What Are the Belif Differances Between Denominations?

[drossfurnace]

What's the deal with the Sabbath (Saturday worship)?

We believe that the fourth commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) commands us to observe the Sabbath day and to keep it holy. Basically, we work for six days of the week (Sunday through Friday evening), and on Fridays at sundown through Saturdays we worship and rest in the Lord.

Well, i guess the obvious question is does following the Sabbath fall under the Mosaic Law guidelines orrrrrrrr do they make it up as they go along?

Im not trying to offend anybody, but there were STRICT Sabbatical guidelines set forth in the O.T. - and they got even stricter when the Rabbis got ahold of them according to their interpretations...

How does this church go about it? No work? No going outside the house? What about phone calls? What if your donkey falls in a dry creekbed or something - should you go get it out? Is driving to the worship service not considered a work? What happens if you belong to their church and "break the sabbath." Is it considered "profaning the Sabbath?" Are there consequences?

I think the purpose and point of the Sabbath commandment was perhaps the same purpose and point of the rest of the commandments and laws: to prove to us, as humans, that its IMPOSSIBLE to keep them without utter dependence on the Lord. The Law served as a tutor unto Christ. When Paul, James, and the elders convened a council to decide what commandments the Gentile Christians should keep, they came up with this in Acts 21:

25"But concerning the Gentiles who have believed, we wrote, having decided that they should abstain from meat sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from fornication."

Thats it. Nothing about the sabbath. Its worthy to read the entire context as well, seeing that some of the Christ believing Jews were a bit pissy with Paul bc they thought he was teaching the nullification of the Law to the Jews. So they convened in the light of this controversy AND STILL came up with no sabbatical commandments to the Gentile believers....

Im just sayin. Maybe im not right, but I think theres a difference between doing things because we view them as COMMANDMENTS and doing things because they're FREE WILL OFFERINGS to the Lord.... and remembering where our justification really comes from.... Also remember: in God's opinion of the Law, if you broke ONE law you broke them all.

James 2:8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, "Love your neighbor as yourself," you are doing right. 9But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. 11For he who said, "Do not commit adultery," also said, "Do not murder." If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.

just some food for thought.....

[Guest Joe in Arkansas]

What's the deal with the Sabbath (Saturday worship)?

We believe that the fourth commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) commands us to observe the Sabbath day and to keep it holy. Basically, we work for six days of the week (Sunday through Friday evening), and on Fridays at sundown through Saturdays we worship and rest in the Lord.

Well, i guess the obvious question is does following the Sabbath fall under the Mosaic Law guidelines orrrrrrrr do they make it up as they go along?

Im not trying to offend anybody, but there were STRICT Sabbatical guidelines set forth in the O.T. - and they got even stricter when the Rabbis got ahold of them according to their interpretations...

How does this church go about it? No work? No going outside the house? What about phone calls? What if your donkey falls in a dry creekbed or something - should you go get it out? Is driving to the worship service not considered a work? What happens if you belong to their church and "break the sabbath." Is it considered "profaning the Sabbath?" Are there consequences?

I think the purpose and point of the Sabbath commandment was perhaps the same purpose and point of the rest of the commandments and laws: to prove to us, as humans, that its IMPOSSIBLE to keep them without utter dependence on the Lord. The Law served as a tutor unto Christ. When Paul, James, and the elders convened a council to decide what commandments the Gentile Christians should keep, they came up with this in Acts 21:

25"But concerning the Gentiles who have believed, we wrote, having decided that they should abstain from meat sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from fornication."

Thats it. Nothing about the sabbath. Its worthy to read the entire context as well, seeing that some of the Christ believing Jews were a bit pissy with Paul bc they thought he was teaching the nullification of the Law to the Jews. So they convened in the light of this controversy AND STILL came up with no sabbatical commandments to the Gentile believers....

Im just sayin. Maybe im not right, but I think theres a difference between doing things because we view them as COMMANDMENTS and doing things because they're FREE WILL OFFERINGS to the Lord.... and remembering where our justification really comes from.... Also remember: in God's opinion of the Law, if you broke ONE law you broke them all.

James 2:8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, "Love your neighbor as yourself," you are doing right. 9But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. 11For he who said, "Do not commit adultery," also said, "Do not murder." If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.

just some food for thought.....

