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OldCoot

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About OldCoot

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  • Birthday 01/12/1957

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  1. Oh, there is indeed a removal of the righteous or “rapture” if one wants to use that word. The OT has many passages that support the idea the righteous, both dead and living just like Paul wrote, will be “hidden” in their “chambers” in the pavilion of the Lord. Isaiah, Zephaniah, David, et al all wrote about it as happening before or at the start of the “time of Jacob’s Trouble, which is the calamities many call the 70th week or “tribulation” period.
  2. The only kink in equating the catching up with the same coming where Yeshua physically returns to the earth is, if the righteous are caught up at that time when Yeshua is returning to take over and rule, then who would be left to be the sheep of the nations (Matthew 25 / Joel 3)?
  3. When one analyses all that Hitler said and did, along with the total Nazi experiment, it was just a dress rehearsal for the future Antichrist who will warp things more than even Hitler thought to do. The truly bizarre thing is, many in the Nazi regime thought that they were carrying out God's will and just taking Luther's nationalism and antisemitism to the ultimate level. Along with Luther's rampant Jew hatred, he was a virulent national socialist that disagreed with individual liberty. It is truly sad that the guy started out really getting things right regarding justification by faith alone, and then went into the sewer of demon inspired hatred in his latter years.
  4. Try taking a look at some of Hitler's speeches and read Mein Kampf and you will have your answer. Hitler at one rally stated specifically that... I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator. By warding off the Jews, I am fighting for the Lord's work. - Adolf Hitler, Speech, Reichstag, 1936 From a Treatise done by Daphne Olsen at Rollins College in 2012..... It is impossible to assume that Luther did not have any influence on Hitler and his views. Hitler refers to Martin Luther as one of the great reformers of history, and as such, one of the “great warriors of this World.”109 It cannot be mere coincidence that Hitler’s anti-Jewish sentiment of the 1930s and 1940s mirrors that of Luther’s anti-Semitism of the 1500s. In fact, the Nazis themselves acknowledged Martin Luther as their spiritual leader. When on trial in Nuremberg, Germany after World War II, one of Hitler’s top officials declared, "Dr. Martin Luther would very probably sit in my place in the defendants’ dock today, if this book had been taken into consideration by the prosecution. Dr. Martin Luther writes that the Jews are a serpent’s brood and one should burn down their synagogues and destroy them. -Luther and Hitler: A Linear Connection between Martin Luther and Adolf Hitler’s Anti-Semitism with a Nationalistic Foundation, Daphne M. Olsen, Rollins College, 2012 From the same treatise above.... Some people in Hitler’s time went so far as to believe that Hitler was the reincarnation of Luther; the Minister of Education in Nazi Germany wrote: Since Martin Luther closed his eyes, no such son of our people has appeared again. It has been decided that we shall be the first to witness his reappearance... I think the time is past when one may not say the names of Hitler and Luther in the same breath. They belong together – they are of the same old stamp. And yet another example from the the treatise by Olsen.... It was during the Nuremberg Trials that Julius Streicher, one of Hitler’s top officials and the publisher of Der Stürmer, an anti-Semitic newspaper, was quoted as saying that Martin Luther would be on trial as well, if On the Jews and Their Lies had been taken into consideration. And.... When Luther turned his attention to the Jews, after he completed his translation of the Bible, he left behind "on the Jews and their Lies" for posterity. -Walter Buch [cited from Richard Steigmann-Gall's "The Holy Reich"] So long as the Bible was available to us only in a foreign language, so long as it was only spoken to us in Latin, we could only grasp it as things are grasped through the iron gloves of a knight: he is aware of the shape and weight , but can only feel iron. When Luther made the Bible accessible to Germans in the glorious German language, it was as if we had cast off the iron glove and with the flesh and blood of our German hand were finally able to grasp our unique character.... The older and more experienced he became, the less he could understand one particular type of person: this was the Jew. His engagement against the decomposing Jewish spirit is clearly evident not only from his writing against the Jews; his life too was idealistically, philosophically antisemitic. Now we Germans of today have the duty to recognize and acknowledge this. -Hans Schemm, "Luther und das Deutschtum," Bundesarchiv Berlin-Zehlendorf (19 Nov. 1933: Berlin), [cited from Richard Steigmann-Gall's "The Holy Reich"]
  5. Yep, Iran is a a happening place for the Gospel! Many Persians are embracing the Gospel at great risk. I am firmly convinced that this is a major move of the Lord as time is getting short and He desires to save many before the major calamities of the end times come upon the earth. The Iranian situation is a great example of how the Lord will reveal Himself to those who have very little or no exposure to the traditional Gospel message. I have talked with several missionaries to the middle east and they are enthralled at how the Lord is moving among the Islamic nations.
  6. Yeshua equated a pearl with the righteous in Matthew 13. A pearl is started in an oyster as a response to an irritation. It grows by accretion over time. When ready, it is removed from the oyster and set as an item of adornment. So is the wonderful believers in China and other countries where persecution is the order of the day. What a wonderful, eternal adornment these believers will be for the Lord forever!
  7. As has been stated so aptly before in many venues..... we have indeed entered the twilight zone. Romans 1 is in full bloom right before our eyes.
  8. OldCoot

