Floatingaxe Posted May 4, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted May 4, 2007 I beleived Jesus was the human manifestation of the creator. I still do. There is historic evidence for this. I had no trouble admitting I was a sinner. I asked him to save me and it was very sincere. Perhaps he has saved me from the hell to come but not from the destruction of my marriage, career, ability to enjoy life with my sons and health. My condition prevents me from even attending church.. As for Job. He was a great man but I, nor anyone else I know has the same kind of connection that Job had to his creator as the Old Book told it. The more I live and the more I watch whats going on even in the Christian world (people I love the most), it all seems more phoney by the day. I was a phoney. I acted like I had a relationship with a personal God. There is no evidence. I'm tired of acting. I have more peace with being honest. The truth is that I wanted very much to have what so many Christians claim to have but I never got it because its ungettable do to the fact that it does not exist. Many claim to have it and perhaps its healthy for them to believe it. We invent this "personal relationship" thing because its extremely painful to try to deal with the fact that we are really alone. All we have is each other and ourselves. I think thats why I like what Christ taught. He taught us to love one another. Maybe in that indirect way, he does touch us. But I am sure that supernatural events are not in the plan. I have never witnessed what I would call a true supernatural miricle. I have never heard God speak and I question the sanity of those who say they have. I believe they are phoney or just a good hearted person who is delusional. The only person that can get me past this mess is me. Before I waited on God. Its better for me to start living in the real world. Dan You may be saved from hellfire, but you do not claim your victory! Don't be too sure on the former, either, for lukewarmness will get us separated from Christ as well. Your saying that you have more peace now that you have resigned yourself to being "honest"...I believe that is a false peace that the devil is giving you! So typical! The devil is telling you lies and causing you to think that we must STRIVE! The truth is, there is no striving! Just resting in Jesus and His precious promises! Everything you say about being alone is just exactly what Satan it telling you and you are lapping it out of his palm. He is showing you others and causing you to sit there and make armchair judgments on who? The people of GOD? Phony he says? Hardly! While there are hypocrites among us, that is no reason for you to think you must emulate hypocrisy! What stupid logic Satan has! Please--you are never alone! Either you are joined up with Jesus, heading for glory, or you are joined up with Satan, heading for destruction. There you WILL be alone. FOREVER. Yuck. Do not rely on yourself for your own deliverance from this--you are dust, and unreliable. Trust only in Jesus Christ, who took your pain, sin and sorrow upon His very body and lives again for you...so you can also live! What a gift! He took my pain? No I don't think so. I'm in a truckload of pain and have been for quite some time. No its still here. All of it. I\m not anti-Christian by the way. I think most Christians are under the same delusion I was. We all have moments of hypocrocy. me included but I feel less hypocritical by simply telling the truth. I use to go around saying things like "God is with me through this" or "he's just trying to teach me something". Thats crazy. Dan Oh He took your pain, alright, but you refuse to give it up. Some people like their pain. It's a hobby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgolvach Posted May 4, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 110 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,254 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2007 I beleived Jesus was the human manifestation of the creator. I still do. There is historic evidence for this. I had no trouble admitting I was a sinner. I asked him to save me and it was very sincere. Perhaps he has saved me from the hell to come but not from the destruction of my marriage, career, ability to enjoy life with my sons and health. My condition prevents me from even attending church.. As for Job. He was a great man but I, nor anyone else I know has the same kind of connection that Job had to his creator as the Old Book told it. The more I live and the more I watch whats going on even in the Christian world (people I love the most), it all seems more phoney by the day. I was a phoney. I acted like I had a relationship with a personal God. There is no evidence. I'm tired of acting. I have more peace with being honest. The truth is that I wanted very much to have what so many Christians claim to have but I never got it because its ungettable do to the fact that it does not exist. Many claim to have it and perhaps its healthy for them to believe it. We invent this "personal relationship" thing because its extremely painful to try to deal with the fact that we are really alone. All we have is each other and ourselves. I think thats why I like what Christ taught. He taught us to love one another. Maybe in that indirect way, he does touch us. But I am sure that supernatural events are not in the plan. I have never witnessed what I would call a true supernatural miricle. I have never heard God speak and I question the sanity of those who say they have. I believe they are phoney or just a good hearted person who is delusional. The only person that can get me past this mess is me. Before I waited on God. Its better for me to start living in the real world. Dan You may be saved from hellfire, but you do not claim your victory! Don't be too