can salvation be lost?

[Ashitaria]

Yeah I certainly believe Baptism is part of the Grace of God and part of what every saved Christian will do, and I think almost everyone on this board agrees.

Is our faith a puzzle to be worked out over a secret bible code, "hidden" away from some who don't figure and work it out exactly correct? Or is our faith relatively straightforward; taken directly from the Gospel of Christ as shown in scripture and preached for the past 2000 years?

The thing with these sorts of links is that they assume "most" Christians have it wrong and only this little group has it right, this little group that has existed for only about 40 or 50 years; the assumption is before that the Gospel did not really exist. Well I know which Gospel and which Church I trust and will trust.

the Lord has no patience for those who believe in the wrong thing. Grace, was when Jesus was baptized and crucified for our sake. But grace does not mean we are saved no matter what.)

But you have said that faith is NOT just about intellectual belief, so if someone has one point of doctrine wrong, they are not saved? What if you are wrong about the true meaning of communion?

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

What does this verse say about those He does not know? Does it say you had your doctrine wrong? You actually should be happy that He does not say that given your doctrine.

Ever since the Reformation it is amazing to me, how many Christians want to re-erect the walls and barriers to grace which were torn down by the opening of the Gospel. You must DO it in THIS way with OUR Church or you are not saved, this sounds more like the Pope than anything else, just with different bells and whistles. Over and over again this idea rears its head to deny the Gospel of Christ in order to build up one particular Church body as the only way to salvation, instead of Christ being the only way to salvation.

The salvation is not supposed to be a puzzle. But it is, to people who stubbornly refuse the knowledge. You are pathetically, like other users, say, that I am a false prophet with empty words. Let me tell you this. The fact that I am saying that "you must do it this way to be saved" is true. You have to do it this way to be saved. After all, didn't you become a Christian in the same way? After all, you had to PRAY it in THIS way to be saved with OTHER CHRISTIANS. After all, an Indian cannot teach Christianity, I cannot stress this enough.

Yes, if you just get wrong part of the doctrine wrong, you are not saved. Wasn't it the same with the ten commandments? If you break just a small part of the commandments, you have broken it. Just by looking at another woman/man, you have already committed adultery in your heart. This IS the same thing.

1 Corinthians Chapter 6

9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders 10nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

What does the verse mean? It means that people who have spent their entire lives believing the wrong thing, speaking in tongues falsely, prophesying falsely, will one day find themselves in front of God who will declare, "I never knew you."

Yes- Christ is the only way to salvation. But what you guys do not know is HOW Christ is the only way to salvation. Go read, and watch, lest you be thrown into hell.

REPENT! FOR THE END IS NEIGH!

Edited November 6, 2009 by Ashitaria

[Ashitaria]

[exrockstar]

No, you are not saved by a particular church. You are saved by Jesus alone. But, many of the churches do not know the true path of salvation. That is why my church is preaching the truth right now.

There is overwhelming evidence in the bible that supports the doctrine-no, the truth- that we are preaching. READ IT!

you sound like many members here.

try adding words like "Hermeneutics" and "exegesis."

you'll fit right in.

join the club.

[kross]

[Ashitaria]

[Smalcald]

I don't think anyone here is saying that intellectual belief alone saves us. We all pretty much agree that there must be an inward transformation, that true faith means that the Holy Spirit is inside of us all as scripture points out. Indeed Baptism IS part of that walk of faith and no Christian would run from Baptism. Communion as shown in scripture is also part of this walk.

I think many Churches do know the path to salvation, I think if you spend your time with your little group thinking that you alone are saved you are in big trouble yourself.

Does it really make sense that this little group has suddenly "discovered" something about scripture and the Gospel that is unknown to other Christians? Does it make sense that if you congregation has the wrong name you are not saved? Give me a break, in fifty years your little group probably won't even be around, these sorts of things come and go. If you want to find a true Church look for one that has been around at least a couple of hundred years.

[kross]

Ashitaria,

I apreciate that you feel as you do.

I believe that in searching the scriptures you may have found some information, but you have failed to understand the love and mercy and grace of GOD. You have exchanged a relationship with HIM for a religion about HIM.

Long before the New Testament and JESUS, GOD showed that trust in HIM and belief in HIM was enough. "Abraham believed GOD and it was accounted to him as righteousness". Somewhere you have found information but failed to acquire knowledge. JESUS spoke of this when HE said, "You study the scriptures becouse in them you thin you will find salvation yet it is of ME that the testify" (I quoted that from memory so it is not perfect)

GOD is not a harsh GOD who is looking for men to do anything more than to believe HIM and believe in HIS SON. You can add all the other things you choose to the message JESUS gave, but JESUS made it very clear that believing GOD and believing HIM was sufficient. Yes, JESUS stated that those who believe and are baptised will be saved, but HE never stated that not being baptised would result in not being saved. Since I have both, that is not an issue for me.

Simple promise, "If you confess me before men, I will confess you before MY FATHER" That is a promise from JESUS. What else needs be said.

I hope you will seek HIM more diligently. I have found HIM and I am one of HIS.

[exrockstar]

No, it is an act of obedience to share the gospel. The Holy Spirit is the one who does the calling and the saving.

the holy spirit does the calling?

youre losing me on that one.

[Guest shiloh357]

No, it is an act of obedience to share the gospel. The Holy Spirit is the one who does the calling and the saving.

the holy spirit does the calling?

youre losing me on that one.

To put it a different way, it is the Holy Spirit that convicts and reveals truth. We share the truth, it is the Holy Sprit that works on the hearts of those who hear the gospel. In this way, the Father draws us to Himself.

[kross]

No, it is an act of obedience to share the gospel. The Holy Spirit is the one who does the calling and the saving.

the holy spirit does the calling?

youre losing me on that one.

The call to salvation is a spiritual calling. The effectual call of the SAVIOR, the drawing of the FATHER, the conviction of THE HOLY SPIRIT, is what is referred to as THE CALLING.

Look closely at 1 Corinthians, You will se Paul explaining that the calling did not go out to many wise or strong or rich, but rather GOD called the weak of this world... We share the good news. We teach truth. We tell people about JESUS. But it is GOD who does the calling, adds the increase, saves a soul.

As it has been stated, one plants, another waters, but it is GOD who gives the increase.

Peace