Heaven?

[Massorite]

Often children are told that when you die, you go to Heaven. My whole life I believed that as well, That if I put my faith and trust in Jesus I would go to Heaven, and if any one rejects Christ, they would go to Hell.

I know when Jesus comes for the second time, we will be his people and he will be with us again once and for all , but where?

First of all don't just take my word for it but look for it your self because there is not one single scripture in all of the bible that says that when we die we will go to heaven. The bible says that when we die our flesh turns back to the dust it was made from and our spirit (that is the breath of life) goes back to God who gave it. But the bible says nothing about our souls and where they will be going.

There are many who teach and even my Pastor just this Sunday stated that the bible says "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord' But that is mis-leading and not at all biblical.

2 Corinthians 5:8 say "We are confident, Isay, and WILLING RATHER TO BE ABSENT from the body, AND to be present with the Lord". This verse is saying that we WOULD RATHER be absent from the body and present with the Lord. This verse DOESN'T say that "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord".

Heaven is the abode (dwelling place) of God and no one is ever going to spend eternity in heaven. We will be going to heaven but only for a brief period of time.

When Jesus comes back He will pick us (His Bride) up and present us to His father as an acceptable gift. We will be standing before the throne of God when this is done. Next we will partake in the wedding supper and when we are finished we will be coming back down to earth to spend eternity on a new earth and in a new Jerusalem with 300 hundred foot tall walls.

[givennewname]

Heaven is a plce where God is present with his people and hell is just the opposite where there is eternal seperation from the presence of God. The book of Revelation says that the old earth, old heaven and the people who are lost are all cast into the lake of eternal fire and there is a New heaven and New earth and a New Jerusalem where God will be forever with his people.

[Celt]

Per God's Word, both paradise and hell are in HEAVEN. The difference is there's a great gulf fixed border between them (Luke 16). Everyone want's to go to heaven, but to which side should be the question.

Luke 23:42-43

42 And he said unto Jesus, "Lord, remember me when Thou comest into Thy kingdom."

43 And Jesus said unto him, "Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with Me in paradise."

(KJV)

Hades and Paradise are not in heaven, but in the earth.

Matthew 12:40

For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Luke 16:19-31 (New King James Version)

The Rich Man and Lazarus

There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man

[OneLight]

Per God's Word, both paradise and hell are in HEAVEN. The difference is there's a great gulf fixed border between them (Luke 16). Everyone want's to go to heaven, but to which side should be the question.

Luke 23:42-43

42 And he said unto Jesus, "Lord, remember me when Thou comest into Thy kingdom."

43 And Jesus said unto him, "Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with Me in paradise."

(KJV)

Hades and Paradise are not in heaven, but in the earth.

Matthew 12:40

For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Luke 16:19-31 (New King James Version)

The Rich Man and Lazarus

There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man

[Believer1997]

Not sure where it will be, a dimension that I cannot as a human even imagine ... I know it will be glorious and so many questions will be answered and we will be in the presence of God. That, itself, just boggles my muddled mind. Praise God!!!

[Smalcald]

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up.[c] 11 Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, 12 looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be dissolved, being on fire, and the elements will melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to His promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.

[Celt]

Rev 12:7-10

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, "Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night."

(KJV)

Hell is considered to be in the earth because of the Bible expression of it being downward. But that's an expression, similar to the serpent being assigned to the 'dust' acting as a metaphor for Satan being cast down to a lowly status from his original position of guarding God's Throne. Thus that idea of hell being in the earth has become a 'tradition'. Satan stands as our "accuser" against us before God in Heaven day and night, until that event of his being cast down to this earth for the 1260 day tribulation.

That particular war there in Rev.12 has not happenned yet, for it's tied to the coming events of 1260 days of tribulation and the persecution on earth of the saints that have the testimony of Jesus Christ. That Testimony of the saints didn't exist yet at Satan's first fall.

Hell is in a place of separation away from God, but it is still in the Heavenly dimension. To think it is literaly in the earth is to assign it to our dimension we exist in today on earth. There are only two dimensions of existence, the one we live in and the Heavenly abode where God and the cherubim and angels are.

