The Lord's dealings with me...and what to do?

[mizzdy]

I too am discouraged with "Churchianity", and long for a true fellowship of believers.

South and I are blessed in that respect. I guess because we are a smaller church of about 100 families there is never a day that we don't meet with someone from our church, many of whom are good friends. We do a ton of stuff together, from church camps, movie evenings, breakfasts, fishing, and just hanging out. We have a bulk sms system and hardly a day goes by that we are not informed of stuff, some menial family news, to more important announcements, etc.

Just thinking about today, I met three people I can remember and just stopped to say hi and have a chat on the side of the road.

When one of us is ill, besides prayer, hardly a night will go by that food is not delivered to our home if there is no one to cook dinner, and often even when there is.

It is a true family of believers. As I said, we are blessed to have a church like it.

I dont get to see others during the week because we live on the other side of town from our fellowship, I cant drive but other than that I would also see and even be involved with many from fellowship. We do keep up and in touch with one another via the net and phone though. Most of our families and people at our fellowship see each other all week long, some work together, some volunteer together. When we come together as a family, as a fellowship we share with each other, trials, triumphs, everything. We give praise reports as well as share our heartaches and ask for prayers for things we are struggling with, that to me is a true fellowship. If I had to sit in a church that didnt do all these things that didnt allow for sharing and caring, that didnt allow any of us to speak up when we need help or even have others come to us and ask if theres anything they can do, I just dont think I could stay in a church that didnt. Like you I feel very very blessed to have found a fellowship like I have, a true family devoted to Yeshua and Yahweh and to one another.

shalom,

Mizz

[Fez]

I too am discouraged with "Churchianity", and long for a true fellowship of believers.

South and I are blessed in that respect. I guess because we are a smaller church of about 100 families there is never a day that we don't meet with someone from our church, many of whom are good friends. We do a ton of stuff together, from church camps, movie evenings, breakfasts, fishing, and just hanging out. We have a bulk sms system and hardly a day goes by that we are not informed of stuff, some menial family news, to more important announcements, etc.

Just thinking about today, I met three people I can remember and just stopped to say hi and have a chat on the side of the road.

When one of us is ill, besides prayer, hardly a night will go by that food is not delivered to our home if there is no one to cook dinner, and often even when there is.

It is a true family of believers. As I said, we are blessed to have a church like it.

I dont get to see others during the week because we live on the other side of town from our fellowship, I cant drive but other than that I would also see and even be involved with many from fellowship. We do keep up and in touch with one another via the net and phone though. Most of our families and people at our fellowship see each other all week long, some work together, some volunteer together. When we come together as a family, as a fellowship we share with each other, trials, triumphs, everything. We give praise reports as well as share our heartaches and ask for prayers for things we are struggling with, that to me is a true fellowship. If I had to sit in a church that didnt do all these things that didnt allow for sharing and caring, that didnt allow any of us to speak up when we need help or even have others come to us and ask if theres anything they can do, I just dont think I could stay in a church that didnt. Like you I feel very very blessed to have found a fellowship like I have, a true family devoted to Yeshua and Yahweh and to one another.

shalom,

Mizz

Amen Mizz.

Another thing I love is the children s church. They stay with us through worship at the beginning of the service, and then before we do announcements, etc, our pastor often says "Ok kids, one, two, three, go!" There is a general stampede for the rooms they use for children's church and suddenly the church looks half empty

I don't know if it is relief to get away from us adults, or the fun they have, but after our service they are often still involved and sometimes only come back 10 or so minutes after the service is over. We are blessed to have 5 or 6 school teachers in our congregation, all of them mothers, so they are in good hands.

They are the future, and one prays that what they learn now will stand them on the foundation of faith the are surely going to need as they grow. They also know the meaning of fellowship from an early age.

[AnotherSinner]

Carlos,

Thank you for sharing with us. Hope that God continues to work in and through you.

A closer relationship with God is something sought and very much desired for me

as well. Sometimes find myself reading the bible daily just to get more time with

Him.

The church, much as those who run it, is imperfect and in need of correction. Just

as we each are in need of the seeking of righteousness knowing that we can or

may stumble and fall. The church too must grow in faith and obedience.

