Church Gimmick Fills Pews

[nikki1]

Come on guys! I think it is a very smart idea. I was reading about a church called the "Hotdog Church." I emailed the pastor and asked where the name came from. He told me they served hotdogs every Sunday after church. I also know of a church in Atlanta that pays their seniors a small amount of money each month to help them live.

Initially, I didn't go to church for the right reasons. After I was saved, I went to church out of fear. I just knew that if I backslid one more time, God would write me off for good. Eventually God got my heart right. But had I not been attending church at all, this would have never happened.

Gimmick or no gimmick, if people are going to church, I believe it is a good thing. Now I wish my church did that. I could use an extra $500.

Any means necessary that one might be saved.

Huh? ?

Gimmicks have no place in getting people to go to any church that wants to please the Lord.

Jesus nor his disciples used these tactics, which are nothing but worldly ways to get sinners to repentence. This is nothing but a worldly marketing tool used by a worldly church.

What a shame today's marketers and promoters weren't there to share all of their marketing expertise with Jesus, Peter, John Paul, and all the other chosen apostles. They could have completed their mission in half the time, without the persecution that went along with it.

1 John 4:5

5They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

Blessings,

Nikki

[Botz]

I agree it might be gimmicky, but from what I have read the guy seems to be trying out a stategy, and his heart appears to be in the right place....I know we can pick up stones and quote chapter and verse lightning fast...but even if he is making a mistake in his method, I admire his audacity and his willingness to try to reach out to people in an inovative way.

Be funny arriving in glory and meeting many people that were drawn into the kingdom through this 'gimmick'...he might even achieve more for the kingdom of G-d than some of us are able to do...even if we stick to chapter and verse.

[nikki1]

I agree it might be gimmicky, but from what I have read the guy seems to be trying out a stategy, and his heart appears to be in the right place....I know we can pick up stones and quote chapter and verse lightning fast...but even if he is making a mistake in his method, I admire his audacity and his willingness to try to reach out to people in an inovative way.

Be funny arriving in glory and meeting many people that were drawn into the kingdom through this 'gimmick'...he might even achieve more for the kingdom of G-d than some of us are able to do...even if we stick to chapter and verse.

Blessings, Botz

I'd like to address and clear up a few things from my perspective that you said here if you don't mind.

First, I don't think it's a matter of throwing stones at anyone and quoting chapter and verse; though the latter is what the Christian is to go by. After all, if a Christian doesn't follow scripture and scriptural doctrine, and know the scripture to begin with, one has to ask where is the person getting his/her information from? There are so many gimmicks and false teachings going around today in the name of Christianity that Jesus himself and the Apostle Paul warned us about to be on the lookout for in the latter days and have nothing to do with them.

Secondly, I would like to ask by what authority does this pastor or any other church that uses gimmicks to get people to go to their worldly churches use? If it's not in scripture, then it must be extra-biblical. The apostle Paul warned Christians about this when he wrote 1 Corinthians 4:6.

Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively transferred to myself and Apollos for your sakes, that you may learn in us not to think beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up on behalf of one against the other.

To do something in the name of Jesus Christ must first have scriptural authority. I understand that this pastor may have good intentions with his gimmick to get non church people into his church, but whenever it goes outside the authority of the Lord's Word, it is not biblical and that is a big deal. To me anyways.

Blessings,

Nikki

[kross]

Come on guys! I think it is a very smart idea. I was reading about a church called the "Hotdog Church." I emailed the pastor and asked where the name came from. He told me they served hotdogs every Sunday after church. I also know of a church in Atlanta that pays their seniors a small amount of money each month to help them live.

Initially, I didn't go to church for the right reasons. After I was saved, I went to church out of fear. I just knew that if I backslid one more time, God would write me off for good. Eventually God got my heart right. But had I not been attending church at all, this would have never happened.

Gimmick or no gimmick, if people are going to church, I believe it is a good thing. Now I wish my church did that. I could use an extra $500.

Any means necessary that one might be saved.

Huh? ?

Gimmicks have no place in getting people to go to any church that wants to please the Lord.

Jesus nor his disciples used these tactics, which are nothing but worldly ways to get sinners to repentence. This is nothing but a worldly marketing tool used by a worldly church.