    Question

    Agreed, Paul does not give the time of the rapture in 2 Thessalonians. He merely says that it will happen before the man of sin is revealed. Agreed, the "that day" being referenced in 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is referring to the aforementioned topic of the passage, the "day of the Lord" from verse 1. But likewise, verse 1 is also talking about the gathering or rapture as part of that. So I guess one could say that the rapture does precede the "day of the Lord", but the trigger that starts that period is the affirming of the covenant of Daniel 9:27, which many feel is done by the man of sin / son of perdition / antichrist. And 2 Thessalonians is pretty clear that the departure or removal must occur first, then the man of sin is revealed. Likewise in the same passage, it says that He who restrains is taken out of the way, then the Lawless One (same guy) will be revealed. The only thing that can restrain evil is the Holy Spirit. And the redeemed are sealed by the Holy Spirit. So if He is taken out of the way, so are the redeemed that He is sealing. And Isaiah 26.. front to back... is pretty clear on the timing. Right out of the starting gate, there is a tie in with Revelation 4:1.... Isaiah 26:2 (NKJV) Open the gates, That the righteous nation which keeps the truth may enter in. Revelation 4:1 (NKJV) After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, "Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this." the Hebrew and the Greek have equivalent meanings. And the "righteous nation" is a tie to 1 Peter 2:9, which likewise is a tie back got Revelation 5:10 regarding the 24 Elders, which has its own tie to 1 Chronicles 24 where David established the 24 courses of the Priests. further down, Isaiah ties this happening at the start of the birth pains, which ties into Jeremiah 30:6-7.... Isaiah 26:17 (NKJV) As a woman with child is in pain and cries out in her pangs, when she draws near the time of her delivery, so have we been in Your sight, O Lord. Jeremiah 30:6-7 (NKJV) Ask now, and see, Whether a man is ever in labor with child? So why do I see every man with his hands on his loins Like a woman in labor, And all faces turned pale? 7 Alas! For that day is great, So that none is like it; And it is the time of Jacob's trouble, But he shall be saved out of it. And there is the tie in to Matthew 24 Olivet discourse regarding no day being like it. And later in the passage, the dead are resurrected and the righteous are told to come and enter their chambers which is a tie in to John 14 and 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17..... Isaiah 26:20-21 (NKJV) Come, my people, enter your chambers, And shut your doors behind you; Hide yourself, as it were, for a little moment, Until the indignation is past. 21 For behold, the Lord comes out of His place To punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity; The earth will also disclose her blood, And will no more cover her slain. Which also ties into Zephaniah 2:3... Zephaniah 2:3 (NKJV Strong's) Seek the Lord, all you meek of the earth, Who have upheld His justice. Seek righteousness, seek humility. It may be that you will be hidden In the day of the Lord's anger. John 14:2-3 (NKJV) In My Father's house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 (NKJV) For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. Cliff
  9. OldCoot

