Baptism

[exrockstar]

Baptism in water is a confirmation of ones belief in Christ. It does nothing else but confirm their faith.

confirm their faith to themselves? if it confirms their faith to the public then the public should assume what? that's the baptized has a confirmed faith?

[OneLight]

Baptism is an outward statement of an inward change, a public confirmation to faith. It is not something God does to us, but a confirmation that we are now a follower of Christ. The baptism God does is through the Holy Spirit, not water.

How many baptisms are there? It sounds as if you are saying there is one God does and one we do?

I am. Baptism in water is something we do to express that we are a new creature in Him. We can do this where ever there is water. The baptism that is of God is the baptism of the Holy Spirit. We can not do this, He has to baptize us. Why do you thing John the Baptist said ...

Matthew 3:11

I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

[OneLight]

Baptism in water is a confirmation of ones belief in Christ. It does nothing else but confirm their faith.

confirm their faith to themselves? if it confirms their faith to the public then the public should assume what? that's the baptized has a confirmed faith?

Both. When you verbally confess salvation in Christ, what do you think that does to your? If builds faith and increases steadfastness in Him. The same goes for a baptism. We are baptized unto repentance, meaning that we symbolically die to our flesh and rise as a new creature in Him. Baptism does not create in us a new creature, the Holy Spirit does that.

[Sir Gareth]

A positive shall be saved and not one mention of baptism

And yet Jesus clearly says that one must be baptized in order to be saved.

Can Scripture contradict Scripture?

I say "NO!"

Here is the hermaneutic I use:

If one part of Scripture contains more information than another part of Scripture, then I understand the Scripture with less information to be edified and clarified by the Scripture with more information. I do not understand the Scripture with more information to be made null and void by the Scripture with less information.

That is, IMHO, a good hermaneutic, and one which can be used when reading any writing, not just Sacred Scripture alone.

Mat 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

repent, not be baptised.

Luk 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

unless you repent, not unless your baptised.

Luk 23:39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.

Luk 23:40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?

Luk 23:41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.

Luk 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.

Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise

This man was not baptized, but he was saved.

Act 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

Act 10:48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Cornelius and his household received the Holy Ghost before baptism.

1Co 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

Paul is clearly stating that it is not baptism, but the act of Jesus on the cross that saves.

[OneLight]

How can that be? The majority of people who repent and accept Christ as their savior are not around a body of water. I agree htat it is an outward sign of an inward event, but I disagree with them usually occurring simultaneously.

According to the pattern we see in the NT when one believed he/she was immediacy baptized. On the day of Pentecost those 3000 souls who believed and repented as they

[OneLight]

Baptism in water is something we do to express that we are a new creature in Him. We can do this where ever there is water. The baptism that is of God is the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Are you saying that baptism in water - the rite of Christian baptism that puts one "into Christ Jesus" - is not "of God"? Was it not commanded by the Lord Himself? Doesn't Jesus plainly state that both belief and baptism precede "shall be saved"?

[OneLight]

You are wrong. I used the word because someone used it in a previous post that aI was replying to. You just didn't quote the whole conversation completely, but snipped it to quote only me. Go back to here and start over. You will see that I was not the only one using the word "Simultaneously".

You still haven't answered my question - would you agree the NT teaches there was urgency to being baptized?

Thanks for being big enough to admit you were incorrect in your accusations.

Baptism in water unto repentance is in obedience to scripture and should be followed. Yet, if you are not baptized, you are still saved. As I mentioned in the above post of mine, salvation is a free gift from God and not of any works we can do and baptism is a work. We will be rewarded for our works in Him, but not doing all the works does not mean we will loose salvation.

[Sir Gareth]

The remission of sin- as in infant baptism. We as acommunity uphold that the infant will be brought up in the faith.

Infant baptism means nothing to the child except that they had water placed on their head and that usually gets them really mad. How can a child be baptized when they have no inclination what is happening? This has to be the choice of someone who is aware of what it means. If a parent wants to dedicate their family to the Lord, this is great, but sprinkling of water is only symbolic of their dedication.

The Scriptural support for infant Baptism is here:

Acts 2:39 For the promise is to you, and to your children, and to all that are far off, whomsoever the Lord our God shall call.

There is no minimum age requirement.

That children can be given the gift of faith is here:

Matthew 21:15 And the chief priests and scribes, seeing the wonderful things that he did, and the children crying in the temple, and saying: Hosanna to the son of David; were moved with indignation. 16 And said to him: Hearest thou what these say? And Jesus said to them: Yea, have you never read: Out of the mouth of infants and of sucklings thou hast perfected praise?

and here:

Luke 1:44 For behold as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy.

and here:

Jeremias 1:5 Before I formed thee in the bowels of thy mother, I knew thee: and before thou camest forth out of the womb, I sanctified thee, and made thee a prophet unto the nations.

I am forced to wonder if the RCC ever looks at context.

As with almost every other time the phrase is used in the NT or OT the term 'your children' is used to denote following generations, unless you believe that only issac was blessed and not all the following generations of abraham.

the other uotes have less to do with children and more to do with who is being talked about and what God is doing in their lives.

[OneLight]

Thanks for being big enough to admit you were incorrect in your accusations.

The other poster was not as dogmatic in his usage of the word and I didn

[OneLight]

an answer from CALM.org