Some of your experience you shared here makes me think of David. He was a

man referred to as one after God's heart. Should that not the be the desire for

each of us? To be after God's heart and to love Him with all of our own?

Fame, fortune, none of those earthly things can or ever will measure up to the

love God has for us. Amen? The peace too that can be found in a relationship

with God too is truly wonderful. Especially when trust as well as faith is put in

Him. He can truly do some amazing things with our lives if we just let Him have

control.

At the present seeing as the internet is really the primary way I can keep in

touch with friends and family...it is what is being used to share God with. Did

not realize much until recently how many of my friends I thought were Christians

growing up...are in fact, not. Do you have any advice for me as to how I can

continue my walk in faith? God is first and foremost in my life at the present time

after a recent decision and conclusion that that is where He should and needs

to be.

I have started removing much of the mocking or jeering things that they sometimes

might post from my alerts on Facebook. Otherwise I have a group that I use to share

God's word with friends and family as I have family though, their belief might be in

God....are really in some serious sinful situations and have not surrendered their

lives to Him.

Is there more I can do? Should I pray on this matter? Have you been in such a

predicament?

Thanks again for sharing Carlos.

Just Another Sinner Seeking The Way

Dani

[mizzdy]

I too am discouraged with "Churchianity", and long for a true fellowship of believers.

South and I are blessed in that respect. I guess because we are a smaller church of about 100 families there is never a day that we don't meet with someone from our church, many of whom are good friends. We do a ton of stuff together, from church camps, movie evenings, breakfasts, fishing, and just hanging out. We have a bulk sms system and hardly a day goes by that we are not informed of stuff, some menial family news, to more important announcements, etc.

Just thinking about today, I met three people I can remember and just stopped to say hi and have a chat on the side of the road.

When one of us is ill, besides prayer, hardly a night will go by that food is not delivered to our home if there is no one to cook dinner, and often even when there is.

It is a true family of believers. As I said, we are blessed to have a church like it.

I dont get to see others during the week because we live on the other side of town from our fellowship, I cant drive but other than that I would also see and even be involved with many from fellowship. We do keep up and in touch with one another via the net and phone though. Most of our families and people at our fellowship see each other all week long, some work together, some volunteer together. When we come together as a family, as a fellowship we share with each other, trials, triumphs, everything. We give praise reports as well as share our heartaches and ask for prayers for things we are struggling with, that to me is a true fellowship. If I had to sit in a church that didnt do all these things that didnt allow for sharing and caring, that didnt allow any of us to speak up when we need help or even have others come to us and ask if theres anything they can do, I just dont think I could stay in a church that didnt. Like you I feel very very blessed to have found a fellowship like I have, a true family devoted to Yeshua and Yahweh and to one another.

shalom,

Mizz

Amen Mizz.

Another thing I love is the children s church. They stay with us through worship at the beginning of the service, and then before we do announcements, etc, our pastor often says "Ok kids, one, two, three, go!" There is a general stampede for the rooms they use for children's church and suddenly the church looks half empty

I don't know if it is relief to get away from us adults, or the fun they have, but after our service they are often still involved and sometimes only come back 10 or so minutes after the service is over. We are blessed to have 5 or 6 school teachers in our congregation, all of them mothers, so they are in good hands.

They are the future, and one prays that what they learn now will stand them on the foundation of faith the are surely going to need as they grow. They also know the meaning of fellowship from an early age.

Isnt that funny! we have 7 teachers in our fellowship! lol Also a retired principal, and another retired teacher! lol Our kids stay with us during worship, we even have our kids giving praise reports of what happend during the week. After all that they go forward to tell us all their memory verses and then we pray over them, after that they go to their classes then meet back up for oneg, potluck which we do every Sabbath. Yes oh yes they are our future! I just recently took up writing the curriculum for our little ones, its been a struggle to get back into writing lesson plans but I am finding what a great blessing it is to be in service to Him this way. Seems our fellowships have a lot in common!

shalom,

Mizz

[nebula]

I too am discouraged with "Churchianity", and long for a true fellowship of believers.

