Doctrine Doesn't Matter Examined

[Nebuchadnezza10]

Ok, sorry if ya thought I was a bit vague.

Here, I will give ya my bottom line.

It does matter what church you go to. There is only one church. The church of the bible. The reason for so many denoms is because of interpretation, Right?

Well the verse that I was going to give next was the one Blood Stained Soul mentioned.

2 Peter 1

19 So we have (1) the prophetic word made more (2) sure, to which you do well to pay attention as to (3) a lamp shining in a dark place, until the (4) day dawns and the (5) morning star arises (6) in your hearts.

20 But (7) know this first of all, that (8) no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation,

21 for (9) no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men (10) moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.

It is clear. There is not supposed to be many interpretations of scripture. There is only one. Gods. We have to find it by looking at scripture. So to conclude, not all churches and denominations and sincere people are going to heaven. Only those who are obedient and are sincere.

And as to the JW

[nebula]

OK . . . how do you believe one becomes saved?

Only those who are obedient and are sincere.

Based on what verse(s) again?

And how is this not preaching a gospel of salvation by works?

Edited February 26, 2004 by nebula

[Nebuchadnezza10]

Well nebula, if believe the same thing as you with regards to having to believe to be saved but there are a few other things.

First step is obviously to hear:

Romans 10

17Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ

Well we all know that we have to have faith to be saved, and to get faith we need to hjear the word.

Second is to believe.

Mark 16

16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Here you have to believ to be saved.

Third Confess.

Romans 10

10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

Fourthly is to repent.

Acts 2

38Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Here you have to repent to attain the gift of the HS, which is a pledge of our inheritance of heaven.

(Ephesians 1

13 In Him, you also, after listening to (1) the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation--having also believed, you were (2) sealed in Him with (3) the Holy Spirit of promise,

14 who is (4) given as a pledge of (5) our inheritance, with a view to the (6) redemption of (7) God's own possession, (8) to the praise of His glory)

Fifthly is to be baptised:

Romans 6

3Or don't you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

5If we have been united with him like this in his death, we will certainly also be united with him in his resurrection. 6For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be done away with,[1] that we should no longer be slaves to sin-- 7because anyone who has died has been freed from sin.

8Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, he cannot die again; death no longer has mastery over him. 10The death he died, he died to sin once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God.

11In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. 12Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires.

If we are not baptized we cannot live a new life in heaven.

And lastly we have to grow:

Colossians 1:10

And we pray this in order that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God,

[Nebuchadnezza10]

And as for the works question. What do you mean? Are you asking how

[nebula]

Hey - your last question is confusing me (grammer issue not content issue). So, I'm not sure what you are asking with it.

Second is to believe.

Mark 16

16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Third Confess.

Romans 10

10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

Here is what is troubeling me. You say, "We need to believe" and "We need to confess."

But believe and confess what?

This is the only doctrine that really matters for salvation - What is it that you believe, who is it that you believe in, what do you believe about Him, what are you confessing - specifically?

[Blood Stained Soul]

This is starting to remind me of that old classis comedy skit..."who's on first?"

:oww:

[Nebuchadnezza10]

Sorry if my grammar was a bit off, it had been a long day.

Well as far as belief goes, you have to believe that Jesus is the sone of God and that he died and was raised again to save us from sin.

And we have to confess this.

Romans 10:9

That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

2 Corinthians 9

13Because of the service by which you have proved yourselves, men will praise God for the obedience that accompanies your confession of the gospel of Christ, and for your generosity in sharing with them and with everyone else.

How can you say that this is the only doctrine that we need to be saved. Do not the demons also believe? Yet they are not saved.

So all I need to do is believe and I am saved. Then as soon as I have done that then I can go and sleep around, rob a few banks, murder a few people, and it won

[Guest Bride of Christ]

So all I need to do is believe and I am saved. Then as soon as I have done that then I can go and sleep around, rob a few banks, murder a few people, and it won

[nebula]

Romans 5

1Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God. . . .

9Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God's wrath through him! 10For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life! 11Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation. . . .

19For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous. . . .

21so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 6

1What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? 2By no means! We died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? . . .

11In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. 12Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires. 13Do not offer the parts of your body to sin, as instruments of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God, as those who have been brought from death to life; and offer the parts of your body to him as instruments of righteousness. 14For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace.

15What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! 16Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone to obey him as slaves, you are slaves to the one whom you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17But thanks be to God that, though you used to be slaves to sin, you wholeheartedly obeyed the form of teaching to which you were entrusted. 18You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness. . . .

23For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in[2] Christ Jesus our Lord.

Romans 7

24What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? 25Thanks be to God--through Jesus Christ our Lord!

Romans 8

1Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, 2because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man, 4in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit.

5Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6The mind of sinful man is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; 7the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. 8Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God.

9You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. 10But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. 11And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.

12Therefore, brothers, we have an obligation--but it is not to the sinful nature, to live according to it. 13For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live, 14because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, "Abba, Father." 16The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God's children. 17Now if we are children, then we are heirs--heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.

[Blood Stained Soul]

Simple answer...Hebrews(12th or 13th chapter verse 14) without Holiness no man shall see God...