For those that believe in the Big Bang, what was there before?

[MarkNigro]

 

 

Joe thats lovely. You have an intersting past! Im sorry my words are so brief as im on my phone. I agree with you about scientism but still baffled as to why the bang cant be His voice . At the end of the day, He gets the ultimate credit.

God spoke the universe and all things into existence.

 

But the Holy Bible is quite clear that God created all things in 6 days, about 6000 years ago..

 

The Big Bang theory has the universe created about 12 billion years ago with the earth forming about 4.5 billion years ago.

 

So God did not use the Big Bang. He just spoke things into existence as recorded in Genesis 1

 

 

The big bang is about the first part of the first second. The big bang isn't about dating the universe of how the remainder of creation worked out.

 

If God speaking the universe into existence is the Big Bang, then it happened about 6,000 years ago

[Guest]

The big bang is about the first part of the first second. The big bang isn't about dating the universe of how the remainder of creation worked out.

 

~

 

It's Not About A Date But About The Heavens And The Earth

 

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis 1:1

 

For The Sun, Moon And Stars Came Out On Day Four

 

And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good. And the evening and the morning were the fourth day. Genesis 1:17-19

 

After The Big Stretch (Day Two)

 

And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.  And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. Genesis 1:7-8

 

 

And After Veggies, Grains, Apples, Seeds And Stuff (Day Three)

 

And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And the evening and the morning were the third day. Genesis 1:11-13

 

And I Have Never Ever Even On It's Best Day

Heard The Big Bang Affirming

God's Creation

As Truth

 

Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever. Psalms 119:160

 

You See

 

~

 

Be Blessed Beloved Daughter Of The KING

 

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:

The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:

The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

 

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them. Numbers 6:24-27

 

Be Very Blessed

 

The LORD thy God in the midst of thee is mighty; he will save, he will rejoice over thee with joy; he will rest in his love, he will joy over thee with singing. Zephaniah 3:17

 

Love, Your Brother Joe

[TsukinoRei]

The Big Bang is not really a compete answer. How about some details?

 

Was there absolutely nothing before?

 

If not what was there before?

 

Did inflation occur after the Big Bang or not?

 

What caused inflation to start and stop?

 

If it was a particle, what was the particle and has it been found?

 

As I understand it God is omnipresent and omniscient and omnipotent.  He is vast and eternal and full of mysteries.  He is to be held in awe.  So I suspect there's little chance that any mortal knows and understands everything there is to know and understand about Him.  So if I were to ask you a question about God that you could not answer, do you suppose that would disprove the existence of God?  I think that it would not.  Neither can the Big Bang theory be disproved that way.  What difference should it make to Faith in Jesus Christ, whether God said 'let there be light' (queue gentle ambience), or God said 'let their be LIGHT!!' (BANG)?  I don't think anyone here is quite old enough to have personally witnessed creation.

[MarkNigro]

 

The Big Bang is not really a compete answer. How about some details?

 

Was there absolutely nothing before?

 

If not what was there before?

 

Did inflation occur after the Big Bang or not?

 

What caused inflation to start and stop?

 

If it was a particle, what was the particle and has it been found?

 

As I understand it God is omnipresent and omniscient and omnipotent.  He is vast and eternal and full of mysteries.  He is to be held in awe.  So I suspect there's little chance that any mortal knows and understands everything there is to know and understand about Him.  So if I were to ask you a question about God that you could not answer, do you suppose that would disprove the existence of God?  I think that it would not.  Neither can the Big Bang theory be disproved that way.  What difference should it make to Faith in Jesus Christ, whether God said 'let there be light' (queue gentle ambience), or God said 'let their be LIGHT!!' (BANG)?  I don't think anyone here is quite old enough to have personally witnessed creation.

 

 

Could I answer all questions about God? Probably not. But I could answer very many questions about God.

 

The Holy Bible reveals who God is and what God is like. 

 

There is a difference in whether the universe is 15 billion years old or 6000 years old. The Holy Bible clearly says 6 day creation about 6,000 years ago.

 

Since the teaching of atheistic origin science is pubic schools there has been a great falling away in the percentage of people who actually believe the gospel of Jesus Christ and are saved.

[TsukinoRei]

 

 

The Big Bang is not really a compete answer. How about some details?

 

Was there absolutely nothing before?

 

If not what was there before?

 

Did inflation occur after the Big Bang or not?

 

What caused inflation to start and stop?

 

If it was a particle, what was the particle and has it been found?

 

As I understand it God is omnipresent and omniscient and omnipotent.  He is vast and eternal and full of mysteries.  He is to be held in awe.  So I suspect there's little chance that any mortal knows and understands everything there is to know and understand about Him.  So if I were to ask you a question about God that you could not answer, do you suppose that would disprove the existence of God?  I think that it would not.  Neither can the Big Bang theory be disproved that way.  What difference should it make to Faith in Jesus Christ, whether God said 'let there be light' (queue gentle ambience), or God said 'let their be LIGHT!!' (BANG)?  I don't think anyone here is quite old enough to have personally witnessed creation.