South and I are blessed in that respect. I guess because we are a smaller church of about 100 families there is never a day that we don't meet with someone from our church, many of whom are good friends. We do a ton of stuff together, from church camps, movie evenings, breakfasts, fishing, and just hanging out. We have a bulk sms system and hardly a day goes by that we are not informed of stuff, some menial family news, to more important announcements, etc.

Just thinking about today, I met three people I can remember and just stopped to say hi and have a chat on the side of the road.

When one of us is ill, besides prayer, hardly a night will go by that food is not delivered to our home if there is no one to cook dinner, and often even when there is.

It is a true family of believers. As I said, we are blessed to have a church like it.

Yes, you are blessed.

[saved34]

You have an amazing testimony ,Carlos. I'm praying with you and for you my brother. If you are feeling the urge to change things why not enter the ministry? Could it be that God is calling you into full time service for him? I hear you express displeasure because you cannot go into service and say things that you would like, honestly, I can see your point but I think it is good that not everyone can stand and "teach" the congregation. God has called qualified men to feed his flock (not that you are not), he has set things in decency and in order. It is the way the Church is guarded from wolves coming in and mauling the flock. Elders are to watch out for things like this, and they are not told to allow just anyone to come in with a doctrine, or teaching, or how they feel about situations.

1Pe 5:1 Therefore, I exhort the elders among you, as your fellow elder and witness of the sufferings of Christ, and a partaker also of the glory that is to be revealed,

1Pe 5:2 shepherd the flock of God among you, exercising oversight not under compulsion, but voluntarily, according to the will of God; and not for sordid gain, but with eagerness;

1Ti 5:17 The elders who rule well are to be considered worthy of double honor, especially those who work hard at preaching and teaching.

Heb 13:7 Remember your leaders, those who spoke to you the word of God. Consider the outcome of their way of life, and imitate their faith.

I think we should be careful when we get this "lone ranger" complex where we feel like we have the truth and everyone else around us is wrong. The "emergent church" so called sprang from a similar idea that the church was not doing things quite right, so they set out to make changes. Let's not confuse the prophetic Apostasy of the visible Church, with failure of the Church. God still has his people laboring hard in the field, and souls are still being saved. You are no where near alone in knowing the truth or desiring to see souls truly saved and serving Christ. God is wise, and he has not left these things dependent upon our own knowledge or skills. Just as you have a desire for the real and the true, God probably has 7 more just like you with the exact same desire, more than willing to step forth.

Rom 11:3 "Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life."

Rom 11:4 But what is God's reply to him? "I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal."

Luk 9:49 John answered, "Master, we saw someone casting out demons in your name, and we tried to stop him, because he does not follow with us."

Luk 9:50 But Jesus said to him, "Do not stop him, for the one who is not against you is for you."

That hunger and desire to get the truth out may be your call to preach. I feel the same urging and pressing in my own life.

[carlos123]

Dear Dani,

I hope it is okay to start out calling you dear as I view you as a beloved sister in the Lord Dani.

What a change has come about in your heart through a surrendered walk before Him!! God's purpose in having us surrender ourselves to Him fully by faith is NOT to rip us off but to give us ALL of Himself that it is possible to have! Leading us to enjoy our fellowship with Him in ways that we could have only imagined before the point of faith that results in surrender.

For those coming to this thread and not having read the other thread where we discussed this let me just say that surrendering to God does NOT involve perfect obedience from now on. It involves a choice to trust Him as God through the Gospel and yield to Him as such in our lives in so far as we know what His will is. Letting Him do with us whatever He might will to do with us and repenting from ALL known sin.

Again that does not mean that we won't sin ever again or will not struggle with certain things. It only means that we have made a decision in life to put into practice what we claim to believe about God as an expression of true faith in Him through the Word.

Getting back to what you asked about Dani.

Is there more I can do? Should I pray on this matter? Have you been in such a predicament?

First off let me say and say defniitively Dani that the Lord is real and that we can and do have relationship with Him by faith in the Gospel. He is a Living Being. Not just a person talked about in some book called the Bible.

He wants you. He wants intimate relationship with you. And nothing holds Him back from having that with you if you so desire it and approach Him and relationship to Him by faith.