What a shame today's marketers and promoters weren't there to share all of their marketing expertise with Jesus, Peter, John Paul, and all the other chosen apostles. They could have completed their mission in half the time, without the persecution that went along with it.

1 John 4:5

5They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

Blessings,

Nikki

Interesting statement. Churches have offered free pizza to get kids to come to events, or modern music, or VBS. These could all be considered gimmicks.

I have seen basketball courts in churches, coffee shops, and any number of things done to invite those who would not otherwise come.

[kross]

I agree it might be gimmicky, but from what I have read the guy seems to be trying out a stategy, and his heart appears to be in the right place....I know we can pick up stones and quote chapter and verse lightning fast...but even if he is making a mistake in his method, I admire his audacity and his willingness to try to reach out to people in an inovative way.

Be funny arriving in glory and meeting many people that were drawn into the kingdom through this 'gimmick'...he might even achieve more for the kingdom of G-d than some of us are able to do...even if we stick to chapter and verse.

And it will be likely.

When I finish building this skateboard park and using it to reach kids and grandparents, I will keep in mind that it is just a gimmick. LOL

[Botz]

I agree it might be gimmicky, but from what I have read the guy seems to be trying out a stategy, and his heart appears to be in the right place....I know we can pick up stones and quote chapter and verse lightning fast...but even if he is making a mistake in his method, I admire his audacity and his willingness to try to reach out to people in an inovative way.

Be funny arriving in glory and meeting many people that were drawn into the kingdom through this 'gimmick'...he might even achieve more for the kingdom of G-d than some of us are able to do...even if we stick to chapter and verse.

Blessings, Botz

I'd like to address and clear up a few things from my perspective that you said here if you don't mind.

Of course not...fire away

First, I don't think it's a matter of throwing stones at anyone and quoting chapter and verse; though the latter is what the Christian is to go by. After all, if a Christian doesn't follow scripture and scriptural doctrine, and know the scripture to begin with, one has to ask where is the person getting his/her information from? There are so many gimmicks and false teachings going around today in the name of Christianity that Jesus himself and the Apostle Paul warned us about to be on the lookout for in the latter days and have nothing to do with them.

I understand where you are coming from and can see your point...it is just my observation, particularly on these boards, that we as Believers, have a tendency to shoot first and ask questions later...none of us know the full extent of this Pastor's ministry, but from reading the article he seems to be using money, and teaching about money and how to handle it in what seems a righteous manner...and as far as I can tell, a far cry from some of the spiritual blackmail that goes on concerning tithing.

Secondly, I would like to ask by what authority does this pastor or any other church that uses gimmicks to get people to go to their worldly churches use? If it's not in scripture, then it must be extra-biblical. The apostle Paul warned Christians about this when he wrote 1 Corinthians 4:6.

Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively transferred to myself and Apollos for your sakes, that you may learn in us not to think beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up on behalf of one against the other.

To do something in the name of Jesus Christ must first have scriptural authority. I understand that this pastor may have good intentions with his gimmick to get non church people into his church, but whenever it goes outside the authority of the Lord's Word, it is not biblical and that is a big deal. To me anyways.

Blessings, Nikki

Sorry Nikki...to me that is a bit like saying we should not travel in an airplane, because if G-d had wanted us to fly He would have given us wings. The Bible does not cover every single do and don't that we might come across, but many times gives us a broad frame-work from which to discern right and wrong...and apart from being a gimmick, I have not yet seen something in his ministry that sets off warning bells...the Pastor fully admits it is a gimmick...but at the same time I think he shows his heart is to minister truth to people and see them make money their servant, rather than the other way around...plus he has an extra 1000 people to present the gospel to on a Sunday...all for the sake of a lesson using (wisely?) a portion of money from the offering.

Without trying to labour the point, I would just say the verse you mentioned from 1Cor 4:6 is in the context of passing judgment upon people...and from what I see, people are very quick to pass their judgment on this Pastor without a solid basis..this 'work' of his, may well be burnt up as stubble on judgment day...but it might equally reveal beautiful precious stones...time will tell and G-d will judge all our words and works righteously.

Kindly, and may the L-rd continue to sustain and fill you daily with His Spirit. Botz

[KC02]

The pastor is a marketing genius. There is nothing worldly about reaching the lost, nor is it sinful to be smart about promoting your church.

A one million dollar marketing campaign could not have gotten this much attention for the pastor and his church. And people are getting saved to boot.

