gnomonist

33 is talking about the door=deadline ---------------- which we are allowed to know 36 is talking about know the day of His arrival ----- a date we are not allowed to know I can see where you are coming from. I may not agree with your dates, but commend you on seeking to know. Just be careful not to be too dogmatic as I see things you are overlooking. Folks should read my post #21. What Jesus is saying is the same thing I did. We know when his coming is at hand (just like the feast of trumpets), but we do not know the exact time unless we are watching (just like the new moon sighting). Verse 36 does not say you can't know the date. It says you will have to watch until the date can be ascertained. To put it another way, when Jesus said nobody knows the day or hour, the word "knows" is intuitive insight, i.e. nobody would be given a revelation. However, he did not say you could not know (Gr. gnosis) with evidence. One has to know the times and seasons. In the OT, there were several people (knowing the prophecies of Daniel) who knew when Christ would come the first time. Likewise in the second coming.

The other day I posted a web site called torahcalendar.com. I like the astronomical data on it, but I don't accept all their theology. For starters, they claim this is year 5999. You know what that means? 6000 years given to man and the the next millennium is the Kingdom of God. I'm curious what will happen to the site when nothing will probably happen next year? That's the thing..... you get these fine folks who have some insightful knowledge about something (I can't argue with their astronomical data) but then they apparently get over-confident because nobody else is as smart, and maybe they feel that gives them license to then make predictions. My favorite theologian (in my avatar), Sir Isaac Newton, calculated based on his extensive work in Daniel that the end won't come before 2060, and that's the earliest, maybe later. I'll trust someone like him infinitely sooner than some of these characters out there. After all, anyone who invents calculus and Newtonian physics has to have a good knack at numbers. From my personal experience, I see all sorts of things happening in the world, but there's critical elements that must be here for the end times which are NOT in place yet. Not trying to delay the Lord's coming, just being honest.

Out of curiosity, do you run Microsoft? If so, that's probably 90% of the problem considering the severe viral problem it has, and even more so it slows up over the years with resource hoggishness and glut. Maybe load Linux on your older computers, and even if that is slow you can try "lite" versions and even older computers with RAM into the megabytes rather than gigabytes works reasonably well. However fast Linux runs on day #1 is how fast it will run on doomsday far into the future because Linux does not have the issues I mentioned. So, if you load it and like it that way, it will stay that way. If it's still slow, then try another Linux distro. They are all free (you can keep a stand-alone Microsoft for specific applications only it can run but for what I perceive you want to run on a computer Linux should be fine). You can also dual-boot, but I would not recommend it as Microsoft has attitudes with other OS's and something will crash each time.

Thanks Nigel for the thoughtfulness. Ours became a great nation and yours a great company of nations and yet we are going the way of Baal and the spirituality/morality is drying up. We seem to be getting cut off again by our own doing, not because God is not faithful as promised. It makes me sad what those men and women fought for seems to be going to the wayside just like before.

While I believe nobody knows the day or hour and I believe God left enough maneuvering room to come when he sees fit, we also have to be careful of interpretting that statement "nobody knows the day or hour" by our cultural context. To us, that statement means just that: any time, any day and any year. Christ's coming is announced with Trumpets, and just as he fulfilled the spring feasts by dying on the Passover, raising on Firstfruits and so forth, likewise his coming is associated with the feast of trumpets. The statement "no man knows the day or hour" is referencing the idea of WATCHFULNESS as they would dilligently look for the new moon to commence the month, nobody knowing which day, or the hour it would be seen (the ecliptic makes a shallow angle with the western horizon at that time of the year which makes observing the moon tricky). They knew when the month was at the doorstep but they had to watch. Likewise, we have to watch the signs of the times to know that his coming is soon. Of all of God's feasts, the feast of trumpets is the only day they were not sure when it would be since unlike the others, it started on the first day of the month. So whatever year he returns, that's when it will be. To put in my 2 cents about the March 14,2012 date (even though it was retracted), the first thing I do is calculate how that relates to lunar cycles. That date appears to be the last quarter of the last month, and in and of itself has no significance. However, when going to Daniel's prophecy and adding 1260 days, 1290 days or 1335 days, one date I get is Sept 25, 2015 which will probably be the day of Atonement (nobody knows yet) based on the lunar position. Some believe that's Christ's return because of the Zechariah prophecy (as opposed to the feast of trumpets). I'm flexible since that's about the same time of the year. However, some people, such as that Camping fellow, throw out dates from God-knows-what calendar and it does not take much calculation to know he was all wet and did not know what he was talking about.