    Question

    One must also view any verse in the context of the passage it is in. In 2 Thessalonians 2:3, the departure is referenced as occurring before the man of sin is revealed. That is supported further in 2 Thessalonians 2:7-8. Every English translation prior to the KJV, and including the Latin Vulgate, state it is a departure, not a falling away or rebellion. Both verb (aphistemi) and noun (apostasia) require a subject to what is being departed from to determine if it is spatial physical departure or a spiritual departure. And in verse 3, no subject is provided as to what is being "departed" from, so we have to use the general context of the passage, which is a gathering to the Lord. For instance, a spatial departure is in view in... Luke 2:37 (NKJV) and this woman was a widow of about eighty-four years, who did not depart [aphistemi, verb form of apostasia] from the temple, but served God with fastings and prayers night and day. And a spiritual departure is seen here.... 1 Timothy 4:1 (NKJV) Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart [aphistemi, verb form of apostasia] from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, The only other use of "apostasia", the noun form, in scripture is in Acts 21:21, where the specific object of what is being departed from is mentioned.... Acts 21:21 (NKJV) but they have been informed about you that you teach all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake [apostasia, noun form] Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. In that context, it is both a spiritual and spatial departure or distancing from Torah. The idea that 2 Thessalonians 2:3 is speaking of a spatial "departure" and not a "spiritual departure" or "falling away" or "rebellion" is in keeping with both the grammar and context. The context is laid out in verse 1, our gathering to the Lord, not our departing from the Lord. And in conjunction with many prophets in scripture, it is further supported that this is a reference to the removal of the righteous prior to the end time calamities, with the specific in 2 Thessalonians 2 being before the man of sin / son of perdition / antichrist is revealed. Where people tend to get confused in equating the coming to gather the righteous in the air to be with the Lord with the coming where the Lord returns with the righteous and sets foot on the earth and vanquishes the enemies coming against Jerusalem. One is outside the earth, one is on the earth. One is to gather the righteous, one is coming with the righteous. Two unique events. Also, these Thessalonians had been told thru a forged letter (verse 2) that they were in the Day of the Lord, which is a common reference to the tribulation period. Probably because of intense persecution these folks were experiencing. Paul had to allay their fears and remind them that "that day" would not come unless the departure comes first, then the man of sin will be revealed.
  10. It was everyone who crucified Yeshua (Jesus), not just Jews.... Acts 4:27 (NKJV) "For truly against Your holy Servant Jesus, whom You anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles and the people of Israel, were gathered together Your application of Revelation 3:9 is faulty. That is speaking of those who lay claim that the church has replaced Israel, i.e. Replacement Theology, Two House Theology, and the myriads of off shoots... those that say they are Jews and are not. Indeed, within Messiah there is neither Jew nor Gentile, just as there is neither male or female, and likewise, being in Messiah does not make a gentile a Jew and being in Messiah does not take away a Jew's lineage as a Jew. Just like even in Messiah there is still a physical earthly distinction of male and female, there is still a physical, earthly distinction of who is of Israel and who is not. Even Paul noted that distinction and still called Jews his brethren who had yet to come to faith in Messiah (Romans 9:3).
  11. While the U.S. was the major kingpin in global gospel outreach, South Korea previously sent more Christian missionaries per congregation than any other country. It is currently sends the third highest number of missionaries, with the United States and India coming in second. It is second highest in sending missionaries to foreign lands, second only to the United States. They send missionaries to over 170 countries. I think we ought to not think so arrogant of ourselves in America as being the main base of the Gospel to the world. What we used to be is not what we are now. Those that came before us have their reward. Rewards are not transferrable.
  12. True, He will never abandon the faithful, but that doesn’t mean He will not abandon the country. There were faithful in Judah but the nation still went into the exile.
  13. Well, as President Reagan so aptly said.... "freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on to them to do the same." And since a larger portion of Americans are willing to entertain Socialists, Communists, and Jihadists as candidates to run the country, it is highly likely that America will just be a nuisance in the end time scheme of things. We in America have essentially kicked God to the curb. Anyone who can fog a mirror and has been around longer than a few decades can see that. I am a Viet Nam Vet. I remember well the social upheaval and riots of the 60's. A friend of mine was in the national guard and was called up for the Chicago riots of '68 and the LA Watts riots of '65. I remember well the political climate change that occured as a result of that. America today is barely a glimmer of what it was, spiritually, compared to the 40's and 50's. We probably are only what we are today in America due to reservoir of what were once were. But that reservoir is running dry. For most of America's history, even those who did not take stock in biblical things or God had a element of respect for moral and social standards that came from Christianity. Even in movies and television shows of days gone by. Well, those days are gone. Now the norm is that things biblical and Christianity are refuted and ridiculed. The writing is on the wall. Weighed in the balance and found wanting. Only a major returning to America's roots and God will stop the downward spiral. I am not optimistic. I hope and pray, but I am not optimistic. And it seems pretty arrogant that folks would seem to think that America is all important to the end times when it is not mentioned in scripture. Maybe some can glean an idea of it being alluded in a passage or two, but not even remotely as well as the various territories mentioned as clear as the light of day with no ambiguity.
  14. Not sure if this has made it on another thread but I thought it would be apropos to stick it here for viewing. The recent Open Doors t0p 50 counties for Christian persecution. Make the list a part of your daily prayer life and remember the brothers and sisters who are suffering, that their lives will be a testimony of the Lord. Pray that those who come against the believers, that their eyes will be opened and they will also come to faith in Yeshua / Jesus. https://www.opendoorsusa.org/christian-persecution/world-watch-list/
  15. Have you actually read the Tanakh? Stuff like Isaiah 53, Psalms 22, etc. Even what Yeshua wrote in the dirt in John 8 was prophesied in Jeremiah 17. And grace has always been a part of scripture from the time that the Lord made coverings for Adam and Eve, thru King David, on into the NT. There never has been any difference. And the Cross is not found in the Torah? If you take the sizes of the various tribes, and when they camped in the wilderness they were either on the North, South, East, or West side. There boundary could not extend beyond the width of the side they were camped on. If you were to see the layout from a high vantage point like a mountain, you would see the cross laid out below. Even the Passover lamb. It was roasted in an upright position supported by a sticks in the shape of a cross. The Blood was placed on the door mantle and sides in Eqypt as prescribed by the Lord so the death angel would pass over. That blood on the mantle, the sides, and the bowl of blood at the threshold of the door is the shape of a cross. Now.... go and study.
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