What do I mean by approaching Him by faith? I mean coming before Him through the truth contained in the Word about what He is like as a person. As you read about Jesus and His interactions with others you must take hold of what you see and approach the Lord acting in faith regarding what you see in Him through the Word. Do you see love? He loves you that way too! Don't be afraid of Him. Rather draw near trusting that He loves you. Do you see compassion? He wants to have compassion on you too! Draw near to Him by faith in His willingness to be compassionate with you. To understand you. To live in and through you to experience with you whatever you are experiencing.

I remember one time I was so dirt poor that I only had money to get some sphagetti and some tomatoe paste that I added a little water to, to make a poor man's tomatoe sauce. After I had put the spaghetti on my plate and had put on some "sauce" I invited the Lord to eat with me. The Presence of God came down into that room and enveloped me. So much so that I could not eat! I mean I started eating eventually but that God, GOD would stoop down to dine with me on such poor fare overwhelmed me. I started weeping. Just weeping in gratitude to God.

I share that not to say or imply that you and I will always have such experiences. They are relatively rare. I mean I can't today duplicate that by going out and buying some cheap spaghetti and asking the Lord to join me in a meal again. But in the context of relationship with Him by faith YES we can experience God and His magnificent presence. I experienced His magnificent presence even this morning as I prayed about some things where He led me to realize that I had not been trusting Him as I ought. I broke before Him and wept like you would not believe all over again. Such weeping in His presence can have a wonderful cleansing effect.

Which brings me to another point to keep in mind Dani. Fellowship with the Lord IS possible even when we have no one around us at all! To be sure fellowship with Him is enhanced and enriched as we interact with Him by faith personally AND corporately through His Body. But there will be times in our lives (as is the case with me at this time) where we are not in a local Body for whatever reason (and no, for all of you who might jump on the bandwagon to say that I am rebellious and unwilling to be in submission...this has nothing to do with rebellion in my heart and a lack of willingness to submit to church leadership). I tell you the truth Dani that God is not constrained to provide us with real fellowship with Him THROUGH a Body. Being in a Body is best but our relationship is with the Lord! He can relate to us and we can relate and interact with Him even if we were the only person left in this world.

And so can you.

He will meet your needs for fellowship, love, and whatever else you might need as you look to Him and walk by faith in who He is as a person.

That may be through others but it can also be directly from Him as you spend time with Him.

It has been my experience that God operates both ways (through others and through Himself) as suits His will for us.

So don't get discouraged if you are not able to be in the kind of fellowship that He might ideally want you to be in Dani. He has you where you are for a reason. Don't fret or get anxious about it. Just learn to trust Him and draw near to Him by faith in who He is right where you are. In the state of life in which you may find yourself.

I mean do what you can to find good fellowship but if despite your trying to do so you just can't find it at this time don't worry about it. Just keep it as an object of prayer before Him. Pour out your heart before Him and trust Him to lead you as you continue to seek Him.

Definitely read the Word. Especially the Gospels I would recommend Dani. Observe and gaze upon Jesus and how He interacted with people. Ask God to open your heart to see Jesus in all His magnificence. Such that you might grow in your love for who He is. Trust what you see in Him by faith and act on it in your everyday life to whatever degree you can and the Lord will enlarge your heart to fathom and grasp more of His wonderful person.

Which in turn will encourage you to act by faith even more causing you to grow.

Love others around you Dani. Ask the Lord to help you love others as He loves them. To see them through His eyes. And act to do for others what you would have them do for you.

The Lord will give you opportunity to love.

In saying all this Dani I know that I may come across like someone who has it together. Nothing could be further from the truth. I am a flop. A fish flopping around out of the water when it comes to walking before God as I ought to walk. But He is working on me and I KNOW without a shadow of a doubt that I am as the apple of His eye. That He LOVES me with an undying love. And that He has forgiven me of ALL my sin such that I can get up and walk righteously before Him from any sin I may fall into it. Such that He accepts me through Christ and NEVER beats me on the head nor EVER tells me "I told you so!". He is madly in love with me and holds me in His hands. Nothing and no one can take me from Him and He takes me by the hand whenever I reach up to grasp the great big hand of my great big heavenly Daddy! To walk forward as He leads me. One toterring step at a time.

