Womanhood

[Sevenseas]

Who can find a virtuous woman?

Probably a virtuous man could.......(because a virtuous woman, at least every one I know, would probably run from one who was not)

And if he cannot, he should probably be wondering what is it he is doing wrong.

So what makes a virtuous man? (In a biblical way)

What makes a virtuous man Fez? I think that you bring up a good point.

Lets ask the women what they think?

I think I like what Amateur Poet is saying

So many attributes are defined in scripture of a godly man. To keep it short, though, here are some qualities that I believe make up a virtuous man:

1. A man who even when wronged, turns the other cheek and does not act in reciprocation. He is patient, gentle, loving, forgiving and exhibits self control.

2. A man who thinks things through and prays before making serious decisions. He is a man of wisdom, reliability, courage, and faith.

3. A man who does what is right even if it means there is no profit or any reward in it for him. He is trustworthy, integrity, and humility.

There are many more that could be added to this. Some of these though are ones that I thought were perhaps the most important.

....some of the things I appreciate in my own husband are patience, performs drudgery without complaining (that same drudgery would drive me bananas), he shows kindness to

strangers, he considers himself to have the gift of 'helps'...and that is rare.., he encourages me in my own work (photography) and he does NOT hold a grudge.

I agree with poet tho, there is PLENTY in the Bible about men

[Sevenseas]

OK Fez, at WB I will refrain from using that term, but I hope others can control their impulses to bring it back up again to demonize and isolate me? As for women being CEO's and Directors of Companies, I am saying that there is nothing in Proverbs 31 that indicates they would be an example of a virtuous woman. Biblically speaking, women were created as a help meet to their husbands. That is found right there in Genesis, and the Bible also states that the man was not created for the woman, but the woman for the man. It also says that the head of every woman is the man, the head of man is Christ, and the head of Christ is God. We all have God-given roles, and Satan teaches people to rebel against them.

As to the women CEO's and Directors comment... So you're saying that a leader in a company, organization, church, etc. that happensto be a woman is not showing Biblical viritues espoused in the Bible and in particular Proverbs 31?

"Help meet"... Interesting term. Are you a fan of the Michael and Debbie Pearl? Curious.

Once again IMO it seems like another thread (in particular regarding the role of women, abuse, and/or legalism) being monopolized and/or derailed by one member's opinions... Perhaps it's just me?

No sir...not just you......it's quite tiresome and boorish

[JCISGD]

The characterstc`s of the adulterous woman are in direct contrast to that of the Prv 31 woman. She is loud, contentious, lacking discretion, cant stay at home and be at peace, gets at her husband like a "continual dripping", " She eats and wipes her mouth, And says, “I have done no wickedness.” she "pulls down her own house" and above all she dose not fear the Lord.

Christans, both men and women should check all our beliefs and understandings with God, and keep an ear open for the still quiet voice of the Holy Spirit. It matters not what we beleve, it only matters what God says. Many wll be turned away on the day of addmisson because they would not hear Gods voice to them.

[nebula]

As for women being CEO's and Directors of Companies, I am saying that there is nothing in Proverbs 31 that indicates they would be an example of a virtuous woman. Biblically speaking, women were created as a help meet to their husbands. That is found right there in Genesis, and the Bible also states that the man was not created for the woman, but the woman for the man. It also says that the head of every woman is the man, the head of man is Christ, and the head of Christ is God. We all have God-given roles, and Satan teaches people to rebel against them.

15 She riseth also while it is yet night, and giveth meat to her household, and a portion to her maidens. 16 She considereth a field, and buyeth it: with the fruit of her hands she planteth a vineyard. 17 She girdeth her loins with strength, and strengtheneth her arms. 18 She perceiveth that her merchandise is good: her candle goeth not out by night. 19 She layeth her hands to the spindle, and her hands hold the distaff. 20 She stretcheth out her hand to the poor; yea, she reacheth forth her hands to the needy. 21 She is not afraid of the snow for her household: for all her household are clothed with scarlet. 22 She maketh herself coverings of tapestry; her clothing is silk and purple. 23 Her husband is known in the gates, when he sitteth among the elders of the land. 24 She maketh fine linen, and selleth it; and delivereth girdles unto the merchant.

Sounds to me like the woman is supposed to be a CEO. Do you not see her as the CEO of the house here?

[~candice~]

Biblically speaking, women were created as a help meet to their husbands. That is found right there in Genesis, and the Bible also states that the man was not created for the woman, but the woman for the man. It also says that the head of every woman is the man, the head of man is Christ, and the head of Christ is God. We all have God-given roles, and Satan teaches people to rebel against them.

yes...but that is not all that scripture has to say about women and men

How do you reconcile this verse: There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3:28

You cannot make a doctrine on one verse and say I don't provide scripture (although no one else has ever made that point because it is simply not true)...the Bible says we are

all one in Christ and does say women should respect their husbands BUT men are to love their wives in a sacrificial way as Christ did for the church

I have never read your thoughts on that...or the fact that we are all one in Christ and not identified by sex or race...