sure on the former, either, for lukewarmness will get us separated from Christ as well. Your saying that you have more peace now that you have resigned yourself to being "honest"...I believe that is a false peace that the devil is giving you! So typical! The devil is telling you lies and causing you to think that we must STRIVE! The truth is, there is no striving! Just resting in Jesus and His precious promises! Everything you say about being alone is just exactly what Satan it telling you and you are lapping it out of his palm. He is showing you others and causing you to sit there and make armchair judgments on who? The people of GOD? Phony he says? Hardly! While there are hypocrites among us, that is no reason for you to think you must emulate hypocrisy! What stupid logic Satan has! Please--you are never alone! Either you are joined up with Jesus, heading for glory, or you are joined up with Satan, heading for destruction. There you WILL be alone. FOREVER. Yuck. Do not rely on yourself for your own deliverance from this--you are dust, and unreliable. Trust only in Jesus Christ, who took your pain, sin and sorrow upon His very body and lives again for you...so you can also live! What a gift! He took my pain? No I don't think so. I'm in a truckload of pain and have been for quite some time. No its still here. All of it. I\m not anti-Christian by the way. I think most Christians are under the same delusion I was. We all have moments of hypocrocy. me included but I feel less hypocritical by simply telling the truth. I use to go around saying things like "God is with me through this" or "he's just trying to teach me something". Thats crazy. Dan Oh He took your pain, alright, but you refuse to give it up. Some people like their pain. It's a hobby. This is truely one of the most cruelest, flipant statements I've ever heard. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 5, 2007 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 5, 2007 I beleived Jesus was the human manifestation of the creator. I still do. There is historic evidence for this. I had no trouble admitting I was a sinner. I asked him to save me and it was very sincere. Perhaps he has saved me from the hell to come but not from the destruction of my marriage, career, ability to enjoy life with my sons and health. My condition prevents me from even attending church.. As for Job. He was a great man but I, nor anyone else I know has the same kind of connection that Job had to his creator as the Old Book told it. The more I live and the more I watch whats going on even in the Christian world (people I love the most), it all seems more phoney by the day. I was a phoney. I acted like I had a relationship with a personal God. There is no evidence. I'm tired of acting. I have more peace with being honest. The truth is that I wanted very much to have what so many Christians claim to have but I never got it because its ungettable do to the fact that it does not exist. Many claim to have it and perhaps its healthy for them to believe it. We invent this "personal relationship" thing because its extremely painful to try to deal with the fact that we are really alone. All we have is each other and ourselves. I think thats why I like what Christ taught. He taught us to love one another. Maybe in that indirect way, he does touch us. But I am sure that supernatural events are not in the plan. I have never witnessed what I would call a true supernatural miricle. I have never heard God speak and I question the sanity of those who say they have. I believe they are phoney or just a good hearted person who is delusional. The only person that can get me past this mess is me. Before I waited on God. Its better for me to start living in the real world. Dan You may be saved from hellfire, but you do not claim your victory! Don't be too sure on the former, either, for lukewarmness will get us separated from Christ as well. Your saying that you have more peace now that you have resigned yourself to being "honest"...I believe that is a false peace that the devil is giving you! So typical! The devil is telling you lies and causing you to think that we must STRIVE! The truth is, there is no striving! Just resting in Jesus and His precious promises! Everything you say about being alone is just exactly what Satan it telling you and you are lapping it out of his palm. He is showing you others and causing you to sit there and make armchair judgments on who? The people of GOD? Phony he says? Hardly! While there are hypocrites among us, that is no reason for you to think you must emulate hypocrisy! What stupid logic Satan has! Please--you are never alone! Either you are joined up with Jesus, heading for glory, or you are joined up with Satan, heading for destruction. There you WILL be alone. FOREVER. Yuck. Do not rely on yourself for your own deliverance from this--you are dust, and unreliable. Trust only in Jesus Christ, who took your pain, sin and sorrow upon His very body and lives again for you...so you can also live! What a gift! He took my pain? No I don't think so. I'm in a truckload of pain and have been for quite some time. No its still here. All of it. I\m not anti-Christian by the way. I think most Christians are under the same delusion I was. We all have moments of hypocrocy. me included but I feel less hypocritical by simply telling the truth. I use to go around saying things like "God is with me through this" or "he's just trying to teach me something". Thats crazy. Dan Oh He took your pain, alright, but you refuse to give it up. Some people like their pain. It's a hobby. This is truely one of the most cruelest, flipant statements I've ever heard. Dan Why not start using capital letters when you refer to |God? That's called respect . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgolvach Posted May 5, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 110 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,254 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted May 5, 2007 I beleived Jesus was the human manifestation of the creator. I still do. There is historic evidence for this. I had no trouble admitting I was a sinner. I asked him to save me and it was very sincere. Perhaps he has saved me from the hell to come but not from the destruction of my marriage, career, ability to enjoy life with my sons and health. My condition prevents me from even attending church.. As for Job. He was a great man but I, nor anyone else I know has the same kind of connection that Job had to his creator as the Old Book told it. The more I live and the more I watch whats going on even in the Christian world (people I love the most), it all seems more phoney by the day. I was a phoney. I acted like I had a relationship with a personal God. There is no evidence. I'm tired of acting. I have more peace with being honest. The truth is that I wanted very much to have what so many Christians claim to have but I never got it because its ungettable do to the fact that it does not exist. Many claim to have it and perhaps its healthy for them to believe it. We invent this "personal relationship" thing because its extremely painful to try to deal with the fact that we are really alone. All we have is each other and ourselves. I think thats why I like what Christ taught. He taught us to love one another. Maybe in that indirect way, he does touch us. But I am sure that supernatural events are not in the plan. I have never witnessed what I would call a true supernatural miricle. I have never heard God speak and I question the sanity of those who say they have. I believe they are phoney or just a good hearted person who is delusional. The only person that can get me past this mess is me. Before I waited on God. Its better for me to start living in the real world. Dan You may be saved from hellfire, but you do not claim your victory! Don't be too sure on the former, either, for lukewarmness will get us separated from Christ as well. Your saying that you have more peace now that you have resigned yourself to being "honest"...I believe that is a false peace that the devil is giving you! So typical! The devil is telling you lies and causing you to think that we must STRIVE! The truth is, there is no striving! Just resting in Jesus and His precious promises! Everything you say about being alone is just exactly what Satan it telling you and you are lapping it out of his palm. He is showing you others and causing you to sit there and make armchair judgments on who? The people of GOD? Phony he says? Hardly! While there are hypocrites among us, that is no reason for you to think you must emulate hypocrisy! What stupid logic Satan has! Please--you are never alone! Either you are joined up with Jesus, heading for glory, or you are joined up with Satan, heading for destruction. There you WILL be alone. FOREVER. Yuck. Do not rely on yourself for your own deliverance from this--you are dust, and unreliable. Trust only in Jesus Christ, who took your pain, sin and sorrow upon His very body and lives again for you...so you can also live! What a gift! He took my pain? No I don't think so. I'm in a truckload of pain and have been for quite some time. No its still here. All of it. I\m not anti-Christian by the way. I think most Christians are under the same delusion I was. We all have moments of hypocrocy. me included but I feel less hypocritical by simply telling the truth. I use to go around saying things like "God is with me through this" or "he's just trying to teach me something". Thats crazy. Dan Oh He took your pain, alright, but you refuse to give it up. Some people like their pain. It's a hobby. This is truely one of the most cruelest, flipant statements I've ever heard. Dan Why not start using capital letters when you refer to |God? That's called respect . My typing stinks and I can't see the stupid screen well enough to tell capitals from small case letters.. I don't hate God nor do I mean to disrespect him. I believe he exists but I simply have zero faith in him. Why lie? I don't think he is all that concerned with people like me. I never said he should be. He dosen't owe me anything. How strong is my faith? No No! How strong is your delusion that God actually magically pops into your life in times of need? In all honesty(and I truelly mean this) I wish you were right and I was wrong but reality says I'm right. God is not personal. Why should he be? I would love nothing better than to be wrong on this. I didn't sign up to be Job. All I wanted was to live a simple little life. I'm at peace with no longer lying to myself or anyone else about my lack of faith. I wanted to fit in with Christians because I prefer their company. A "Father type God" would be grand. I need one! believe me! Its rough down here but you can't make something exist that does not exist and just because you believe it doesn't make it so. People have believed myths since the the dawn of time. It might even be healthy on a mental level but it still dosen't make it reality. At some point you have to deal with the "way it really is" as opposed to "the way you would like it to be". I'm sorry if I'm offending people but its just a conversation with opinions. The question on this thread was "How strong is your faith?" . If you don't like my answer you can all get together and have me banned from this board. Perhaps the thread should have read " How strongly do you agree with what I believe?" I gave an honest answer. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metropolitan Posted May 5, 2007 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 84 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/09/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/17/1975 Share Posted May 5, 2007 Dan...I have been reading your posts with great interests..And in some way i can relate to your experiences...I have some thoughts for you And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that you, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work. {2 Cor 9:8 KJV} Notice that the apostle begins where we should always begin in our thinking about Christianity -- with the power of God: "God is able," he says. There is nothing more evident today than the present weakness of the church. I am glad to see encouraging signs of renewal occurring here and there throughout the church, but in many places and in very many ways the church is exceedingly weak, and it is weak because it has forgotten or lost sight of the power of God. That is the basic problem with the church. It has only one kind of power it can operate on, and that is God's power. If it loses that, it is reduced to the same power the world or any worldly organization has -- the power of numbers, the power of political maneuvering, or the power of moral constraint..It is only the power of God that can do that kind of thing. But I am often surprised to find many Christians who do not believe in God's power to do other things. They do not say this, but it is reflected in their attitudes and comments. There are half a dozen verses in the New Testament that use the phrase, "God is able." It is helpful to think about what is stated in those verses: "God is able to keep you from falling." God is able to subdue all things unto himself. "And God is able to provide you with every blessing in abundance What is grace? Remember the small boy who was asked in Sunday school, "What is grace?" He thought the man said, grease, and replied, "It's what makes the face shine." He was right, because grace does make the face shine -- better than grease. Grace is a general term for all that God is, made available to us. It is God's character, God's virtue, all God's Being made available to us. "To make the invisible Christ visible," that is God's grace. The life of Jesus Christ in us, supplied to us, living through us, ministering to our every need, that is grace, the glory of Christianity. If your Christianity does not have that note in it, it is a false Christianity. That is what Christian faith is all about. "Christ in you, the hope of glory" {Col 1:27} Grace has one peculiar mark about it. It is a gift. It cannot be purchased, it cannot be worked for. It is unmerited. That is the problem. That is why a great many Christians do not know anything about the power of God, because that power comes only through the channel of grace. They keep trying to bargain for God's power, but if you bargain for it, then it is no longer grace. To bargain with God is like turning off the tap. You cannot experience the power of God if you are trying to earn it. Paul, writing to the Romans, says, "It is either grace or works. And if it is works, then it is no more grace; if it is grace, then it is no more works," { Rom 11:6}. to be contd... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metropolitan Posted May 5, 2007 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 84 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/09/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/17/1975 Share Posted May 5, 2007 .....One cancels out the other...The moment we say,"Lord , if i do this for you, will you do that for me?" This is why many Christians cannot get hold of the power of God...God's power cannot come by any other channel than God's grace. Why should this happen to me?" with the implication, "I've been living the kind of life that deserves more than this. God shouldn't do this kind of thing to me." That shows they have been trying to bargain for the grace of God but you cannot do it. You can have all God's power freely if you do not try to bargain for it. He will give it to you, but you cannot buy it at any store. You can have all you need if you will just take it. If you present yourself, and say, "Lord, I'm not much, but here I am, and all I am I put at your disposal," then he will take the greatness of his Being, displayed in many, many ways, and put it at your disposal, saying, "Whatever you need you can take." That is what grace does. The tendency to bargain is therefore found in the complaints of christians who keep falling out of the grace of God.. God is able to provide...But for that you must allow Gods grace to work in you..He does not put you on rations and say, "Sorry, you can only have a little bit, there's not quite enough." No, you can have all it takes, any time. He will give you exactly what you need, but never too much. Yes..exactly what you need..remember the manna from heaven...Just enough for the day, never enough for the next day The bread and fishes that our Lord multiplied were enough for everyone and a little bit left over, but everyone had all they needed. "As thy day, so shall thy strength be," { Deut 33:25 KJV} So many Christians fails to get this as they think that the blessings of the Christian life are designed to make them happy. They always want a good feeling. That is why some people come to church. They only want a good feeling, something that makes them feel a little better as they go out, and they are satisfied if it has done that for them. Some want a riot of emotionalism, to work up a sort of religious "jag" once a week, which will serve to carry them until the next week. But this is not what God is aiming at. It is that you may be involved in doing good works, as the Lord Jesus, who "went about doing good," {Acts 10:38}. That was his purpose. That will involve speaking the truth, and practicing love, self-denying love, toward another. There is the formula to change the world. Just too many thoughts....les