JTC

This article didn't surprise me since many of us are saying this virus is a warning from God caused by all the ungodliness of the entire world. It's unfortunate that whenever God has been forced to bring disasters due to ungodliness both the good and bad people are effected. (although we don't actually know if the preachers who died were very pious Christians) It would be grand if we could tell the world that not 1 true person of God died from Covid-19, but the God haters wouldn't believe us anyway. When this first started I thought God was trying to get the average person to believe in Him but now I think He's more interested in getting those who claim to be Christians, but don't live that way, to change. Of course, if atheists become believers I know God will love that too.

Interesting. I was just reading Jeremiah today (I got up to ch 25 when I had to stop) and even though I know God was talking about ancient Israel some parts seemed very relevant to today and what's going on with this virus.

And I lost my belief that the average person even has common sense. Although, I lost that before the corona virus showed up.

When we start discussing believers who don't obey the Bible or maybe the issue is 1 believer is not obeying to the extent that another believer is, maybe the question is not whether or not they are both going to be in heaven but rather what their rewards and punishments will be. For example, I've noticed more and more believers now have the opinion we will be given jobs in heaven. The old idea was that saved souls will float on clouds endlessly singing "praise the Lord". I'm sure some will be given that task but since God is always busy creating He may need some of us to deal with His new creations. Some of those jobs are probably better than others. Those of us who obeyed the Bible will probably get the better jobs.

A basic principle of any scripture is that it can have multiple meaning, such as 1 meaning to the people of the time when it was given and other meanings even for today. Having said that, I'm not very familiar with the minor prophets. Since I'm not, I have also started reading them. I did find a verse in Zechariah ch.11 that seemed pertinent to us today. Since I'm uncertain of the meaning I'm not going to give the verse number. I also hope I'm wrong.

If you don't feel safe going back to your church then I suggest you live as though your life is church. What I mean is spend 1 - 3 hours everyday reading or listening to the Word. I started doing this about 10 yrs ago because I have never been able to find a truly Godly church in my area.

It can't be the ideal because if it is was the human race would end. However, God never intended for sexuality to be a casual practice, as we see today. That doesn't mean you can't enjoy it, just be sure you're enjoying it with a member of the opposite sex to whom you are married. I'm not sure why the RCC demands celibacy from their clergy, but it's obviously a bad idea that doesn't work. I said that because of all the priests who seduced women as well as those who forced children to have sex with them. You can't force a person to give up any sin, it always has to be voluntarily. Remember that all sex outside marriage is sin. It's not the unforgivable sin but it is sin.

These are good questions and good points you've made here. I agree with you. I will only disagree in terms of the extent that a person is able to obey. Some people will succeed in a greater obedience than others but as long as each of us are doing our best to be pleasing to the Lord then I think we are okay. I think there are many Christians out there who think obedience is important but since others don't, they think maybe they are wrong, and since it's easier to not obey the Lord they do not. But these same Christians never feel quite right in what they do, and they certainly don't have peace. I tend to think these Christians will be in heaven but they will have to suffer for what they did. God doesn't really explain this thoroughly but see 1 Corinthians ch.3 for what God does say. Ineedhugs, you're going to get a lot of disagreement, in your life from others because you see that God wants us to live as sin free as possible, but stick to your guns. We are right.

I've been thinking about how to answer this for over a week. Let's ask, what was it that made America great? 1. All our freedoms has to be first. 2. Is our capitalistic economy. My mother and my father's parents came here from Europe and I often asked why. The answer was because in Europe your life's work was mostly determined by what your father did. If your father was a street sweeper then most likely you would be as well. But in America you can become almost anything you want if you're willing to work hard enough to get it. This is all I thought of so far.

Thank you Mantis. If you want to read the rest of it you can find it in the testimony section of our board. It's not on page 1 so you can search for it. I think I titled it "How it all started" Or maybe how it all began. I had quite a few semi supernatural things happen to me back then because at 18 I became an intellectual atheist. Previous to 18 I did believe God was real but I was saved nor even devout. So between 18 to 26 I never intended to believe God was real again. However, looking back I have to say God had different plan for me. But I was a tough customer. Nevertheless, God's patience with us is almost endless.