As a Christian He is that way with you too Dani!

Learn to trust Him in your walk just as you have trusted Him for your forgiveness through the cross. He WILL be there for you and WILL help you Dani. Just look to Him.

Carlos

[carlos123]

You have an amazing testimony ,Carlos. I'm praying with you and for you my brother. ...

Thanks for your encouragement Saved! Your post brought up some excellent points!

I still think that God's way of operating through the Church is different from the way we see so many churches operating today but absolutely for sure Saved. Elders are there for a reason. To safeguard the flock is a big one!

Carlos

[carlos123]

You admitted Fault!!!

Key component Carlos!!! You blew it!! Even though God has a plan, We can mess it up.

Wonderful input and exhortation BelieveInHim! Truly!

Right on in your entire post and truth that I need to keep in mind. God is bigger than my failure! And He does indeed have more in mind for my life. That is truth to live by!

I so often think of myself as a has been. A miserably failure that is unfit to live. Many times I have all but despaired and sometimes have even wanted to kill myself (don't be concerned it's not something I often want to do but sometimes when I get my eyes off the Lord I fall into thinking such things).

My earthly father always thought of me as a failure and it has been a struggle for me to see myself as anything but all of my life. Even in Christian things.

I forgave my father but it still affects me.

Maybe that is a good thing. For within that tendency there lies humility where if I do not lean on God and stay leaning on Him these things will rise up out of my flesh to bring in ruin and death where I will begin to minister death instead of life.

I don't want that and neither does God for my life.

He redeemed me with the precious blood of Jesus and has good works that He wants me to be doing that do not invove being a failure. Faith in Him is what keeps me going. It is what enables me to look up when circumstantially there are times when there is hardly anything to look up about from a natural perspective.

Carlos

[AnotherSinner]

Dear Dani,

I hope it is okay to start out calling you dear as I view you as a beloved sister in the Lord Dani.

What a change has come about in your heart through a surrendered walk before Him!! God's purpose in having us surrender ourselves to Him fully by faith is NOT to rip us off but to give us ALL of Himself that it is possible to have! Leading us to enjoy our fellowship with Him in ways that we could have only imagined before the point of faith that results in surrender.

For those coming to this thread and not having read the other thread where we discussed this let me just say that surrendering to God does NOT involve perfect obedience from now on. It involves a choice to trust Him as God through the Gospel and yield to Him as such in our lives in so far as we know what His will is. Letting Him do with us whatever He might will to do with us and repenting from ALL known sin.

Again that does not mean that we won't sin ever again or will not struggle with certain things. It only means that we have made a decision in life to put into practice what we claim to believe about God as an expression of true faith in Him through the Word.

Getting back to what you asked about Dani.

Is there more I can do? Should I pray on this matter? Have you been in such a predicament?

First off let me say and say defniitively Dani that the Lord is real and that we can and do have relationship with Him by faith in the Gospel. He is a Living Being. Not just a person talked about in some book called the Bible.

He wants you. He wants intimate relationship with you. And nothing holds Him back from having that with you if you so desire it and approach Him and relationship to Him by faith.

What do I mean by approaching Him by faith? I mean coming before Him through the truth contained in the Word about what He is like as a person. As you read about Jesus and His interactions with others you must take hold of what you see and approach the Lord acting in faith regarding what you see in Him through the Word. Do you see love? He loves you that way too! Don't be afraid of Him. Rather draw near trusting that He loves you. Do you see compassion? He wants to have compassion on you too! Draw near to Him by faith in His willingness to be compassionate with you. To understand you. To live in and through you to experience with you whatever you are experiencing.

I remember one time I was so dirt poor that I only had money to get some sphagetti and some tomatoe paste that I added a little water to, to make a poor man's tomatoe sauce. After I had put the spaghetti on my plate and had put on some "sauce" I invited the Lord to eat with me. The Presence of God came down into that room and enveloped me. So much so that I could not eat! I mean I started eating eventually but that God, GOD would stoop down to dine with me on such poor fare overwhelmed me. I started weeping. Just weeping in gratitude to God.

