Have the gifts of the Holy Spirit ceased?

[Scudbuddy]

Answered apostles. Ananais wasn't an apostle. Paul got the gift from a non-apostle.

Go back a couple of post. I

[Scudbuddy]

SO what is the difference between your

[Nebuchadnezza10]

Went back a couple of post. Still not finding it.

Read the verses you claim catagorically support your posistion, and what I find is a history of apostles laying hands on people and them getting the Holy Spirit. What I don't find is where it says that they are the only ones who can pray it on you. Not there. Just a presumption on your part while ignoring Ananais and the fact that no one layed hands on the 120.

Acts 8:18

When Simon saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles' hands, he offered them money

2 Timothy 1

6For this reason I remind you to fan into flame the gift of God, which is in you through the laying on of my hands. 7For God did not give us a spirit of timidity, but a spirit of power, of love and of self-discipline.

Act 8

14When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Samaria had accepted the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them. 15When they arrived, they prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, 16because the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them; they had simply been baptized into[3] the name of the Lord Jesus. 17Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

Therer are the vs

[Scudbuddy]

Went back a couple of post. Still not finding it.

Read the verses you claim catagorically support your posistion, and what I find is a history of apostles laying hands on people and them getting the Holy Spirit. What I don't find is where it says that they are the only ones who can pray it on you. Not there. Just a presumption on your part while ignoring Ananais and the fact that no one layed hands on the 120.

Acts 8:18

When Simon saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles' hands, he offered them money

2 Timothy 1

6For this reason I remind you to fan into flame the gift of God, which is in you through the laying on of my hands. 7For God did not give us a spirit of timidity, but a spirit of power, of love and of self-discipline.

Act 8

14When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Samaria had accepted the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them. 15When they arrived, they prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, 16because the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them; they had simply been baptized into[3] the name of the Lord Jesus. 17Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.

Therer are the vs

[Botz]

Ok Neb I will try again real slow. You said.....

The vs

[Nebuchadnezza10]

You keep quoting those verses as if they do what you say they do. They only confirm that at those times the apostles layed hands on others. That is it. You can't get more out of it.

Yes! They layed hands on people ad then what happened?

Now you have Ananais as MAYBE one of the 70. But the 70 were not apostles. And you offer no proof that he was one of the 70, all the while ignoring the 120. Btw, 70 + 12 only = 82. 38 are still not even them.

I think I must have misunderstood where you were coming from with regards to Ananais.

Ananais did not pass on the Gift of the holy spirit but he did have the ability to heal. Right? So Ananais could very easily have received the gifts from the apostles at a certain time. Just because it is not mentioned does not mean it did not happen. The three vs

[Scudbuddy]

Neb said,

"I think I must have misunderstood where you were coming from with regards to Ananais.

Ananais did not pass on the Gift of the holy spirit but he did have the ability to heal. Right? So Ananais could very easily have received the gifts from the apostles at a certain time. Just because it is not mentioned does not mean it did not happen. The three vs

[Nebuchadnezza10]

Neb said,

"I think I must have misunderstood where you were coming from with regards to Ananais.

Ananais did not pass on the Gift of the holy spirit but he did have the ability to heal. Right? So Ananais could very easily have received the gifts from the apostles at a certain time. Just because it is not mentioned does not mean it did not happen. The three vs

[Scudbuddy]

With those verses, you have stated that they "catagorically" stated that "only the apostles could pass on the gifts." Yet now, it is not so "catagorically." Now you got some logic and reasoning saying "Why else", to try to figure out what was going on.

You also try some of that logic to keep Ananais from being the one that passed on the Holy Spirit to Paul. You ignore that he got healed in that prayer meeting also. Ananais said to Paul that God had sent him to Paul so that he could regain his eyesight AND be filled with the Holy Spirit. This was the reason he was sent.

Now you and I know that if Ananais was only sent to pray for healing, only to take Paul to apostles to be filled with the Holy Spirit, it would have said so. This is too important to the Cessationist theology for God to be confusing everybody with mixed messages that have to be broken down and explained everytime a Cessationist wants it his way. And then God has Paul preaching in such a way that it amazes everybody. Yet no contact with Apostles yet.

Notice in vs. 19 he is not among any apostles, just some of the disciples. ("learners" in the greek). Then in 20. This man who has had no contact with the apostles is amazing the disciples with his powerful preaching. Vs.27 shows the time that he came to the disciples. Notice also that in that contact the apostles didn't pray for him to recieve the Holy Spirit.

That is Bobby Fischer style.

[Scudbuddy]

A secular source reports this story. Actually I can print a few secular sources if you don't think this is enough. This is for the logical and reasoned cynics out there.

1st. Teenager survived 8 days without water. Her church prayed for her.

2nd. One of the woman at her church kept on having dreams and visions about her from the Lord telling her she was alive, and then showed her where she was.

What I am wondering is if it was Paul or Peter who laid hands on her to receive the gift of prophecy?

________________________________________________________________________________

Teen Is Found Alive After Eight Days

Mon Oct 11, 9:17 AM ET

REDMOND, Wash. - A teenager missing for eight days has been found alive in her wrecked car by a woman who said prayer and dreams led her to the site.

Laura Hatch, 17, last seen at a party Oct. 2, was found Sunday in her 1996 Toyota Camry about 150 feet below a road in this suburb east of Seattle, King County sheriff's deputies said.

Hatch was listed in serious condition at Harborview Medical Center in Seattle, where she was being treated for severe dehydration, a possible blood clot near her brain, broken ribs, a broken leg and facial injuries, said her sister, Amy Hatch.

"We were afraid that we weren't going to find her, we weren't going to get her back," the sister told KING Television in Seattle. "This is the best thing that could happen because there were a million awful scenarios."

More than 100 friends and acquaintances from Creekside Covenant Church cheered and sang at a celebratory prayer service that initially had been scheduled as a vigil Sunday night.

"We had already given her up and let her be dead in our hearts," her mother, Jean Hatch, told KOMO-TV.

Hatch evidently went eight days without food or water, sheriff's Sgt. John Urquhart said, adding that there had been no indication of foul play.

"There was no police search," he added. "We felt she was most likely a runaway. Obviously, there was another reason."

Parents Jean and Todd Hatch hired a private investigator and on Saturday organized an unsuccessful search with 200 volunteers in areas near the place where the car was found.

Sha Nohr, a church member and mother of a friend of Hatch, said she had several vivid dreams of a wooded area with the message, "Keep going, keep going," after she went to bed Saturday night.

She said she awakened Sunday morning with an urgent need to look for Hatch, had her daughter join her and drove to the area where the crash occurred, stopping at one point, then leaving because "it just didn't feel right" and going to another spot.

Along the way, Nohr said, she prayed: "I just thought, 'Let her speak out to us,'"

At the second stop something drew her to clamber over a concrete barrier and more than 100 feet down a steep, densely vegetated embankment where she barely managed to discern the wrecked car in some trees.

She called to her daughter, who flagged down a passing motorist and the man helped Nohr get closer to the car as aid was summoned.

"I told her that people were looking for her and they loved her," Nohr recalled, "and she said, 'I think I might be late for curfew.' "