 

 

Could I answer all questions about God? Probably not. But I could answer very many questions about God.

 

The Holy Bible reveals who God is and what God is like. 

 

There is a difference in whether the universe is 15 billion years old or 6000 years old. The Holy Bible clearly says 6 day creation about 6,000 years ago.

 

Since the teaching of atheistic origin science is pubic schools there has been a great falling away in the percentage of people who actually believe the gospel of Jesus Christ and are saved.

 

 

So you can't answer all the questions about God, yet that doesn't disprove his existence.  It follows that not being able to answer all the questions about the Big Bang does not disprove the Big Bang.  

[MarkNigro]

 

 

 

The Big Bang is not really a compete answer. How about some details?

 

Was there absolutely nothing before?

 

If not what was there before?

 

Did inflation occur after the Big Bang or not?

 

What caused inflation to start and stop?

 

If it was a particle, what was the particle and has it been found?

 

As I understand it God is omnipresent and omniscient and omnipotent.  He is vast and eternal and full of mysteries.  He is to be held in awe.  So I suspect there's little chance that any mortal knows and understands everything there is to know and understand about Him.  So if I were to ask you a question about God that you could not answer, do you suppose that would disprove the existence of God?  I think that it would not.  Neither can the Big Bang theory be disproved that way.  What difference should it make to Faith in Jesus Christ, whether God said 'let there be light' (queue gentle ambience), or God said 'let their be LIGHT!!' (BANG)?  I don't think anyone here is quite old enough to have personally witnessed creation.

 

 

Could I answer all questions about God? Probably not. But I could answer very many questions about God.

 

The Holy Bible reveals who God is and what God is like. 

 

There is a difference in whether the universe is 15 billion years old or 6000 years old. The Holy Bible clearly says 6 day creation about 6,000 years ago.

 

Since the teaching of atheistic origin science is pubic schools there has been a great falling away in the percentage of people who actually believe the gospel of Jesus Christ and are saved.

 

 

So you can't answer all the questions about God, yet that doesn't disprove his existence.  It follows that not being able to answer all the questions about the Big Bang does not disprove the Big Bang.  

 

That is a very silly comparison.

 

I have listed a number of questions for atheistic origin science to answer. These are fundamental questions, not silly questions, like can God make Himself not God.

 

But if as you imply that the 2 are the same, remove the theory of evolution from atoms to mankind and long ages from all public schools and all public places as it violates the establish clause of the US constitution.

 

DEBATE RULE 101 - When the facts and truth are against you try anything else.

[JDavis]

The Big Bang is not really a compete answer. How about some details?

Was there absolutely nothing before?

If not what was there before?

Did inflation occur after the Big Bang or not?

What caused inflation to start and stop?

If it was a particle, what was the particle and has it been found?

As I understand it God is omnipresent and omniscient and omnipotent. He is vast and eternal and full of mysteries. He is to be held in awe. So I suspect there's little chance that any mortal knows and understands everything there is to know and understand about Him. So if I were to ask you a question about God that you could not answer, do you suppose that would disprove the existence of God? I think that it would not. Neither can the Big Bang theory be disproved that way. What difference should it make to Faith in Jesus Christ, whether God said 'let there be light' (queue gentle ambience), or God said 'let their be LIGHT!!' (BANG)? I don't think anyone here is quite old enough to have personally witnessed creation.

Could I answer all questions about God? Probably not. But I could answer very many questions about God.

The Holy Bible reveals who God is and what God is like.

There is a difference in whether the universe is 15 billion years old or 6000 years old. The Holy Bible clearly says 6 day creation about 6,000 years ago.

Since the teaching of atheistic origin science is pubic schools there has been a great falling away in the percentage of people who actually believe the gospel of Jesus Christ and are saved.

So you can't answer all the questions about God, yet that doesn't disprove his existence. It follows that not being able to answer all the questions about the Big Bang does not disprove the Big Bang.

That is a very silly comparison.

I have listed a number of questions for atheistic origin science to answer. These are fundamental questions, not silly questions, like can God make Himself not God.

But if as you imply that the 2 are the same, remove the theory of evolution from atoms to mankind and long ages from all public schools and all public places as it violates the establish clause of the US constitution.

DEBATE RULE 101 - When the facts and truth are against you try anything else.

I have to admit, you have rule 101 down to a science.

[TsukinoRei]

 

 

 

 

 

The Big Bang is not really a compete answer. How about some details?

Was there absolutely nothing before?

If not what was there before?

Did inflation occur after the Big Bang or not?

What caused inflation to start and stop?

If it was a particle, what was the particle and has it been found?

