about david

[GerdaHannah]

hi

i came across this line when i was reading up on David and Bathsheba.

" Restore to me the joy of thy salvation,

and uphold me with a willing spirit.

Then I will teach transgressors thy ways,

and sinners will return to thee.

He will give us back the place of usefulness and fruitfulness.

Deliver me from blood guiltiness, O God,

thou God of my salvation,

and my tongue will sing aloud of thy deliverance.

O Lord, open thou my lips,

and my mouth shall show forth thy praise.

For thou hast no delight in sacrifice;

were I to give thee a burnt offering, thou wouldst

not be pleased".

There was no offering that David could give for his sin. The Hebrews had no offerings for deliberate, willful sin. God had to create a new heart in him.

is it true?

did God forgive him without extracting punishment even in the old testament?

[Guest shiloh357]

hi

i came across this line when i was reading up on David and Bathsheba.

" Restore to me the joy of thy salvation,

and uphold me with a willing spirit.

Then I will teach transgressors thy ways,

and sinners will return to thee.

He will give us back the place of usefulness and fruitfulness.

Deliver me from blood guiltiness, O God,

thou God of my salvation,

and my tongue will sing aloud of thy deliverance.

O Lord, open thou my lips,

and my mouth shall show forth thy praise.

For thou hast no delight in sacrifice;

were I to give thee a burnt offering, thou wouldst

not be pleased".

There was no offering that David could give for his sin. The Hebrews had no offerings for deliberate, willful sin. God had to create a new heart in him.

is it true?

did God forgive him without extracting punishment even in the old testament?

David's sin was punishable by death. That is what God's Torah required. Someone did die. The baby Bathsheba conceived by David was still-born and died in David's place.

[nebula]

did God forgive him without extracting punishment even in the old testament?

Forgiveness does not mean escape from punishment. In fact, often punishment is needed in order to act as a refining fire to purge sin out of our lives.

David and Bathsheba's first son died. But the sword not leaving his family (what we see later with Absalom's uprising and what was behind that) was also punishment.

God's forgiveness never changed from "Old Testament" to "New Testament." Otherwise, it would be said that God has changed. But we know God never has, never does, and never will change. Thus we must conclude that God forgave then the same way He forgives now, and forgives now the way He did back then.

It should be noted that David still sacrificed animals as prescribed in the Torah. But what we see here is David's acknowledgment and understanding that it is not the blood of the animals that atone for sin but the hand of God Himself. You see, David understood God's heart, and it is this he was expressing - the true source of healing and redemption.

And he understood that he needed more than just forgiveness but to be cleansed of that which drew him into sin in the first place. We often forget this.

[givennewname]

What is an intentional sin?? Aren't all sins deliberate rebellion against God's wishes??