Dear drossfurnace,

It has been my experience that there are NO organized churches that truly teach the truth of Jesus Christ. That is why there are so many different denominations. None of them have very much understanding of scripture. They are blown around by every wind of false doctrine, all the while never coming to know the Truth. In fact, I don't know of any that can even give you a scriptural understanding of the gospel of Jesus Christ. That is why I do not attend any organized church nor will I ever. My fellowship is with Christ and the precious few believers that I have found over the years. I know you probably can't understand why I believe this about the organized churches but if you read some of my recent posts, you will begin to see why. My advice is to search for Jesus Christ and His Truth outside of the churches and inside of scripture. Search for it has for hidden treasure and then the Lord will reveal Himself to you.

Prov 2:1-5 My son, if you receive my words and treasure up my commandments with you, making your ear attentive to wisdom and inclining your heart to understanding; yes, if you call out for insight and raise your voice for understanding. If you seek it like silver and search for it as for hidden treasures, then you will understand the fear of the Lord and find the knowledge of God.

May the Lord bless you,

Joe in Arkansas

[drossfurnace]

Dear drossfurnace,

It has been my experience that there are NO organized churches that truly teach the truth of Jesus Christ. That is why there are so many different denominations. None of them have very much understanding of scripture. They are blown around by every wind of false doctrine, all the while never coming to know the Truth. In fact, I don't know of any that can even give you a scriptural understanding of the gospel of Jesus Christ. That is why I do not attend any organized church nor will I ever. My fellowship is with Christ and the precious few believers that I have found over the years. I know you probably can't understand why I believe this about the organized churches but if you read some of my recent posts, you will begin to see why. My advice is to search for Jesus Christ and His Truth outside of the churches and inside of scripture. Search for it has for hidden treasure and then the Lord will reveal Himself to you.

I hear you loud and clear, friend. Ive spent time in a good number of different churches and denominations... seen the spectrum. From numbers numbers numbers to prayer lines where the pastor pushes your forehead (hard) and everybody goes down. And if you dont go down - you're resisting the Holy Spirit and everybody looks at you like something's wrong with you.

I spent 3 years working with the FourSquare's central church. Went to AofG's yearly Pastor's School Conferences (3 times) and heard the pastor of their central church speak more times than I can count. Got dragged along to H.I.M. prophetic conferences (against my will, as i was in a discipleship program at the time) plenty of times. Went on mobile ministry missions trips to all kinds of different churches from California to Oregon to New Mexico to Colorado. Joined up with YWAM for a time. Heard and saw many of the "big name" pastors/evangelists/prophets of our generation. Was under ridiciculous spiritual authority abusing leaders and watched dozens of my brothers and sisters fall away.

And my experience with all of them over the last 8 years? There's ALLLLL kinds of problems with the churches. But then again, i've also known a good number of people who did the "forsaking organized religion" bit and relied on a few christian believers here and there to have fellowship with. And many of those people, to tell you the truth, fall under the same kinds of crap the denominations do. Judaizing, confusing the Godhead, believing Heaven is already on Earth, believing that there's no such thing as sin, thinking that our sin nature is the anti-christ spoken of in Daniel/thessalonians/etc, or that the prophecies of Revelation ALREADY happened and are therefore NOT actively important for our generation. The only difference between these loners and the more organized churches, many times, are the size of their fellowships.

As a man who experienced LOTS AND LOTS of crazy, ludicrous, abusive, damaging, incorrect teachings in the denominations I can still say this:

Romans 8:28And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him,who have been called according to his purpose.

I think its important , especially for a new believer, to try and find a moderate church to become a part of and to stay there for awhile. That's NOT to say that the believer should absorb EVERYTHING that the pastor says as "Gospel Truth," per say, but to continue to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling. Keep what's from God, toss the rest, and learn from the experiences. Learn how to overcome the crap and LOVE in the face of adversity. Learn how to deal w/ differences and problems in love and not in judgment and bad attitudes. For every terrible hideous thing i saw in the churches, i met AMAZING, GODLY, LOVINGLY people who had walks with God that influenced me positively and helped me grow. And i'd gladly relive all the garbage in order for God to teach me the lessons that He taught me and draw me closer to Him like He's drawn me. I'm thankful for the adversity (or at least i try to be).

