Neighbor Posted March 30 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 957 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,626 Content Per Day: 5.03 Reputation: 9,075 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Share Posted March 30 Hi, Perhaps I am blind this morning (or brain dead), but I cannot find the word Christian being used in my English language versions of the Bible*, Nor do I find true except "I am the true vine". With that I am wondering just what one means when they might say that a person is not a true Christian, or that they themselves are a true Christian. Are true and Christian extrabiblical words of description? Much like Trinity is? Kind of a conclusion reached rather than an actual Bible word. Is there such a thing as a true Christian? * But for three exceptions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tristen Posted March 30 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 9 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,372 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 1,347 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/26/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30 2 hours ago, Neighbor said: With that I am wondering just what one means when they might say that a person is not a true Christian, or that they themselves are a true Christian. I think there is a valid, Bible-based, distinction between those who hold a sincere, enduring faith, and those who are "Christian" in a shallow, nominal sense only. However, I also think that those who presume to know the status of another person's faith have potentially fallen into a trap - having aligned themselves with "the accuser of our brethren" (Revelation 12:10). Frivolous accusations against those ministering in the name of Christ demonstrate a deficiency in the reverent fear of God - presuming to know what God is doing based on our own, limited and potentially flawed, understanding of things - and therefore potentially speaking against a legitimate work of God. There is a place for testing, and judging, and examining fruit - but the state of one's heart is exclusively God's purview. It is my view that we should therefore be much more circumspect about weighing in on such matters - lest we unintentionally curse a fellow citizen of the Kingdom of God. I would therefore be wary of the spiritual maturity of someone inclined to label specific people (including themselves) as either true or not true Christians. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi Posted March 30 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 58 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,790 Content Per Day: 1.03 Reputation: 323 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30 2 hours ago, Neighbor said: Hi, Perhaps I am blind this morning (or brain dead), but I cannot find the word Christian being used in my English language versions of the Bible*, Nor do I find true except "I am the true vine". With that I am wondering just what one means when they might say that a person is not a true Christian, or that they themselves are a true Christian. Are true and Christian extrabiblical words of description? Much like Trinity is? Kind of a conclusion reached rather than an actual Bible word. Is there such a thing as a true Christian? * But for three exceptions The Lord provides examples of who are true Christians and those who aren't. In Matthew 7:21-23, the Lord describes a group of individuals who thought they were true Christians, to whom the Lord replies--his never having known them. True Christians you will know by their fruits (Matthew 7:20). Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOrangeCat Posted March 30 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 57 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,412 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 1,833 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/24/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30 Yeah, there's those three instances of Christian being used in the Bible. With the term being used internally I wouldn't personally consider it extrabiblical. It's just not used much. Instead of Christians the Bible more often speaks of the church. I do think the term "true Christian" is extrabiblical, but the concept exists because its opposite is spoken of. Hypocrisy is something Jesus spoke out against a lot, and it stands out to me that the only group He seemed especially vocal in speaking out against were hypocrites and people trying to exploit faith for their own gain. Jesus and others in the New Testament also speak of false teachers. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NConly Posted March 30 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,335 Content Per Day: 2.79 Reputation: 614 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/11/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30 (edited) kjv Acts 11 26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch. Does this count? Edited March 30 by NConly add 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neighbor Posted March 30 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 957 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,626 Content Per Day: 5.03 Reputation: 9,075 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Author Share Posted March 30 33 minutes ago, NConly said: kjv Acts 11 26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch. Does this count? Yes, and Acts 26:28, plus 1 peter 4:16 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neighbor Posted March 30 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 957 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,626 Content Per Day: 5.03 Reputation: 9,075 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Author Share Posted March 30 1 hour ago, AnOrangeCat said: Jesus and others in the New Testament also speak of false teachers. Interesting of course! In that sense then maybe there are true teachers or teachers of truth, and false teachers or teachers that teach what is essentially a falsehood or lie. Perhaps all could be Christians? ??? Some just more correct than others. seems many an excellent teacher each a Christian has found error in their own teaching and changed their understandings on issues they had previously held as close truth or doctrine. Can a true teacher a Christian teach error? I guess so! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who me Posted March 30 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,300 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 1,686 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30 5 hours ago, Neighbor said: Hi, Perhaps I am blind this morning (or brain dead), but I cannot find the word Christian being used in my English language versions of the Bible*, Nor do I find true except "I am the true vine". With that I am wondering just what one means when they might say that a person is not a true Christian, or that they themselves are a true Christian. Are true and Christian extrabiblical words of description? Much like Trinity is? Kind of a conclusion reached rather than an actual Bible word. Is there such a thing as a true Christian? * But for three exceptions Try using biblegateway. I did a quick search and it found:-https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=Christian&version=NIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOrangeCat Posted March 30 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 57 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,412 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 1,833 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/24/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30 3 hours ago, Neighbor said: Perhaps all could be Christians? ??? Some just more correct than others. seems many an excellent teacher each a Christian has found error in their own teaching and changed their understandings on issues they had previously held as close truth or doctrine. Can a true teacher a Christian teach error? I guess so! I feel like intentions matter. We're all human and thus imperfect and prone to error. But I'd say there's a distinction between someone who genuinely believes and is error and someone taking on the mantle of a teacher in the name of their own gain. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathoner Posted March 30 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 71 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 10,190 Content Per Day: 7.08 Reputation: 13,172 Days Won: 98 Joined: 05/24/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30 (edited) 8 hours ago, Neighbor said: Hi, Perhaps I am blind this morning (or brain dead), but I cannot find the word Christian being used in my English language versions of the Bible*, Nor do I find true except "I am the true vine". With that I am wondering just what one means when they might say that a person is not a true Christian, or that they themselves are a true Christian. Are true and Christian extrabiblical words of description? Much like Trinity is? Kind of a conclusion reached rather than an actual Bible word. Is there such a thing as a true Christian? * But for three exceptions As others have responded, "Christian" does indeed appear in the scriptures. However, "true Christian" does not, nor does "true disciple" for that matter. There's also the modern context of "Christian" to consider. NConly shares the passage from Acts where disciples were first called "Christians" so according to the scriptural definition, a Christian is a disciple of Jesus Christ. The problem we encounter has to do with a widespread compulsion to judge others to determine if they are a "true" Christian or not. There is only one whom we ought to judge in such a way, and that one is our own selves. As for others, the commandment of the Lord is clear and concise; to wit, that we love one another as He loves us and, love our neighbor as ourselves. Both of those commandments are one and the same. That has nothing to do with judging teaching and the like, something we are called upon to do so that we don't find ourselves led astray. However, abstaining from accusatory finger-pointing and rhetoric is the rule to be sure for we are only judging doctrine, not individuals with regard to their standing with the Lord. Correction in meekness is called for, not accusation and strife. It is not our place to judge whether someone else is a "true Christian" or not, either. Why? We simply don't know, brother. The one who is judged and slandered by the self-righteous will be revealed as the beloved of the Lord. The unrighteous judge will be judged by the same measure by the Lord Himself. Edited March 30 by Marathoner typo and clarity 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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