Certificate to sin?

[Guest jrgraves78]

Is grace a certificate to sin? Does grace afford us an excuse to sin? I believe that we can indeed live a sinless life but I have heard many say that it is impossible to do so, there case is supported by Romans 7, in reference to Paul's desire to do good but how to do good he finds not. But I believe many have misunderstood this scripture and have accepted this as a certificate to sin. What are your thoughts on this? Is a sinless life indeed possible?

[Ovedya]

No to both of your questions.

Grace is not a certificate to sin, and no we cannot live perfect sinless lives. It is simply impossible to live a sinless life - not while we yet inhabit these bodies of death. The point of grace is not that we have an excuse to sin - it is not that we say, "Oh yeah, I can do this because the Lord will cover me." Not at all. Rather, when we do sin, when we "slip" grace is there to give us a way out. John wrote when we sin we have an Advocate with the Father. Therefore, when we pray and ask for forgiveness, God can forgive us because of what Christ accomplished, not because of anything that we can do to erase that sin.

I believe that Paul addressed your question clearly when he wrote, "Shall we sin that grace may abound? God forbid!" Where sin abounds grace superabounds. This only means that when we are caught up in our sinful condition (And sin is very much like and addiction - we can get "lost" in sin for long periods of time it seems), grace is stronger to bring us out, to carry us away from sin through our confession and through the blood of Jesus Christ.

[tsth]

Although I do not believe that we are sinless, I DO however believe that we are learning NOT to sin, by the teaching of "grace", that Christ affords us. The Power of Grace, is also sufficient to help us overcome sin as we listen and learn and mature in Christ Jesus.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, 12 teaching usthat, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age, 13 looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, 14 who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works.

2 Cor. 12:9 And He said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness." Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

1 John 3:4 Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness. 5 And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. 6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him. 7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God. 10 In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother.

In His Love,

Suzanne

[BobTriez]

Is grace a certificate to sin?  Does grace afford us an excuse to sin?  I believe that we can indeed live a sinless life but I have heard many say that it is impossible to do so, there case is supported by Romans 7, in reference to Paul's desire to do good but how to do good he finds not.  But I believe many have misunderstood this scripture and have accepted this as a certificate to sin.  What are your thoughts on this?  Is a sinless life indeed possible?

No & no.....Paul is very clear in Romans 6 that because we are saved by grace, that does not entitle us to sin as we please ( 1 What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? 2 By no means! ).......then he takes it one step further and says immediately following - We died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? )

A true born again Christian will no longer have the desire to sin, and will abhor and despise his sins....that does not mean he is sinless however....In Romans 3:11-12 Paul says - there is no one who understands, no one who seeks God. All have turned away, they have together become worthless; there is no one who does good, not even one.". John also made a very direct statement in 1 John 1:8-9 - 8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

We must be very careful though to examine ourselves and strive to flee from sin - in Hebrews ( 10:26-27 ) we read - "26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God

No grey are there folks - we, being reborn in Christ must strive not to sin...yes, salvation is by grace alone ( Ephesians 2:8-9 ), but to continue to live in sin is simply not conducive to being a Christian. Yes, we all sin, but we are also forgiven of that sin. James says in James 4:7 "Resist the devil, and he will flee from you."...pretty good advice I'd say....

In His service,

Bob

[Khristeeanos]

God's grace is opportunity to do right. With all that He has done for us, what business to we have to disobey His simple commands to believe and persevere?

We need to turn from sin and live a pleasing life before God.

[His son]

These Scriptures make it obvious that we can live sinless lives right Here on this earth, and there are many more where these came from. DO NOT BE DECEIVED BY THE WORDS OF MEN.

John 14:12

12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

(KJV)

John 17:18

18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

(KJV)

John 20:21

21 Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.

(KJV)

Rom 8:1-5

1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

(KJV)

Rom 8:12-13

12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

(KJV)

2 Cor 4:11

11 For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.

(KJV)

Heb 12:4

4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

(KJV)

[BobTriez]

These Scriptures make it obvious that we can live sinless lives right Here on this earth, and there are many more where these came from. DO NOT BE DECEIVED BY THE WORDS OF MEN.

No, you can not. To believe this is a very dangerous belief to have....if you believe that you are now without sin, you would no longer need to daily repent ( what is repentance without sin ? There would be no need ). If you do not repent, you are not acknowledging your sins....if you refuse to acknowledge your sins, you are not saved.

1 John 1:8-9

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

Acknowledgement and repentance is part of your sanctification....to daily admit your faults and then grow from your knowledge that you made a mistake and become closer in your walk with God.

Satan is a liar....don't let him lead you into a false belief that your are without sin....dangerous position to be in! God demands that we humble ourselves and admit our wrong....if you deny that you've done anything wrong, you are not humble and are disobeying God. Do you think the disciples were sinless ? No way! Peter lied ( his denial of Jesus )...and one sin is all it takes to be guilty. Your doctrine is a false doctrine and is a very dangerous doctrine to teach. We are ALL sinners, even after we are born again. To believe otherwise makes you a liar.

I know my words sound harsh, but this is too important to let go....brothers & sisters, we need daily forgiveness! Please, don't ever believe otherwise.

In His service,

Bob

[BoldlyProclaimingChrist]

I'd like to also add that if you believe yourself to be sinless, you are saying that you are like God. You have elevated yourself to equal Godly status.

BobTriez and God-man,

You guys are awesome!!!!

:hug: for both of you

[BobTriez]

I'd like to also add that if you believe yourself to be sinless, you are saying that you are like God. You have elevated yourself to equal Godly status.

Great point....Satan's first lie was to tell Eve that God was a liar -

Genesis 3:4-5

4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

Satan takes the Word of God and taints it to make you believe that you don't need God....he pulled that trick in the garden and he pulls yet today.

When asked how to pray, Jesus responded ( in the Lord's Prayer ) -

Matthew 6:12

12 Forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors.

I find it odd that Jesus would tell us to ask for forgiveness if we didn't need it...that simply goes against the character of Christ.

The whole basis of our faith folks is that we are sinners and there is nothing we can do to pull ourselves out of the mess we got ourselves into....don't go back to the old lie that we can somehow save ourselves, or that we don't need the blood of Christ to cleanse our sins...to believe anything less endangers your soul for all eternity.

In His service,

Bob

[Guest Calamity]

No to both questions. None of us are sinless while we're in this fleshly body. The ONLY SINLESS one was Jesus. We're not Him, and we never will be Him, and while we're in our flesh, we will be sinful, because our FLESH NATURE IS SINFUL, and goes against God. God is a Spirit, and we are told to worship Him in Spirit and in Truth. We cannot be 'perfect' in this body of flesh.

..."flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption."

Sounds to me like we are "corrupt" or sinful, as long as we are flesh and blood. If we were sinless, then why couldn't we go on to Heaven in our flesh and blood body? Why get a new one, if this one can be sinless?

Tell me what this passage means:

I Cor. 15

[39] All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds.

[40] There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

[41] There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.

[42] So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

[43] It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

[44] It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

[45] And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

[46] Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

[47] The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

[48] As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

[49] And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

[50] Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

To me, it means we are sinful as long as we are in our flesh and blood body. The only One who wasn't, was Jesus. That's why He could be the PERFECT sacrifice for us. He, and He alone was sinless while still in His fleshly body.