The thing about new believers is that they dont know any better. and if they run off and get into some little bible study with WHOEVER (or by themselves), then they're just as likely to fall into wacky theologies and backwards understandings by themselves than as they could in certain denominational churches. Maybe worse. One of my best friends left the organized church and started up with who, in his mind, were his precious few believer friends. It started innocently with "Yahweh this, shalom that..." stuff and next thing you knew he was deeeeeep into governmental hyper-conspiracy theories and smoking herb again, before eventually dedicating his waking moments to reading websites about why the N.S.A. killed Kurt Cobain and the like.......

im just sayin.... i hear ya - but there's two sides to everything and i believe we're called to a balance.

[SeekingHeart]

Forgive me for making this comment, but the two of you seem to be rather judgemental of what others teach and whether or not it is correct. "Remove the plank from your own eye before taking out the sliver in yours brother's eye" so to speak (I know that may not be exactly quoted, but I dont have my bible by me at the moment.

You have your beliefs, and that's great, but there is no need to bash organized religion. At this point in existance, it;s a very indidvidual thing in the end.

As for keeping the sabbath, I believe the church simply means that that is how they chose their service days, and that they are there for people to take spiritual rest in Christ, not that they are necissarily hardcore about not working or leaving your house, ect. I knew a few people that went here, and if they had to work or soemthing came up, they dind't attend service that day, and no one looked down on them for it.

Edited March 26, 2010 by SeekingHeart

[EricH]

So I never really understood the difference between the different Christian denominations, especially the difference between a typical congregational church and an evengelical church?

Please don't use but, fancy words to explaine verything. I just want to know, in basic words a teenager can understand, the difference in denominations.

Thanks!

This is really a broad question. We would have to look at each denomination and fellowship to understand the differences

[drossfurnace]

Forgive me for making this comment, but the two of you seem to be rather judgemental of what others teach and whether or not it is correct. "Remove the plank from your own eye before taking out the sliver in yours brother's eye" so to speak (I know that may not be exactly quoted, but I dont have my bible by me at the moment.

You have your beliefs, and that's great, but there is no need to bash organized religion. At this point in existance, it;s a very indidvidual thing in the end.

As for keeping the sabbath, I believe the church simply means that that is how they chose their service days, and that they are there for people to take spiritual rest in Christ, not that they are necissarily hardcore about not working or leaving your house, ect. I knew a few people that went here, and if they had to work or soemthing came up, they dind't attend service that day, and no one looked down on them for it.

heyyyyy, easy, friend. i hope thats not the attitude that i portrayed there and if it is, i think its one of those "lost-in-communication" things.....

im not bashing organized religion AT ALL. i belong to a church currently, and pretty much have for almost the past 10 years. maybe my second post to joe kindof explains my stance a little bit better....

as far as the sabbath goes, SOMETIMES when churches get into that it becomes a sticky subject. For example, my old landlord belonged to a Christian sabbath keeping church but the guy was a little bit overzealously proud of the fact that he kept sabbath when perhaps others didnt. thats it, friend. if you read the end of what i wrote to Joe, i definitely clearly said that it wasnt a matter of organized religion vs. personal religion but that there are the same pitfalls on both sides. Furthermore, i recommended a new believer JOIN a church... its just i think its important to know the reasons why sabbath keeping churches keep the sabbath - its EXTREMELY important to have the right attitude about that stuff and I wouildnt recommend a new believer, who maybe doesnt necessarily know any better, start off in a church like that.

although, from what you said about how some ppl needed to miss it for work - is seems like theyre doing it more with a "freewill offering" perspective than with a "commandment" perspective..... although in my opinion i still dont quite agree........... but thats just my opinoin i guess

Edited March 26, 2010 by drossfurnace

[Rick-Parker]

What's the deal with the Sabbath (Saturday worship)?

We believe that the fourth commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) commands us to observe the Sabbath day and to keep it holy. Basically, we work for six days of the week (Sunday through Friday evening), and on Fridays at sundown through Saturdays we worship and rest in the Lord.

Well, i guess the obvious question is does following the Sabbath fall under the Mosaic Law guidelines orrrrrrrr do they make it up as they go along?

Im not trying to offend anybody, but there were STRICT Sabbatical guidelines set forth in the O.T. - and they got even stricter when the Rabbis got ahold of them according to their interpretations...

How does this church go about it? No work? No going outside the house? What about phone calls? What if your donkey falls in a dry creekbed or something - should you go get it out? Is driving to the worship service not considered a work? What happens if you belong to their church and "break the sabbath." Is it considered "profaning the Sabbath?" Are there consequences?