Which Scripture speaks against wining the lost? Didn't Jesus tell us to compel them to come in? Isn't that exactly what the pastor is doing?

Please stop quoting random, unrelated verses.

Come on guys! I think it is a very smart idea. I was reading about a church called the "Hotdog Church." I emailed the pastor and asked where the name came from. He told me they served hotdogs every Sunday after church. I also know of a church in Atlanta that pays their seniors a small amount of money each month to help them live.

Initially, I didn't go to church for the right reasons. After I was saved, I went to church out of fear. I just knew that if I backslid one more time, God would write me off for good. Eventually God got my heart right. But had I not been attending church at all, this would have never happened.

Gimmick or no gimmick, if people are going to church, I believe it is a good thing. Now I wish my church did that. I could use an extra $500.

Any means necessary that one might be saved.

Huh? ?

Gimmicks have no place in getting people to go to any church that wants to please the Lord.

Jesus nor his disciples used these tactics, which are nothing but worldly ways to get sinners to repentence. This is nothing but a worldly marketing tool used by a worldly church.

What a shame today's marketers and promoters weren't there to share all of their marketing expertise with Jesus, Peter, John Paul, and all the other chosen apostles. They could have completed their mission in half the time, without the persecution that went along with it.

1 John 4:5

5They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

Blessings,

Nikki

[irishcowboy]

and just what is in it for me?????

what do I get?????

hmmm probably nothing, for I am not going to be part of this money game thing....

mike

[nikki1]

Blessings, Kross

Interesting statement. Churches have offered free pizza to get kids to come to events, or modern music, or VBS. These could all be considered gimmicks.

I have seen basketball courts in churches, coffee shops, and any number of things done to invite those who would not otherwise come.

I agree, they are gimmicks, and are used to appeal to the senses and emotions just to get kids to come, when actually these gimmicks can be a distraction to the real Gospel message of Christ. As you say, these people would not come without a worldly marketing tool to lure them. I think if churches and pastors today want to draw the non-churched in, God would bless them tremendously if they did it His way by praying to God to send them the lost and simply teaching people the Gospel message of His Son Jesus Christ, and going out into the community seeking the lost. This is what Jesus authorized and gave His authority to do, using His name.

When the novelty of the worldly gimmick wears off, how long will these people stay, unless there is true commitment that only knowing Christ gives? Worldly gimmicks do not draw anyone to Christ.

John 6:44-45

44No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

45It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

Blessings Botz

Without trying to labour the point, I would just say the verse you mentioned from 1Cor 4:6 is in the context of passing judgment upon people

I don't see it that way. I think it is just a statement the Apostle Paul is using to warn Christians, nothing more or less.

Sorry Nikki...to me that is a bit like saying we should not travel in an airplane, because if G-d had wanted us to fly He would have given us wings. The Bible does not cover every single do and don't that we might come across, but many times gives us a broad frame-work from which to discern right and wrong...and apart from being a gimmick, I have not yet seen something in his ministry that sets off warning bells

That's where I disagree, I think because I believe the Bible does cover this, and the fact the pastor admits to a gimmick, to me, does set off a warning bell. I think we can safely say that we can be sure we are on solid ground if our works are in compliance with God's Word. Likewise, if Jesus and His followers didn't use worldly gimmicks to attract sinners into God's heavenly Kingdom, then we should not either, I believe. Jesus himself denounced certain workers of iniquity-- those who claimed to be his because they cast out demons in His name, prophesized in His name, and did many wonderful works, all in His name. This reminds me of the money gimmicks some of the televangelists and megachurches use to keep the people coming in. But,as scripture says, it turns out, they used His name wrongly and without authority, because Jesus said "I never knew you, depart from me."

Nikki

[Botz]

Well Nikki...you seem to know more about this Pastor his heart and his motives than I do, and have a wealth of Scripture to justify your stance in the thread you initiated. I happen to find it disturbing and a bit worrying that a man can be so quickly condemned on such scanty evidence...even to Scripture being quoted suggesting he may rank amongst those that call on the name of the L-rd, but Jesus says 'depart for I never knew you'.

I think in this instance we are at loggerheads because you evidently emphasize judgment and scriptural truth verses error...whereas I am less concerned about his gimmicky approach and rather more worried by some Christians their reactions and attitudes on such little evidence.