[Celt]

On the 7th trumpet sounding at Christ's coming, all alive on earth will changed to their "spiritual body" (1 Cor.15). One group to the resurrection unto eternal Life, and the wicked to the resurrection unto condemnation. Christ will gather His to be where He is, which will be on earth at the holy city of Rev.20:9, also called "the camp of the saints". On earth is where the Milennium events of Rev.20 and Ezekiel 40 forward will take place. Even at that time, with everyone in a spiritual body, there will still be a separation between the saints at the holy city and the wicked outside its border...

Rev 22:13-15

13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

14 Blessed are they that do His commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

(KJV)

Isa 14:15-17

15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.

16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, "Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;

17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?"

(KJV)

Ezek 28:18

18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

(KJV)

Per Rev.20:9 forward, a fire will come down from God out of Heaven to destroy those nations Satan leads upon the camp of the saints, but he will be cast into the lake of fire, along with the abode of hell with the wicked. That is the "second death" per Rev.20:14.

Ps 37:10-11

10 For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.

11 But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.

(KJV)

Has Satan and his angels ever experienced a 'first death'? No, for they have always dwelt in the heavenly dimension, without a flesh body. That's why only the "second death" can have effect upon them when they are cast into the "lake of fire", for that means the destruction of their heavenly image body and soul.

In 1 Corinthians 15, the apostle Paul went into depth on the type of bodies, and what type of body the resurrection is. He showed that to have eternal Life through Christ Jesus, a soul must put on the heavenly image body, what he called the "spiritual body", body of "incorruption" or "image of the heavenly". But he also declared that also "this mortal" must "put on immortality". That "this mortal" part is about the soul's condition. There is such a thing as a 'mortal' soul, one that can still perish later in the "lake of fire" with Satan, for his soul is mortal, sentenced already to perish.

In the resurrection at Christ's coming, all will be changed to a spiritual body, and that's how both the saints and Satan and the wicked will be manifest on earth in order for those events of Rev.20:9 and 22:14-15 to occur. The latter part of Zechariah 14 also mentions some of those events after Christ's coming to this earth.

[Massorite]

Per God's Word, both paradise and hell are in HEAVEN. The difference is there's a great gulf fixed border between them (Luke 16). Everyone want's to go to heaven, but to which side should be the question.

Luke 23:42-43

42 And he said unto Jesus, "Lord, remember me when Thou comest into Thy kingdom."

43 And Jesus said unto him, "Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with Me in paradise."

(KJV)

Hades and Paradise are not in heaven, but in the earth.

Matthew 12:40

For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Luke 16:19-31 (New King James Version)

The Rich Man and Lazarus

There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man

[irishcowboy]

When Christ comes back he will set up his kingdom on the Physical earth and it will be transformed back to the way it was before evil destroyed it.

So why do you think It was taught to our children that they will go to heaven?

just replying to the post, not directing it towards anyone anywhere......

our Kingdom (The Kingdom of God, the throne room,) is in the Third Heaven, we currently reside within the 1st heaven, there is a second heaven as well....

as far as how we teach our children, (personal belief for the Bible is not totally clear on this area) my personal is that the children fall under the covering of the parents.... ( there is teachings to both sides, and again, it is not clear in the Word as which it is) so if the parents are believers and followers then the child falls under their covering until they reach the age of accountability (like if the husband is a believer and the wife is not, that the wife would be sanctified through the husband, or vise a verse.....) the other teaching is that children are under the covering of Christ, (automatically saved ) until they reach the age of accountability..... I am sure there are many more dirivitives of these teachings, and i do not know if i would bend towards them or not.....

so,

teaching a child that if they believe and trust in Christ, they will go to heaven is not a bad teaching, and I believe that in the rapture that those that are believers will be removed from this earth and be with Christ in the 3rd Heaven, going through the wedding feast of the Lamb....... as far as where we will reside? on this earth in the New Jerusalem...... with Christ with us....

for those that are martyrs, they will be avenged by Christ, and His armies....... they are already being gathered together under the alter...

it is the responsibility of the parents to raise their children in the ways of the Lord, not the church, it is the churchs responsibility to strengthen the believers.... we are to strengthen each other in the Lord, support each other, teach and learn from each other..... but the Childrens Primary, First Teacher IS THE PARENT....

we all will answer for all of our actions and inactions.... good, bad and indifferent..... it may not affect our salvation, but our works are the evidence of our salvation......

blessings....

mike