I can easily understand this because my testimony has a similar story in it. When I was in my 20's, and being called to God, I didn't even know there were various translations. I had tried to read 3 Bibles but they were all written in the old English style. I too was on the verge of giving up when I was handed the Gospel of John in the NIV. I was delighted not to see any thees, thous or words like wouldest, but the best part of this story was the odd little man who handed it to me. Even after 40 something years I'm not sure he was human. I think he could have been an angel because I was standing in a mall when I saw him walking intently towards me. He didn't have any other books with him just the one he handed to me. After I took it from him he turned and walked away without saying a word. About a minute later I ran to thank him and I couldn't find him anywhere. It was like he vanished.That night and that incident were a pivotal turning point in my life. Furthermore, none of my family or friends knew I was looking into God, which made the odd little man all the more strange. I know that in the Bible angels are always big, often bold in appearance, but why can't God have a short unattractive angel, God often chooses short, young, and/or poor men to do His work, why not angels as well. Regardless of what that man was, after I read John's Gospel I bought the entire Bible in the NIV. I also read the NKJV, ESV and a few others but my favorite is still the NIV. Nevertheless, I agree with Abby that God can talk to us through any translation whatsoever.

Yes, I agree with this. I guess you can say I think the average Christian should NOT study philosophy unless he's also seeking to be a great apologist. In this case he will need to know secular philosophy. When I was in school I was told all philosophers seek to answer the question, "Why is the human condition one of misery". I don't even think all Christians answer this exactly the same, much less secular philosophers. However, even if we don't all answer it exactly the same all our answers should contain the same elemental ideas. Actually, when I was in school I was not yet convinced the human condition is one of misery so philosophy wasn't my favorite subject. But since many young people are going to take classes in philosophy I'd like to see courses offered that compare and contrast the way Christians and secularists answer the question without judging either side. If there were such courses I'd be more keen on having our young Christians take them. But I'm not sure any professor could teach such a class.

Very interesting, so I guess this is why the KJV and the Catholic version are so similar. But truthfully, I have the worlds hardest time understanding Old English. I have now read most of the Bible more times than I counted (mostly the NIV) and yet when I read a passage in the KJV I still don't know what it means. Since I have this problem with old English all I did with the Geneva Bible was to take a quick look at it. IMO insisting on using any version of the Bible that isn't written in the English we all know is silly. The Bible is hard enough to understand even when it's in a language we're familiar with, why make it harder by insisting we must use an old version written in a strange form of English. I know many people love the flowery poetic sound of old English, and that's fine. But most of us don't.

So far I don't think the areas where the protesting happened had an upswing yet. But it's only been 1 week. I think we have to wait until the last week of June to be sure. If we don't see the upswing in cases it could mean the virus simply goes dormant in the summer like the flu does. I want to be rid of Covid-19 as much as anyone and I hope we are. But I have a hunch it will be back. Nevertheless, the lockdown has to end. I don't think it was meant to go on over 6 weeks.

It seems so obvious that when you accept Jesus as Lord you have to do certain things, or actually you usually have to stop doing certain things. I think it's obvious but a lot of people deny this, they want their words to mean more than their actions. Maybe that was true 2000 yrs ago but isn't true anymore. That's the main point of this thread.

That is part of it, and I'll tell you this, I wish I had lived in the day and age when a man's word was his bond. I think I would have fared better back then than I did now. Yes Leah, God really is the only one you have to prove it to. But what I meant is some people need to take a better look in a mirror. The Bible emphasizes that we are supposed to treat everyone with an attitude of love and concern. This becomes impossible if we are getting angry all the time and using words that show hate. I don't mean you Leah.