Technically, it's Firstfruits. I try to educate my fellow Christians in the Lord's prophetic feast days which were fulfilled in Christ and his redemptive work. Passover, Unleavened Bread and Firstfruits deal with Christ's death, burial and resurrection. Then Pentecost is the first harvest commonly called the birthday of the church. There are latter harvests in the feasts as well which take place in the Millennium and beyond. The church is the firstfruits in this age. There are 4 feasts completed, 4 to go yet. We are scripturally in the season we'd call "summer" here, and I believe late summer at that. Anyway, nice compilation of scripture in the message.

Just looking at her picture for some reason gives me the creeps, if that says anything.

I can state one proof, but that will go over the heads of most skeptics, including even Christians. But here it goes. He arose to fulfill the feast of Firstfruits. For the sake of the skeptics, let's say his body was stolen. I find it interesting that he was crucified, buried, raised 72 hours later right as the Firstfruits started. So what? What's the significance? That's just it. The disciples were too dense and stupid (everyone was) to understand the significance of these prophetic feasts until after they happened in Christ. So, what's the chances that these feasts were stated at the time of Moses (actually they know about them beforehand) and it just so happened that the death and resurrection "hoaxes" occurred at the same time? And in case a skeptic will say that they just attributed the significance of those feasts to Christ's events, I must add that the "coincidences" that the symbolism in the feasts themselves represented just so happened to represent these of death and resurrection (harvest) themes especially when Christ compared himself beforehand to those things, e.g. lamb, barley, etc.

I can tell you how many, but I'll probably get a little flack about it (and that's my belief about them so I do not want this to turn into a debate about it-- others can believe what they want). But.... we know there's at least 2, right? The just and unjust. The former for the saints at the coming of Christ, and the latter at the end ("after the 1000 years") which I think that much at the very least is very clearly spelled out.

It seems some of these attacks are used by conspiracy theorists to so-call prove their point. In other words, they are being opportunists so that when something happens like a terror attack they merely switch the subject so-to-speak and put the blame on the government instead. If there were no terror attacks, then they'd use something else, maybe mysterious accidents (like the recent bridge collapse). Already many of the natural disasters they somehow blame on the government as well.

If I may jump in, that was exactly my previous point. There are definitely Christian groups (or sects or cults whatever some others call or label them) that claim fundamental beliefs, and do not agree, such as the points (doctrines) you brought up.

Well, if it's any comfort, judging by what I read (assuming its true) then they are probably moral cowards, traitors and imbeciles. However, what you obviously learned is it does no good to call someone that.

Looking at Fundamentalism as a philosophy (i.e. back to the basics of the bible, e.g. Sola scriptura) rather than a denomination, there have been many movements within Christendom claiming such. So, for the sake of clarity that's what I mean when I say Fundamentalism. However, upon careful observation, even those claiming to go back to the basics of the bible differ in various areas, and indeed, may even have traditions of men attached to their theology, despite claiming going back to the basics of the bible. Even with this fundamental stance, I find that these Christian groups are still too diverse in their beliefs to mention. So, I guess the moral of the story is that many may make such a claim, but don't expect a constant set of beliefs but rather divergence like many other Christian groups.

