What happened to the thread

[Bill]

Angeldei:

I agree with your thoughts.

However, it appears that some people don't think similarly and until we're all devout Catholics they won't.

We used to have a Catholic/Protestant discussion forum. I think by the tone of this thread you can see why it's gone.

It's not about a church. Religion kills. Christ is life.

[Catsmeow]

I have told them the Truth ....plain truth - scripture in context. But they refuse to acknowledge scripture in it's infallibility and resort to the Roman Catholic Catechism as their holy book.

These are not interested in truth, as revealed in scripture. They are the spirit of contention, bored with their own website, they come to bring division and chaos.

It appears they're succeeding.

Jude verse 10 But these speak evil of whatever they do not know; and whatever they know naturally, like brute beasts, in these things they corrupt themselves.

This is a corrupt influence which prides itself on man-made religion.

God-man: I am not personally in favor of resurrecting the Catholic-Protestant forum. These individuals are not interested in the truth; they are in bondage to dead religion.

I do not believe this to be of all Catholics but the ones who've appeared on this board do no service to the RCC by their contentious representation.

[Guest Angeledei]

I do not believe this to be of all Catholics but the ones who've appeared on this board do no service to the RCC by their contentious representation.

It is not wise to clump a people as a whole like you do. It's judgemental and against everything Christ taught.

Would you despise every German because of the Holacaust?

[Douay]

I have told them the Truth ....plain truth - scripture in context.

No you didn't.

But they refuse to acknowledge scripture in it's infallibility and resort to the Roman Catholic Catechism as their holy book.

The catechism relies on scripture. The Catholic Church gave the original stamp of approval on the infallibility of scripture by saying that it was inspired by God.

These are not interested in truth, as revealed in scripture.

We were proving the truth with scripture, now that it's gone I suppose you can remember it however you like.

But these speak evil of whatever they do not know; and whatever they know naturally, like brute beasts, in these things they corrupt themselves.

Apply this to yourself alone.

This is a corrupt influence which prides itself on man-made religion.

By "this" did you mean yourself and whatever 'religion' you have. Man founded Protestantism and formed the beliefs held by its members today.

Douay

[Ovedya]

god-man

You are still wrong about the definition of Nicholas.  Nicholas is an english translation from the greek name Nikolaos.  Nike(VICTORY not victor) and lous(people).

Nikos in the Greek means "victory." True. It also means "To vanquish." The root form is "Nike."

"Laodikeus" literally means "An inhabitant of Laodicea." It's roots are "Laos" and "Dike" Laos refers to common people, and Dike means "justice, a sentence of condemnation, the execttion of a sentence, or avenging justice."

According to the above, I believe it is more appropriate to render the name as "victor of the people," meaning that Nicolas' position in the church was over the people as a ruler. This is beared out with Scriptural evidence as well.

In the New Testament Nicolas was one of the seven deacons in Antioch (Acts 6:5). This is his position of authority over the people. Now, according to the text, he was a proselyte. A proselyte is one who has come over from a Gentile religion (paganism, basically) to Judaism. On the surface it seemed that Nicolas was one who also received Christ. However, according to the book of Revelation Nicolas apparently separated himself from the church and began mixing paganism with Christian practice, and teaching these things to the saints. Smith's Bible Dictionary gives an explaination:

"(followers of Nicolas ), a sect mentioned in (Revelation 2:6,15) whose deeds were strongly condemned. They may have been identical with those who held the doctrine of Balaam. They seem to have held that it was lawful to eat things sacrificed to idols, and to commit fornication, in opposition to the decree of the Church rendered in (Acts 15:20,29) The teachers of the Church branded them with a name which expressed their true character. The men who did and taught such things were followers of Balaam. (2 Peter 2:15; Jude 1:11) They, like the false prophet of Pethor, united brave words with evil deeds. In a time of persecution, when the eating or not eating of things sacrificed to idols was more than ever a crucial test of faithfulness, they persuaded men more than ever that was a thing indifferent. (Revelation 2:13,14) This was bad enough, but there was a yet worse evil. Mingling themselves in the orgies of idolatrous feasts, they brought the impurities of those feasts into the meetings of the Christian Church. And all this was done, it must be remembered not simply as an indulgence of appetite: but as a part of a system, supported by a "doctrine," accompanied by the boast of a prophetic illumination, (2 Peter 2:1) It confirms the view which has been taken of their character to find that stress is laid in the first instance on the "deeds" of the Nicolaitans.

Some disagree that it was the Nicolas of Acts 6:5 that committed these attrocities. But I believe that it very well could have been, given that Nicolas was a convert from paganism to Judaism, then to Christianity. There may have been some great Nicolas' over the centuries, but this certainly was not one of them.