As I understand it God is omnipresent and omniscient and omnipotent. He is vast and eternal and full of mysteries. He is to be held in awe. So I suspect there's little chance that any mortal knows and understands everything there is to know and understand about Him. So if I were to ask you a question about God that you could not answer, do you suppose that would disprove the existence of God? I think that it would not. Neither can the Big Bang theory be disproved that way. What difference should it make to Faith in Jesus Christ, whether God said 'let there be light' (queue gentle ambience), or God said 'let their be LIGHT!!' (BANG)? I don't think anyone here is quite old enough to have personally witnessed creation.

Could I answer all questions about God? Probably not. But I could answer very many questions about God.

The Holy Bible reveals who God is and what God is like.

There is a difference in whether the universe is 15 billion years old or 6000 years old. The Holy Bible clearly says 6 day creation about 6,000 years ago.

Since the teaching of atheistic origin science is pubic schools there has been a great falling away in the percentage of people who actually believe the gospel of Jesus Christ and are saved.

So you can't answer all the questions about God, yet that doesn't disprove his existence. It follows that not being able to answer all the questions about the Big Bang does not disprove the Big Bang.

That is a very silly comparison.

I have listed a number of questions for atheistic origin science to answer. These are fundamental questions, not silly questions, like can God make Himself not God.

But if as you imply that the 2 are the same, remove the theory of evolution from atoms to mankind and long ages from all public schools and all public places as it violates the establish clause of the US constitution.

DEBATE RULE 101 - When the facts and truth are against you try anything else.

I have to admit, you have rule 101 down to a science.

 

 Mark, Did you make up your own debate rules as well?  The thing that I am trying is called logic.  Logic is used to find errors in reasoning, it identifies misuse of facts.  The misuse of facts using faulty logic may or may not accidentally lead to a true conclusion, but that conclusion is not correctly drawn from those facts.

Edited August 13, 2013 by TsukinoRei

[TsukinoRei]

Gerald actually has a point; time is a property of space - without "space" there is no "time", at least as we understand it. Prior to the universe there was no "space" therefore there was no "time". My understanding is that this isn't something Hawking made up, but a direct consequence of applying Einstein's Relativity (space-time) to the big bang. 

 

Although, if there is a multiverse or whatnot, I'm not sure what that would do. If there was another universe that existed prior to our universe existing, I would think that would be considered "before", but I don't know enough to say. And of course if there is a metaphysical plane where God resides outside space-time that would throw a wrench in the idea too I imagine. But as long as we are talking solely within our universe, there was no time or space before the big bang if we take the big bang to mean the beginning of the universe. 

 

As I understand it none of the universes existed prior to the Big Bang, they are all interconnected and branch from one another, and possibly even depend on one another for stability if, as is currently thought, their are particles that operate accross multiple universes.  I have an inkling that quantum entanglement might shed light here too, but I digress.  If time and space both came into existence at that point then dimensions would not have existed either.  This is a super neat blog that may interest you; http://cosmos-staruniverse.blogspot.ca/2011/06/parallel-universes-and-before-big-bang_13.html

Edited August 13, 2013 by TsukinoRei

[MarkNigro]

 

Gerald actually has a point; time is a property of space - without "space" there is no "time", at least as we understand it. Prior to the universe there was no "space" therefore there was no "time". My understanding is that this isn't something Hawking made up, but a direct consequence of applying Einstein's Relativity (space-time) to the big bang. 

 

Although, if there is a multiverse or whatnot, I'm not sure what that would do. If there was another universe that existed prior to our universe existing, I would think that would be considered "before", but I don't know enough to say. And of course if there is a metaphysical plane where God resides outside space-time that would throw a wrench in the idea too I imagine. But as long as we are talking solely within our universe, there was no time or space before the big bang if we take the big bang to mean the beginning of the universe. 

 

As I understand it none of the universes existed prior to the Big Bang, they are all interconnected and branch from one another, and possibly even depend on one another for stability if, as is currently thought, their are particles that operate accross multiple universes.  I have an inkling that quantum entanglement might shed light here too, but I digress.  If time and space both came into existence at that point then dimensions would not have existed either.  This is a super neat blog that may interest you; http://cosmos-staruniverse.blogspot.ca/2011/06/parallel-universes-and-before-big-bang_13.html

 

Now here is the problem. If the universe came into being from nothing then that violates cause and effect, common sense, and some conservation laws.

 

But if it came from something before, then the origin of the universe is not really answered by pushed back in time to something else.

 

So this fundamental conundrum still remains, because we can always ask and where did that come from.

 

For atheistic origin science this is a disaster.

 

For theistic origin science it is not a disaster. For example, God created the universe is the origin of the universe. Now one can always ask where did God come from. But at least those that hold this belief they honestly admit that God always existed. 

 

So in the end there is always at root a fundamentally religious belief (atheism is a religious belief too) and the discussion must move to that realm.