That catch was cool. I'm not as good as that pastor catching a bird, but I did scoop a hummingbird one time. Birds seem to have no spacial mental ability at all. They fly into my garage and even with the doors open they fly on top rather than out the door! One time a hummingbird got trapped that way in my garage. I could see he was getting exhausted and if they don't have sugar in a short time, can die. He was perched on top of my garage door opener wires exhausted and I quietly put a ladder up to him, climbed up, and snatched him like catching a fly. His little head peeped out of my hand. I released him outside where he took off vertically at a high rate of speed. My wife loves hummingbirds and places feeders outside all the time. Before then, I never seen one in my life, let alone up close (they don't seem to be afraid of you even if you are standing still, say, 5 feet from the feeder). Well, after we got these feeders I saw more than my share over the years, and little did I realize that one day I would actually hold one! They are really little, but speedy guys!

I'm suspicious of those who claim to know the year of the Lord's return. Of course this is based on the idea of Sabbatical years and Jubilee years. The problem is, let's say I can go back in time with a time machine. I can establish by looking at the sun the day, the month by the moon, and the year by the seasons and agricultural cycle. But I cannot reestablish the weekly Sabbath since that's just perpetual counting independent of astronomical cycles, and the same with the sabbatical years or Jubilee years. The exception is if I have some concrete astronomical datum where these days and years were known, and then calculate to another random date using astronomical cycles. The weekly Sabbath pattern was never broken and to my knowledge, nobody ever disputed the seventh day. However, counting the years have been lost, and people dispute them. I'm sure scripture gives concrete hints when these are, but the problem is interpretation. Everyone and their brother seem to "know" what year it is. Another site says it's somewhere in the 2040's, not next year. I predict that Torah calendar site will be defunct within a year if they are saying stuff like that. However, their astronomical data (which probably comes from a program, not their personal knowledge) is very valuable so it can still be used without the need to believe their theology (nor do you have to feel obligated to believe their theology just because you use their data). I refuse to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Well, as we approach end times, I can see the beast (the Assyrian) forming and those who would side with him. So flying a Nazi flag actually makes sense to me as I believe this is the start of the fulfillment of prophecy.

Seems we are on the same page here as I see Revelation 12 with astronomical significance. Besides of the position of the sun and moon in the woman and under her feet, we have the Dragon which we know represents Satan, but in the Constellations one of them depicting the Dragon is Draco. As it now stands, Draco entails almost a third (about 7 hours) of right ascension. In John's day it was 9 hours. So, either way that's about 1/3 of the stars. Interesting "coincidence"? Or an allusion to that as well? There is something ominous about that constellation because even the pyramid was aligned by it when Alpha Darconis was once the pole star in 2600BC time frame.

I like Wild Bill. He's right. IN the bible judgement comes to a nation that disobeys and evil leaders are one way this is brought about. Did anyone here read Jonathan Cahn's book or hear his message? I did not read his book but saw several of his videos about the leaders quoting Isaiah 9:10 when the towers fell. But... while the leaders expect that verse to be an inspiration to us all, the context is judgement. Back to Wild Bill. He said something I've been saying all along but got flack for when I say it. He said, "Since the 60's....." Looking at the more pragmatic reasons (beyond the spiritual ones) I blame this on the hippy and baby boomer generation. They rebelled against everything religious and moral, created their own spiritual vacuum, and then in their older years replaced it with a pseudo-puritanical approach with their own rules more draconian than the ones they rebelled against. For example, they don't care about sexual sins and perversion, and thus are still rebellious. But at the same time they act puritanical by protecting the rights (I'm talking moral, not constitutional) of perverted groups as if disagreeing with them is so horrible and we must consider their feelings. I mean, that's just messed up. And gen x behind them is not much better. I like what I see with gen y, at least in my kids' generation (those under 32 years of age). But only time will tell if they go down the same road when they are in one day in power. In politics, the older baby boomers are leading yet (but in a lot of other businesses they are starting to retire), and in mainline business, the younger gen x is leading. These are the 40-somethings. Just my take.