I think you are misusing that verse. Clearly we still have men and women and there are still roles for men and women. The verse doesn't imply that God doesn't see our gender. In context, the verse is about the fact that now (since the mystery has been revealed, and the wall between the Jews and Gentiles torn down) everyone has access to the same grace by faith, the same salvation. There is now no distinction (in terms of accessing that covenant) between Jews and non Jews, or even males and females. It has nothing to do with the abolition of gender roles.

[~candice~]

Butero, what do you think of all the women who work outside of the home because they have to in order to keep their family afloat? I work in the corporate world...

[AmateurPoet03]

Biblically speaking, women were created as a help meet to their husbands. That is found right there in Genesis, and the Bible also states that the man was not created for the woman, but the woman for the man. It also says that the head of every woman is the man, the head of man is Christ, and the head of Christ is God. We all have God-given roles, and Satan teaches people to rebel against them.

yes...but that is not all that scripture has to say about women and men

How do you reconcile this verse: There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3:28

You cannot make a doctrine on one verse and say I don't provide scripture (although no one else has ever made that point because it is simply not true)...the Bible says we are

all one in Christ and does say women should respect their husbands BUT men are to love their wives in a sacrificial way as Christ did for the church

I have never read your thoughts on that...or the fact that we are all one in Christ and not identified by sex or race...

I think you are misusing that verse. Clearly we still have men and women and there are still roles for men and women. The verse doesn't imply that God doesn't see our gender. In context, the verse is about the fact that now (since the mystery has been revealed, and the wall between the Jews and Gentiles torn down) everyone has access to the same grace by faith, the same salvation. There is now no distinction (in terms of accessing that covenant) between Jews and non Jews, or even males and females. It has nothing to do with the abolition of gender roles.

Can someone share the chapter or passage in its entirety? Please...?

[AmateurPoet03]

Butero, what do you think of all the women who work outside of the home because they have to in order to keep their family afloat? I work in the corporate world...

I am having to look for work too. One job is not necessarily enough today to keep a growing family afloat... only going part time though. Hubby remains the primary breadwinner.

[enoob57]

Gal 3

3 O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified? 2 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? 4 Have you suffered so many things in vain — if indeed it was in vain?

5 Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? — 6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness." 7 Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. 8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, "In you all the nations shall be blessed." 9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.

*********************************************************************** The Law Brings a Curse************************************************************************

10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them." 11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for "the just shall live by faith." 12 Yet the law is not of faith, but "the man who does them shall live by them."

13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree"), 14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

********************************************************************The Changeless Promise(cf. Gen 12:1-3)************************************************************

15 Brethren, I speak in the manner of men: Though it is only a man's covenant, yet if it is confirmed, no one annuls or adds to it. 16 Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, "And to seeds," as of many, but as of one, "And to your Seed," who is Christ. 17 And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. 18 For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

**************************************************************************Purpose of the Law********************************************************************************

19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. 22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

***************************************************************************Sons and Heirs************************************************************************************

26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

NKJV

[~candice~]

Biblically speaking, women were created as a help meet to their husbands. That is found right there in Genesis, and the Bible also states that the man was not created for the woman, but the woman for the man. It also says that the head of every woman is the man, the head of man is Christ, and the head of Christ is God. We all have God-given roles, and Satan teaches people to rebel against them.

yes...but that is not all that scripture has to say about women and men

How do you reconcile this verse: There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3:28

You cannot make a doctrine on one verse and say I don't provide scripture (although no one else has ever made that point because it is simply not true)...the Bible says we are

all one in Christ and does say women should respect their husbands BUT men are to love their wives in a sacrificial way as Christ did for the church

I have never read your thoughts on that...or the fact that we are all one in Christ and not identified by sex or race...

I think you are misusing that verse. Clearly we still have men and women and there are still roles for men and women. The verse doesn't imply that God doesn't see our gender. In context, the verse is about the fact that now (since the mystery has been revealed, and the wall between the Jews and Gentiles torn down) everyone has access to the same grace by faith, the same salvation. There is now no distinction (in terms of accessing that covenant) between Jews and non Jews, or even males and females. It has nothing to do with the abolition of gender roles.

Can someone share the chapter or passage in its entirety? Please...?

Children of God

²³ Before the coming of this faith,^[j] we were held in custodyunder the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. ²⁴ So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. ²⁵ Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

²⁶ So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith,²⁷ for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. ²⁸ There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. ²⁹ If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Nothing to do with the cessation of gender roles!