Revised: Veiling or Blinding from Gods light on sinners will perish&#3

[Guest lnj]

I would not preach this

Just out of curiosity Stafy, are you a Preacher?

(No). I'm not sure if I know what a preacher actually is? One of those terms which fits inbetween pastor and teacher is my quess.

So you don't teach the Word from the pulpit? Ok.

[MeCajunboy]

If you ever need scriptural evidence to support or fellowhship with another in the Word of God,who you feel or suspect are being "veiled" from the WORD , and you want to show them how very important it is to get in right standing with God: 2 Corinthians 4: 3-6 If the Good News we preach is veiled from anyone, it is a sign that they are perishing. Satan, the god of this evil world, has blinded the minds of those who don't believe, so they are unable to see the glorious light of the Good News that is shining upon them. the don't understand the message we preach about the glory of Christ, who is the exact likeness of God. Also, note "exact likeness of God," which should tell you of the "trinity!" or the "three persons in one God," which ever church you were trained in. This is taken from the NLT College study Bible

Did you know? Or comments invited?

So, you're just speaking of the "pearls to the swine" deal then, right? Some just won't comprehend the message(s) of the Scriptures because they are blinded by their own wickedness or worse because God doesn't allow them to see it at the moment, and thus it is a sign that they are perishing? of course then, anyone who doesn't take God's Word seriously, and believe in Him is perishing. It kind of comes off as another way to say that some are unbelievers because of what they don't understand, and it returns to the person who feels that way or says something things, as credit to himself for being better than that person who doesn't comprehend because the one who does is obviously liked enough by God that God reveals His Word to him. At least it sounds that way if you're just speaking of those who do bother to study the Bible but keep missing out on a lot.

Cajunboy::::

Ouch? Let's see. "pearls to a swine Deal?" O.K. I think I can agree with that, if we consider the "gift of God's commands as the Pearls and the "swine" as the sinner, then YES!

YOU::::

You said, "It kind of comes off as another way to say that some are unbelievers because of what they don't understand,"

I would rather use the phrase, "that some are unbelievers because they refuse to "repent of their sin (s)" rather than refer to it as they don't understand, because God has already told us in "HIS WORD" that "every man shall know me and my commands." So with that thought I'd have to deduce why God gives us a "choice" of right and wrong and the knowledge, wisdom and ability to choose between the both.

YOU:::::

"If the Good News we preach is veiled from anyone, it is a sign that they are perishing." This was everyone before they believed, and maybe God has a certain timing planned out for those who don't believe right away?

Cajunboy:::: Not exactly. There is a difference between "refusing to believe" and "learning and gaining knowledge, wisdom to choose right from wong." and from what I've witnessed, I'm guessing that most of us take our entire lives to fully learn the righteousness of God and that we should put HIM before ALL things and include HIM in ALL decisions. Of course, not the minor everyday "what to eat" decisions, although it could possibly be for someone who has trouble controlling their urges to overeat, and in that case they might want to "go to God first"

But I am discerning and appreciate that you took the time and effort to comprehend 2 Cor 3 & 4 as I can see that it is just as important as most other warnings through Paul from Jesus Christ!

[stafy]

I would not preach this

Just out of curiosity Stafy, are you a Preacher?

(No). I'm not sure if I know what a preacher actually is? One of those terms which fits inbetween pastor and teacher is my quess.

So you don't teach the Word from the pulpit? Ok.

I did not say that

[Guest lnj]

I would not preach this

Just out of curiosity Stafy, are you a Preacher?

(No). I'm not sure if I know what a preacher actually is? One of those terms which fits inbetween pastor and teacher is my quess.

So you don't teach the Word from the pulpit? Ok.

I did not say that

No problemo!

[Guest Biblicist]

2 Corinthians 3:14-16 14 But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away. 15 Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. 16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

Veil ~ kaluma {kal'-oo-mah}

1) a veil, covering

The veil covering is the covering over people's hearts that do not know Christ as saviour. As you see in verse 16 it says, whenever anyone turns to the Lord the veil is taken away. This does reference when Moses removed the veil as he was with God, however in verse 14, only in Christ is it taken away. Therefore I believe when 'all peoples & all nations' is refered to [isaiah 25:7] I do not think that Paul was talking about believer's who just "don't get it" yet. I believe he is talking about Salvation.

Paralell references: v. 13 Romans 11:25 25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in.

v. 14. Romans 11:7-8 7 What then? What Israel sought so earnestly it did not obtain, but the elect did. The others were hardened, 8 as it is written:

"God gave them a spirit of stupor,

eyes so that they could not see

and ears so that they could not hear,

to this very day."

2 Corinthians 4:3&4 3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. 4 The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

v. 16 Isaiah 25:7 7 On this mountain he will destroy

the shroud that enfolds all peoples,

the sheet that covers all nations;

Romans 11:23 23And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

The whole context is not just 2 Corinthians 3&4, the context is Scripture and everything contained there.

[MeCajunboy]

2 Corinthians 3:14-16 14 But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away. 15 Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. 16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

Veil ~ kaluma {kal'-oo-mah}

1) a veil, covering

The veil covering is the covering over people's hearts that do not know Christ as saviour. As you see in verse 16 it says, whenever anyone turns to the Lord the veil is taken away. This does reference when Moses removed the veil as he was with God, however in verse 14, only in Christ is it taken away. Therefore I believe when 'all peoples & all nations' is refered to [isaiah 25:7] I do not think that Paul was talking about believer's who just "don't get it" yet. I believe he is talking about Salvation.

Paralell references: v. 13 Romans 11:25 25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in.

v. 14. Romans 11:7-8 7 What then? What Israel sought so earnestly it did not obtain, but the elect did. The others were hardened, 8 as it is written:

"God gave them a spirit of stupor,

eyes so that they could not see

and ears so that they could not hear,

to this very day."

2 Corinthians 4:3&4 3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. 4 The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

v. 16 Isaiah 25:7 7 On this mountain he will destroy

the shroud that enfolds all peoples,

the sheet that covers all nations;

Romans 11:23 23And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

The whole context is not just 2 Corinthians 3&4, the context is Scripture and everything contained there.

I too have "parallels" of reference to coincide with most of the scriptures we read, but I'm more concerned with "what we learn and have experienced" from what we read. Is it not evident to YOU that "when we sin" we are struck away from God for a time until we either "repent" or "perish" for those who are more determined to sin? This has happened to me in my experiences with sin.

[Guest Biblicist]

I too have "parallels" of reference to coincide with most of the scriptures we read, but I'm more concerned with "what we learn and have experienced" from what we read. Is it not evident to YOU that "when we sin" we are struck away from God for a time until we either "repent" or "perish" for those who are more determined to sin? This has happened to me in my experiences with sin.

I am very aware that when we sin we separate ourselves from God. But this passage does not speak about that. From what I have learned and experienced from these scripture verses, it's refering to those who have not yet been redeemed. Those who's eyes, hearts, have been vailed from The Truth. "But their minds were made dull."

I wonder if maybe you might be reading too much into these verses. Trying to hard.

[heartofstone]

Yeah, I thought too that it was just speaking of the not-yet-redeemed. It doesn't make sense to them either, just as possibly it might not make sense to one who has fallen away?

Edited March 1, 2007 by heartofstone