I don't know when a person is ultimately cut off from God, i.e. not being truly repentant is the reason, but I can tell you how many times he forgives. He forgives seventy times seven. Literally that is 490 times but instead of an actual number that number (e.g. in Daniel's prophecy) signified a complete time period, e.g. the seventy weeks. It encompassed all the way until the end, so I would imagine that means forever, as long as one is willing to repent despite the failures. 490 also means completeness, perfection, so I guess he forgives you until you are perfected. Just don't give up trying to grow in this area is the only advice I can give. As long as the will is there, he hasn't given up on you if that's what you are worried about.

While I don't think God expects the Christian to retire at 65 in the traditional sense of the word, the world does expect it. I think staying busy (even doing the Lord's work) is different than worldly work. The former is how we manage to get income to live, so yes, I'm all for retirement accounts because at age 70 you may decide you can still (gainfully) work, but the world expects you to quit and will not hire you. So, the bills have to be paid while I'm not working. If one can find a way of making gain doing "retirement" work, then more power to ya. But that is not always the case.

You have some valuable insights here, to expand the true meaning of taking the Lord's name in vain, rather than the typical idea that it's done when cussing only. And yes, I do not pray to God, but to Yahweh. God is a generic term, like "cat". But Yahweh is a specific name of that species, and a family name so-to speak. I know of two names in the diety presently, and that's Yahweh (aka the "Father") and Yeshua (aka the "Son" --- John 1:1 God and the Word). For example, I have one cat named "Panther". There's only one Panther (or any cat born of him as in a family name). But there are many cats. So, I would hope that nobody would call me "man" although I am that, but by my name. And it's the latter that makes it personal and can be taken in vain.

A dozen of us co-workers got into it. Of course if we win, the first thing I'll do to set an example is to give at least a tithe, the way I already do with my income. I'm one of many people with good tithing stories. I used to work for a big Microelectronics company but after almost 25 years was laid off. Now I work for a smaller outfit with less pay, but they jokingly refer to me as one with "all the money". No --- I don't have good wealth because I worked for a richer company at one time (as many of my coworkers there were still broke). It's because my wife and I gave God his portion, and we saved and not spend foolishly. Yet, we still have nice things, and all paid off, too! But playing the lottery, as long as in moderation (like drinking), is fun. Who knows?

No, I wasn't asking anything except I was not sure if this was the section to put this in. It's a subject about biblcal time-keeping. I thought it may be interesting. I guess it does not take much to entertain me watching a circle going around.

Don't know where to post this, so I just posted this in the general section. Here's a neat site for gnomonists like me: http://www.torahcalendar.com/HOUR.asp Jesus stated "Are there not 12 hours in the day?" (alluding to what was then used as a hemispherium sundial) These were "seasonal hours" as opposed to "equinoxial hours" we presently use. The former divides the day (and night) into 12 equal parts. The latter is used to measure the earth's rotation with 15 degrees being an hour (actually, this is mean solar time, and the reality is that the day differs slightly from orbital irregularities and the earth's tilt). Scientists consider time as a constant rate, and therefore favor the latter hours. But dividing the day into 12 hours is not to fulfill a goal of standard time rate, but rather the definition of the hour is to divide the day -- totally different concepts, and neither is "right" or "wrong". But with the Hebrew calendar, the seasonal hours is how time was intended to be kept and is technically right. The only thing I differ with is the year. I believe the year is determined in Israel with the ripening of the barley. These fine folks go by the equinox (generally this is a moot point since they are related anyway). The idea behind the equinox is that there was no barley for Noah during the flood. There was no barley in the wilderness wanderings, and there is no barley in Israel if there is a drought. OK, fine, but the barley was only observed when they got into the land of Israel. When there's a flood, there's judgement. When there's wandering in the wilderness there's judgement. When there's draught, that's judgement. These were not God's permananent or normal conditions for his people, but the barley observed in the land prophesied Messiah being born in the land, and is thus the "normal state" God expects his people. But.... if one is under judgement, I don't see the harm in the equinox. After all, the astronomical seasons are what determines the barley and in that sense is when the barley would probably ripen anyways if one was in the land.

The bible states the few number of insects allowed to be eaten, but that's far and few between. Thus, I think I'll pass on the insect eating.