time..Be back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 6, 2007 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 6, 2007 Hi Dan, Why do you think you could be banned from this board, because you can't believe in God anymore? I believe you got on this forum because God led you here and we love to talk to you, I'm no better then you and its only by grace I am saved and not by anything I did myself, so I can not boast . Why not give God another chance ,He does loves you and want you back in His arms, you will not be dissapointed What if tomorow would be your last day here on earth? After that you WILL stand before the Lord and what would you say?? Dan, God loves you as much as He loves me, and He is waiting for you to return into His loving arms,why not give him another chance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgolvach Posted May 6, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 110 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,254 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted May 6, 2007 Hi Dan, Why do you think you could be banned from this board, because you can't believe in God anymore? I believe you got on this forum because God led you here and we love to talk to you, I'm no better then you and its only by grace I am saved and not by anything I did myself, so I can not boast . Why not give God another chance ,He does loves you and want you back in His arms, you will not be dissapointed What if tomorow would be your last day here on earth? After that you WILL stand before the Lord and what would you say?? Dan, God loves you as much as He loves me, and He is waiting for you to return into His loving arms,why not give him another chance? I think I would just have to say to him "I tried to have faith in you...you know I did". Then again, it might just be "lights out". Like sleeping without a dream and it won't matter. The world is full of religions where people are absolutely convinced that their path is the right one. I know Christians believe this and thats OK. Their not the ones making war over it. When you have been submerged in a particular Dogma that tells you that there is only one way...fear makes it hard to be objective. In alot of ways, Christian dogma has been great for civilazation. The one really negative aspect I see is the toxic guilt and shame that we put on ourselves. Not that examining our lives and personal conduct is a bad thing, but in many cases it serves no purpose other than to make us more miserable than we need to be. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarletprayers Posted May 6, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 135 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,537 Content Per Day: 1.08 Reputation: 157 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/06/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/29/1956 Share Posted May 6, 2007 Dan.............this breaks my heart, it really does. I am praying for you, the other times you asked for prayers, this time because since you say you can't pray for yourself, I'm doing it for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 6, 2007 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 6, 2007 Hi Dan, Why do you think you could be banned from this board, because you can't believe in God anymore? I believe you got on this forum because God led you here and we love to talk to you, I'm no better then you and its only by grace I am saved and not by anything I did myself, so I can not boast . Why not give God another chance ,He does loves you and want you back in His arms, you will not be dissapointed What if tomorow would be your last day here on earth? After that you WILL stand before the Lord and what would you say?? Dan, God loves you as much as He loves me, and He is waiting for you to return into His loving arms,why not give him another chance? I think I would just have to say to him "I tried to have faith in you...you know I did". Then again, it might just be "lights out". Like sleeping without a dream and it won't matter. The world is full of religions where people are absolutely convinced that their path is the right one. I know Christians believe this and thats OK. Their not the ones making war over it. When you have been submerged in a particular Dogma that tells you that there is only one way...fear makes it hard to be objective. In alot of ways, Christian dogma has been great for civilazation. The one really negative aspect I see is the toxic guilt and shame that we put on ourselves. Not that examining our lives and personal conduct is a bad thing, but in many cases it serves no purpose other than to make us more miserable than we need to be. Dan Hi Dan, You should tell Jesus "I tried to have faith in you...you know I did you know He's waiting for you to come to Him, you did not come by accident to a christian forum, it was God who sent you here and He's waiting for you to turn your life around, you cannot do this on your own,why not start reading your bible and tell yourself 100 times today that "God so loved this world that He send His only begotten Son so that when Dan believes in Him He shalll not peresh but has EVERLASTING life. And then start claiming the promises from the Bible to yourself and I'm 100% sure God will show Himself to you Dan He loves you know what you went through and is waiting for you to ask for His help, you don't need special words,just tell Him ,Gods its me Dan and I do need you in my life please help my unbelieve He is right there where you are waiting for those words...because He cares for you For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son that if Dan believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. Take care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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