I think the purpose and point of the Sabbath commandment was perhaps the same purpose and point of the rest of the commandments and laws: to prove to us, as humans, that its IMPOSSIBLE to keep them without utter dependence on the Lord. The Law served as a tutor unto Christ. When Paul, James, and the elders convened a council to decide what commandments the Gentile Christians should keep, they came up with this in Acts 21:

25"But concerning the Gentiles who have believed, we wrote, having decided that they should abstain from meat sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from fornication."

Thats it. Nothing about the sabbath. Its worthy to read the entire context as well, seeing that some of the Christ believing Jews were a bit pissy with Paul bc they thought he was teaching the nullification of the Law to the Jews. So they convened in the light of this controversy AND STILL came up with no sabbatical commandments to the Gentile believers....

Im just sayin. Maybe im not right, but I think theres a difference between doing things because we view them as COMMANDMENTS and doing things because they're FREE WILL OFFERINGS to the Lord.... and remembering where our justification really comes from.... Also remember: in God's opinion of the Law, if you broke ONE law you broke them all.

James 2:8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, "Love your neighbor as yourself," you are doing right. 9But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. 11For he who said, "Do not commit adultery," also said, "Do not murder." If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.

just some food for thought.....

Dear drossfurnace,

It has been my experience that there are NO organized churches that truly teach the truth of Jesus Christ. That is why there are so many different denominations. None of them have very much understanding of scripture. They are blown around by every wind of false doctrine, all the while never coming to know the Truth. In fact, I don't know of any that can even give you a scriptural understanding of the gospel of Jesus Christ. That is why I do not attend any organized church nor will I ever. My fellowship is with Christ and the precious few believers that I have found over the years. I know you probably can't understand why I believe this about the organized churches but if you read some of my recent posts, you will begin to see why. My advice is to search for Jesus Christ and His Truth outside of the churches and inside of scripture. Search for it has for hidden treasure and then the Lord will reveal Himself to you.

Prov 2:1-5 My son, if you receive my words and treasure up my commandments with you, making your ear attentive to wisdom and inclining your heart to understanding; yes, if you call out for insight and raise your voice for understanding. If you seek it like silver and search for it as for hidden treasures, then you will understand the fear of the Lord and find the knowledge of God.

May the Lord bless you,

Joe in Arkansas

You just haven't been to the right church. There are many who teach through the power of the Holy Spirit, are winning souls for Christ and teaching their congregations nothing but Biblical truths.

[nebula]

The only way for any denomination or any theology to be perfect, it would require the people involved to be perfect.

Any takers?

[nebula]

Anyway, SeekingHeart -

To really understand why there are different denominations, it would require an in-depth learning of church history, as some tried to point out to you. Unfortunately, it's not something that one can type up in a simple paragraph or two.

The thing you need to remember is that when you read the Scriptures, the Lord judges people based on their actions, not the nit-picky details of what they believe. Sure, there are essentials to the faith, but even that can get muffled.

As far as finding the right church to attend, you would be better of learning to seek the Lord and learning to recognize His leading.

There is a verse in Scripture:

Psalm 32:8 - I will instruct you and teach you in the way which you should go; I will counsel you with My eye upon you.

Believe this promise, and then ask the Lord to make it clear to you where to go (believing He will).

It's possible that when you actually visit the church, you will know if you belong there or not, or at least if you want to go back. And it's OK to ask for some form of a sign. It doesn't have to be something bizarre or unnatural, but just asking for something that would be meaningful to you in your search.

I hope that makes sense.

Blessings on your journey!

[Guest Joe in Arkansas]

Dear drossfurnace,

It has been my experience that there are NO organized churches that truly teach the truth of Jesus Christ. That is why there are so many different denominations. None of them have very much understanding of scripture. They are blown around by every wind of false doctrine, all the while never coming to know the Truth. In fact, I don't know of any that can even give you a scriptural understanding of the gospel of Jesus Christ. That is why I do not attend any organized church nor will I ever. My fellowship is with Christ and the precious few believers that I have found over the years. I know you probably can't understand why I believe this about the organized churches but if you read some of my recent posts, you will begin to see why. My advice is to search for Jesus Christ and His Truth outside of the churches and inside of scripture. Search for it has for hidden treasure and then the Lord will reveal Himself to you.

I hear you loud and clear, friend. Ive spent time in a good number of different churches and denominations... seen the spectrum. From numbers numbers numbers to prayer lines where the pastor pushes your forehead (hard) and everybody goes down. And if you dont go down - you're resisting the Holy Spirit and everybody looks at you like something's wrong with you.