These are good points and I'm glad you shared your experiences on this. But before this thread goes too far askew let me make my main point again. My point was that if a man's word was as worthless 2000 yrs ago as it is now, the Bible might have said something slightly different than it does concerning salvation. I think Paul might have said if you confess Jesus with your mouth and prove you mean it with your actions, then you will be saved. This has been my main complaint since I was saved approximately 40 yrs ago. I think this issue is more important today than ever. If a person says he accepts Jesus as Lord & Savior then I think we are right in expecting that person to change, or at least be trying to change. Granted that for some people these changes will be big and for others small, but there has to be something you can see. I believe the Bible doesn't emphasize this because to men of integrity, his word was all that was needed. Some of us are still people of integrity but many folks are not. This is why that we who are true Christians have to prove it through our behavior.

I think we're all wondering this. If we don't see an increase in cases in the next month we're going to be asking why not. I know some doctors had hoped that Covid-19 would go dormant for the summer, so that would be my first guess. But I hope God is answering our prayers and taking this virus away.

We all know how easily some people say things that aren't true, but was it always like this, maybe not. I recently took the online course about the book of Acts, offered by DTS. The professor wanted to explain why Paul tells the story of what happened to him on the road to Damascus 3 separate times and the reason surprised me. The professor said that 2000 yrs ago a person's verbal words were considered to be honest and reliable, more reliable than the written word, or someone else telling you the story 2nd or 3rd hand. That's interesting in more ways than the professor meant it to be. This becomes critical when applied to salvation. I'm going to guess that 2000 yrs ago a person would never say that someone was his Lord unless he absolutely meant it. 2000 yrs ago a person could be killed for declaring someone, other than the king, as his Lord. Therefore, I'll also guess that anyone who publicly declared that Jesus was his Lord knew very well that he was expected to prove that statement with his actions. Furthermore I think that 2000 yrs ago a person's actions were more suspected to have false motives than his words were. This would be especially true if you were a slave and you had to do many things you didn't agree with just so you weren't beaten. It's very curious how things managed to turn around by 180 degrees, in the last 2000 years. This doesn't change how or why we get saved but it does reinforce the idea that your behavior proves you are saved.

The point of this post is since time is our most valuable possession, we need to be more careful about how we use it and how we spend it on. I came to all this by thinking about how idolatry makes sense today. In thee past the animals a man owned were one of his most valuable possessions so naturally God got upset when a man sacrificed an animal to a god other than Himself. Today it's more obvious that time is our most valuable possession. So when we use our time thinking about astrology or anything else with roots in the occult we are offending God.

I say yes he is, he was defeated 2000 yrs ago when Jesus died and then rose again from the dead. I thought all long time Christians knew this. Well, let me see what all of you think.

I suppose a certain number of locusts would be considered normal. I think that happens every year. But I didn't think it makes the news and I also didn't think it was billions of them at a time. But I can easily be wrong since I've never lived in a rural or agricultural community.

You're very welcome. I was truly surprised at how many Christians are ignorant of the spiritual realm. There was a time when I didn't believe anything spiritual even existed. That's different from the average Christian who believes there is God, a devil, and a few demons, but that's all they know of. But I can't explain this like Dr. Heiser so I'll let him do it.

What is the most valuable thing we get to have as humans? It's something we can't gain more of which is why God considers it glorious when we spend it on Him. I'm talking about time, of course, and we all get a limited set amount that only God knows. We spend time on God in various ways but I'd say prayer is the most common. Fasting is another way to spend time on God, along with Bible reading and doing devotions. Since time is our most precious possession God would like it if we devoted as much as possible to Him. But most of us don't and our society is largely to blame. 2000+ years ago people didn't have much to discuss other than God and work. Most people don't even realize how many things they are doing against God. When we dedicate our time to God we are doing what is right.

No not exactly. I've said many times God is angry with the general state of godliness over the whole earth. Homosexuality is one thing butt I also said that to God idolatry is the most grievous sin there is and Africa and India are both hotbeds of idolatry. Every sin is a breaking of God's rules but idolatry is sin against the person of God. In idolatry you are taking time, attention, prayers and worship that belong to God Almighty and you are giving it to one of God's enemies.