years, and begat sons and daughters.

20 And Reu lived two and thirty years, and begat Serug:

21 And Reu lived after he begat Serug two hundred and seven years, and begat sons and daughters.

22 And Serug lived thirty years, and begat Nahor:

23 And Serug lived after he begat Nahor two hundred years, and begat sons and daughters.

24 And Nahor lived nine and twenty years, and begat Terah:

25 And Nahor lived after he begat Terah an hundred and nineteen years, and begat sons and daughters.

Genesis 11 comes after Genesis 6, and after the flood.

As time went on, lifetimes became shorter.  Moses later wrote Psalm 90:10.  The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.  Moses himself lived to be 120 years old.

5 hours ago, The Barbarian said:

We know that three score and ten is a pretty good average life span.   And 120 years is close to the maximum, but God never said it was a hard limit.

You said, "that God specifically stated human lifetimes were much shorter.   Three score and seven or 120, depending on interpretations."  I have pointed out and provided proof that your claim is false; that 120 years was never a hard limit imposed by God, and that extreme longevity occurred throughout the early years of man's existence.  After the flood, lifespans began to get shorter.  For example, the Israelites were in the desert for 40 years so that all who rebelled against Moses would die off.  In this case, Moses was allowed to outlive them all.  Regardless, threescore and ten is not promised to anyone or a hard limit for anyone.  References to lifespans were never more than comments on the average lifespan at the time.  If God wanted someone to live 1,000 years today, He could do so without violating a single word of the Bible.

Boring conversation at this point.  I'm out.