I spent 3 years working with the FourSquare's central church. Went to AofG's yearly Pastor's School Conferences (3 times) and heard the pastor of their central church speak more times than I can count. Got dragged along to H.I.M. prophetic conferences (against my will, as i was in a discipleship program at the time) plenty of times. Went on mobile ministry missions trips to all kinds of different churches from California to Oregon to New Mexico to Colorado. Joined up with YWAM for a time. Heard and saw many of the "big name" pastors/evangelists/prophets of our generation. Was under ridiciculous spiritual authority abusing leaders and watched dozens of my brothers and sisters fall away.

And my experience with all of them over the last 8 years? There's ALLLLL kinds of problems with the churches. But then again, i've also known a good number of people who did the "forsaking organized religion" bit and relied on a few christian believers here and there to have fellowship with. And many of those people, to tell you the truth, fall under the same kinds of crap the denominations do. Judaizing, confusing the Godhead, believing Heaven is already on Earth, believing that there's no such thing as sin, thinking that our sin nature is the anti-christ spoken of in Daniel/thessalonians/etc, or that the prophecies of Revelation ALREADY happened and are therefore NOT actively important for our generation. The only difference between these loners and the more organized churches, many times, are the size of their fellowships.

As a man who experienced LOTS AND LOTS of crazy, ludicrous, abusive, damaging, incorrect teachings in the denominations I can still say this:

Romans 8:28And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him,who have been called according to his purpose.

I think its important , especially for a new believer, to try and find a moderate church to become a part of and to stay there for awhile. That's NOT to say that the believer should absorb EVERYTHING that the pastor says as "Gospel Truth," per say, but to continue to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling. Keep what's from God, toss the rest, and learn from the experiences. Learn how to overcome the crap and LOVE in the face of adversity. Learn how to deal w/ differences and problems in love and not in judgment and bad attitudes. For every terrible hideous thing i saw in the churches, i met AMAZING, GODLY, LOVINGLY people who had walks with God that influenced me positively and helped me grow. And i'd gladly relive all the garbage in order for God to teach me the lessons that He taught me and draw me closer to Him like He's drawn me. I'm thankful for the adversity (or at least i try to be).

The thing about new believers is that they dont know any better. and if they run off and get into some little bible study with WHOEVER (or by themselves), then they're just as likely to fall into wacky theologies and backwards understandings by themselves than as they could in certain denominational churches. Maybe worse. One of my best friends left the organized church and started up with who, in his mind, were his precious few believer friends. It started innocently with "Yahweh this, shalom that..." stuff and next thing you knew he was deeeeeep into governmental hyper-conspiracy theories and smoking herb again, before eventually dedicating his waking moments to reading websites about why the N.S.A. killed Kurt Cobain and the like.......

im just sayin.... i hear ya - but there's two sides to everything and i believe we're called to a balance.

Dear Drossfurnace,

Thanks for responding to me. I have attended many different church denominations over the past 30 - 40 years. Rarely do the pastors teach on any subject but what is "pleasing to the ears" of those sitting in the audience. The churches I'm familiar with are run more like businesses, providing entertainment and music along with a very shallow sermon. The goal is to increase membership thereby increasing the funds collected. If growth occurs, much of the money is spent making the building larger or nicer with things like basketball gyms, playgrounds, or anything that will attract and keep members. The increase in headcount and funds raised are the factors they consider on whether they are successful or not. The church ends up with shallow uncommitted members resting on their pastor's assurances of their individual salvation. Very little spiritual growth occurs in churches like these. As you are probably aware, spiritual babes are no different that bondservents who are not heirs to the promise. I know that not all churches are like that - but I still don't know of any that encourage it's members to really study scripture like the Bereans did. In the organized church settings, false teachers are very successful in leading the members astray. I encourage everyone to take personal responsibility to study (not just read) for themselves. You would be surprised the find out that scripture and what organized churches teach are miles a part. It seems that very few believers really have a love of the truth and because of this, have fallen prey to the errors taught by supposedly spiritual men of God. I do want to point out that for the most part, the church leaders are very sincere but they are still deceived. That's enough comment from me on this subject. The organized churches are what they are by the will of God and they serve their purpose in His plan for mankind. I do not seek or desire to change them but I do hope to expose their teachings to those who have been given ears to hear the true gospel of Christ so that they will come out from among them.

Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

May the Lord bless you all in your search for hidden treasure which is the knowledge of God.

Joe in Arkansas