Peace.

[Catsmeow]

You appear to have a "literary" challenge and trouble in basic reading comprehension.

The post above you clearly states that I don't have a problem with other Catholics...only the ones who've come to THIS board and stir of strife.

I've been patient with you and tried to present the truth to you. What you do is ignore what is given to you and show your mastery of "cut and paste"...along with your contentious debates.

I have no problem with Cathoics who post on their own sites and share their beliefs among those who agree with them.

It's when you come to an evangelical site and stir up strife. Thankfully, I don't believe most Catholics would be so rude.

You (personally) do not do your own religion justice by YOUR attitude. Your spirit is one I'm familiar with...full of strife and contention.

You serve no purpose to uplift the Body of Christ...you have an agenda....to promote your religion...Roman Catholicm...not Christ Jesus.

Maybe if you read my post again...and this time, read for "comprehension"...you'll see that's made plain.

I strongly suspect you don't really read posts..you gloss over them quickly and then post something that makes absolutely no sense.

[Ovedya]

God-man: I am not personally in favor of resurrecting the Catholic-Protestant forum. These individuals are not interested in the truth; they are in bondage to dead religion.

I do not believe this to be of all Catholics but the ones who've appeared on this board do no service to the RCC by their contentious representation.

I think that it's important to remember that these folks are trying to represent the Catholic view in a forum that is mostly opposed to RC religion and dogma. Whether they are in bondage or whether we are lacking the truth is a matter of viewpoint. The Protestant says, "You are in bondage to dead religion. You need to see the truth, to know Christ as I do." The Catholic responds "You are lacking the truth. The truth is in the Catholic church. In order for you to know the church you must become a Catholic."

Whereas our Catholic friends are not the officials of the church, I believe they have the right to defend to the best of their ability their understanding of what the church teaches. Just as we also defend to the best of our ability the truths we have been taught by our faith. I think we all need mutual respect in this struggle to help each other understand. If there can be no mutual ground found (rhyme not intended), then maybe it's best to drop it altogether?

Cats, you had a PM discussion with munari not too long ago. I think you said at one point that munari was beginning to open up. I wonder what you did, or rather, what the Lord did in you, to help her to open up? Perhaps that kind of spirit can be employed here? Just a thought.

[Douay]

Sagz-

is religion more important than God?

How could it be? He started it.

Could religion become an idol?

Sure, I guess men can worship anything, but I can't think of any way.

Is tradition more important than Scripture?

Is the constitution more important than the supreme court? No, they work together and not apart.

Is Mary more important that Jesus?

No. I would like to point out that Mary has never been as big as it is said so often on these boards. Catholicism is not based around Mary. Why do you think that?

Is there any man infallible other than Christ our Lord?

I would like to know where in scripture it says that he was infallible. The answer is no man is infallible.

Has God bestowed infallibility upon any man alive.....ever?

Obviously you believe this is true, the authors of the Bible were infallible if what they wrote is.

The difference in my answers is permanent versus temporary infallibility.

Are you willing to search these answers out relying only on Scripture?

If we have to, but I would not, like Martin Luther said "to be a Christian you must pluck the eye of reason out" . I would like to be allowed to make points that are intuitively obvious to even the most casual observer without having to write dissertations and quote the whole Bible to back it up.

Are you willing to listen to us present our thoughts, or are you here only to bash us? (Something which is violently discouraged in your forum)

I could respond with are you willing to listen to us present our thoughts, or does Protestantism exist only to protest us? I'm all for discussion of the things taht will come up here but we will disagree a lot of the time. Let's just try to stay civil and professional as much as possible. I seem, however, to fight dirty when the like is done to me.

Are you able to see us (trying to) reach out to you in love?

Not as a whole, most definitely, but some, yes.

Are you going to ignore these honest questions?

nope

Will you answer them in your own words?

sure will

Or will you use the words of a long dead priest, father, bishope(sp) or anything else?

That may happen from time to time when they say exactly what we mean, but if you want to establish the rule of no using other's work, then sure I can make my own posts and read what others have written for information kept to myself.

Douay

[Ovedya]

Just a quick point, Duay, not really integral to the discussion...

The United States Consitution is superior to the supreme court. The Constitution is the ruling document of the United States. The supreme court's job is to uphold the constitution. Therefore the constitution is greater than the supreme court.

[Catsmeow]

No. I would like to point out that Mary has never been as big as it is said so often on these boards. Catholicism is not based around Mary. Why do you think that?

Uh, duh...no, I think we were all just born yesterday! Mary, Queen of the Universe..uh, yea...sure. We believe you, buddy.