I share that not to say or imply that you and I will always have such experiences. They are relatively rare. I mean I can't today duplicate that by going out and buying some cheap spaghetti and asking the Lord to join me in a meal again. But in the context of relationship with Him by faith YES we can experience God and His magnificent presence. I experienced His magnificent presence even this morning as I prayed about some things where He led me to realize that I had not been trusting Him as I ought. I broke before Him and wept like you would not believe all over again. Such weeping in His presence can have a wonderful cleansing effect.

Which brings me to another point to keep in mind Dani. Fellowship with the Lord IS possible even when we have no one around us at all! To be sure fellowship with Him is enhanced and enriched as we interact with Him by faith personally AND corporately through His Body. But there will be times in our lives (as is the case with me at this time) where we are not in a local Body for whatever reason (and no, for all of you who might jump on the bandwagon to say that I am rebellious and unwilling to be in submission...this has nothing to do with rebellion in my heart and a lack of willingness to submit to church leadership). I tell you the truth Dani that God is not constrained to provide us with real fellowship with Him THROUGH a Body. Being in a Body is best but our relationship is with the Lord! He can relate to us and we can relate and interact with Him even if we were the only person left in this world.

And so can you.

He will meet your needs for fellowship, love, and whatever else you might need as you look to Him and walk by faith in who He is as a person.

That may be through others but it can also be directly from Him as you spend time with Him.

It has been my experience that God operates both ways (through others and through Himself) as suits His will for us.

So don't get discouraged if you are not able to be in the kind of fellowship that He might ideally want you to be in Dani. He has you where you are for a reason. Don't fret or get anxious about it. Just learn to trust Him and draw near to Him by faith in who He is right where you are. In the state of life in which you may find yourself.

I mean do what you can to find good fellowship but if despite your trying to do so you just can't find it at this time don't worry about it. Just keep it as an object of prayer before Him. Pour out your heart before Him and trust Him to lead you as you continue to seek Him.

Definitely read the Word. Especially the Gospels I would recommend Dani. Observe and gaze upon Jesus and how He interacted with people. Ask God to open your heart to see Jesus in all His magnificence. Such that you might grow in your love for who He is. Trust what you see in Him by faith and act on it in your everyday life to whatever degree you can and the Lord will enlarge your heart to fathom and grasp more of His wonderful person.

Which in turn will encourage you to act by faith even more causing you to grow.

Love others around you Dani. Ask the Lord to help you love others as He loves them. To see them through His eyes. And act to do for others what you would have them do for you.

The Lord will give you opportunity to love.

In saying all this Dani I know that I may come across like someone who has it together. Nothing could be further from the truth. I am a flop. A fish flopping around out of the water when it comes to walking before God as I ought to walk. But He is working on me and I KNOW without a shadow of a doubt that I am as the apple of His eye. That He LOVES me with an undying love. And that He has forgiven me of ALL my sin such that I can get up and walk righteously before Him from any sin I may fall into it. Such that He accepts me through Christ and NEVER beats me on the head nor EVER tells me "I told you so!". He is madly in love with me and holds me in His hands. Nothing and no one can take me from Him and He takes me by the hand whenever I reach up to grasp the great big hand of my great big heavenly Daddy! To walk forward as He leads me. One toterring step at a time.

As a Christian He is that way with you too Dani!

Learn to trust Him in your walk just as you have trusted Him for your forgiveness through the cross. He WILL be there for you and WILL help you Dani. Just look to Him.

Carlos

Carlos,

Thank you once again for sharing. There is so much in life that is wanted nothing more than to change. Habitual practices of wrong choice of words and action, slowing the quickness to anger, and practicing all the more of patience are but a few in a walk in faith that are things being desperately sought.

So many times people have said, you can tell what kind of person a person is by the sort of company or friends he or she keeps. Did a lot of reflecting on that, and realized....much of those Jesus called were either ordinary people or those who were in desperate need of faith.

God has provided much of what is needed in life, it is more or less a matter of taking more time out to appreciate those things. For there are many others out there who do not even have that much.

Thank you for sharing your experience with me. Truly do look to others as along with God's word. For those who have experience can sometimes aid in the search for truth.

Just Another Sinner Seeking The Way

Dani