young creation?

[nebula]

Thanks for getting back to me!

It is an interesting way to read the passage, I guess.

What bothers me is that the traditonal Creationist model doesn't acknowledge anything being created before "let there be light."

The passage says, "The earth was formless and void . . . the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters."

Could that mean the earth was there already, and so the '"6 days" were rather a "re-creation" of the earth's surface rather than the initial creation of the globe?

Now, I know the first reaction would be, "How do you account for the sun and moon being created on day 4?"

Well, the only explanation I have heard is that if up to that point the Earth's atmosphere was filled with smoke or other gases that blocked the light of the Sun and Moon, then on day 4 they first "appeared."

Now, I know this isn't a perfect model either - I mean, I know the protests agains that interpretation either.

My questioning of the traditional Creationist model comes from the fact that apart from "separating land from water" there really is no mention of the creation of the land, nor the creation of the land features (ie. mountains and canyons).

The traditional Creationist model seems to ignore: "The earth was formless and void . . . the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters."

Finally, Gen. 1 simply does not read as a scientific account. It is meant to teach, yes, but I do not believe it was meant as a physical science instruction. I believe it was meant as a theological instruction.

I mean, what is more important to the Lord - that we know the Earth, or that we know Him? Was it important to the Lord to reveal to His people the history of the Earth, or the history of His relationship with man?

I read an interpretation of Gen. 1 as a theological writing, where things like "water" were symbolic of "the peoples" and the passage took on a whole new depth of meaning.

Just my thoughts.

[Lekcit]

Nebula,

You asked the following:

What bothers me is that the traditonal Creationist model doesn't acknowledge anything being created before "let there be light."

Well, whatever happened to Genesis 1:1? There it says, "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth..."

I'm not sure how you take that, but to me it looks as if the heavens and the earth were created before let there be light.

In Him.

[nebula]

I know . . . but I don't hear that acknowledged very much.

"The Earth was created in 6 days."

Bit Gen. 1:1 says the Earth was created before the 6 days . . . right?

So, then, the Bible really does not say how long it took for the Lord to create the Earth nor how He did it, correct?

[nebula]

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. 3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

The Word "And" is a conjunction. Which connects related thoughts in written language. We see that everything which happpened in the first 5 verses happened on day one, which was a literal 24 hour day, because it had an evening and a morning, just like a normal day does...

The problem is, these "And"s are translation specific.

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NASB -

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters.

3 Then God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light.

------------------------

The Complete Jewish Bible -

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was unformed and void, darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God hovered over the surface of the water.

3 Then God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light.

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Hebrew Names Version of World English Bible

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the eretz. 2 Now the eretz was formless and empty. Darkness was on the surface of the deep. God's Spirit was hovering over the surface of the waters.

3 God said, "Let there be light," and there was light.

*************************************************

For what it's worth, I don't question the Bible, just how we in our 20th century Westernized mindsets have interpretated this ancient mid-Eastern mindset passage of Scripture.

[Old Timer]

Nebula, does this help:

Exo 31:17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

[Bread_of_Life]

Yeah, like an all powerful God, impossible to improve upon can be refreshed. Hmm, nothing allegorical about that passage then.

Guys, I don't get it, why try to convince someone that they can't believe in the bible and an old earth, it seems like you're trying to drive people away from the bible?

[Old Timer]

SA, The only thing allegorical about Exo. 31:17 is that the seven-day week was established as a model for us to rest and be

[Bread_of_Life]

Old Timer,

Well, at least you realise that an all powerful deity cannot be refreshed, so the verse must be, at least in some way, allegorical.

My point is, and I should have put it more clearly, if a part of the bible is absolutely clear that the earth is 6000 years old, and was created in 6 days, along with all life in it - then that part of the bible must be wrong. We know this a priori from the wealth of data we have on this subject, from many independent disciplines.

Therefore, a Christian is faced with the choice of rejecting this part of the bible, rejecting the whole thing, or rejective rationality and evidence. My point therefore is that in your insistance that an old earth/old life is inconsistant with the bible, you are putting Christians in a very difficult situation epistemologically, and in their belief in the bible.

[JLW001]

Don't think of Genesis 1:1 as a step in creation. It is a topic sentence to the paragraph. The Bible is developed in Chapter and verse for easy reference. But the Bible is made up of books that have paragraphs, topic sentences, sentences, nouns, verbs, etc.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. And this is how he did it...

[Old Timer]

SA,