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Posted

It's in seasons of suffering that we are built and strengthened.  It's what sharpens us and makes us stronger, deeper, and wiser as believers.  Historically, the church grew during times of persecution.

 

Consder this:  The great hymns of our faith were not written by theological giants living in ivory towers.  They were written by common people and many of them were written out of their pain and definitely during times of suffering.   "It Is Well" comes to mind.   "What a Friend We have in Jesus" is another one that was written out of a suffering heart.   The great hymn, "Just As I Am" made famous by the Billy Graham Crusades was written by a young lady racked with a painful disabilty.   The most prolific hymn writer in the world, Fannie Crosby was blinded as an infant by a quack doctor, but she memorized the entire NT and wrote more hymns than anyone. 

Re: Personal level - On a personal level I would agree. I would say that my relationship with Christ has grown the most when I have faced challenges. Those instances reminds me of my need for God more acutely.

 

In re-reading the Psalms it's amazing how many times David and others presented their sufferings before God.

 

Re: Church persecution - Yes, it is during persecution that the Church has grown the most. Take what is going on in China and other closed countries to the Gospel for example. God's name will be known among the nations! :thumbsup:

 

Re: Music - yes some of the greatest hymms of our faith were indeed written in times of sorrow. Take "" pinned by Horatio Spafford. Spafford lost his livelyhood with the Great Chicago Fire in 1871. He was a laywer in Chicago and had a lot of property that basically became worth pennies over night. He sent his family ahead to Europe as he was dealing with zoning problems in Chicago. His four daughters died as their ship collided with another sea vessell in the Atlantic. His wife was Anna, the only of his family to survive the ship wreck, sent him the now famous telegram, "Saved alone …".


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Posted

1. I suppose I'd add that it's a side effect of sin in the world also.

 

2. I believe God can use suffering to break us and mold us into His vision. We are repeatedly told to be humble (mat 5:5 “Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.") and perhaps this is one way to bring us low. Perhaps when we are suffering, and God helps us through that, we are a witness to others, as Stephen was when he was stoned to death.

 

3. I think we are supposed to comfort and provide for each other, so perhaps it is when someone is suffering it's an opportunity for us to imitate Christ in the sense of helping each other with relief.

 

As far as which reason resonates with me the most, that is hard to say. Before, I thought suffering happened because of indifferent circumstances. The universe doesn't care who suffers or not, it just happens. Facing challenges as a Christian I think the first thing I've come to appreciate is that God cares and it's not random. It makes it a lot easier for me to bear anyway. i won't always see the reasons that go into allowing for this or that to occur, but I can trust God has the sufficient reasons and there is a greater purpose in things. That has mattered more to me, on retrospect, than I realized.


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Posted

 

 Take "" pinned by Horatio Spafford.

 

 

 

Imagine writting this after hearing your 4 daughters had died... What an example to us!

 

Lyrics:

 

When peace, like a river, attendeth my way,

When sorrows like sea billows roll;

Whatever my lot, You have taught me to say,

It is well, it is well, with my soul.

It is well, with my soul,

It is well, it is well, with my soul.

Though Satan should buffet, though trials should come,

Let this blessed assurance control,

That Christ has regarded my helpless estate,

And hath shed His own blood for my soul.

It is well, with my soul,

It is well, it is well, with my soul.

My sin, oh, the bliss of this glorious thought!

My sin, not in part but the whole,

Is nailed to the cross, and I bear it no more,

Praise the Lord, praise the Lord, O my soul!

It is well, with my soul,

It is well, it is well, with my soul.

It is well, it is well, with my soul.

And Lord, haste the day when my faith shall be sight,

The clouds be rolled back as a scroll;

The trump shall resound, and the Lord shall descend,

Even so, it is well with my soul.

It is well, with my soul,

It is well, it is well, with my soul.

It is well, it is well, with my soul.


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Posted

Other reasons why God allows suffering?

 

-Maybe darkened in their understanding, with the heart.

 

-Maybe to bring us security, that He is always there for us.

 

-Maybe to break down the wall of sin  - living with unforgiveness, envy, jealousy, bitterness.

 

What role does God play in suffering?

 

He suffers with us. To fix our eyes on Him. God's ways are not our ways. His thoughts aren't our thoughts. He is an artist. He will make this mess beautiful.

 

 

....I have had my own suffering, I'm there in my own life now, stuck in the moment, pain on every side. Just so grateful for His grace and mercy to see me through my storms of life. I will say He has pulled me through and empowered me with His strength to press forward just recently with a job promotion at work, I didnt deserve it, but somehow He found favor with me and for that I see His work in my life more and more. Where we see stress. God sees opportunities for us grow.

 

I'm not sure about the heart but yes if you're saying through suffering God allows people to see their need for Him I agree. I agree God is always there for us. Perhpas indeed God allows suffering to call more people to him and break down the walls of sin :thumbsup:

 

God indeed is the ultimate artist: See

I'm sorry for your suffering sister. How can we pray for you?

Currently my sister is going through a divorce. This is very hard for her and our family. We've also had a very bad pest problem we've been dealing with... So I don't know what you're going through but I sympathize. And our High Priest does too!

Hebrews 4:15

15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin.

I like that: "Where we see stress God sees opportunities for us to grow."

 


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Posted

desi, i'm not understanding what you mean.....a natural drift??

could you please explain this to me sister?

GBU

what i meant by a natural drift is sometimes we tend to drift alittle off the path instead of staying steady, moving forward every day, an endurance, with God.


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Posted

 

Other reasons why God allows suffering?

 

-Maybe darkened in their understanding, with the heart.

 

-Maybe to bring us security, that He is always there for us.

 

-Maybe to break down the wall of sin  - living with unforgiveness, envy, jealousy, bitterness.

 

What role does God play in suffering?

 

He suffers with us. To fix our eyes on Him. God's ways are not our ways. His thoughts aren't our thoughts. He is an artist. He will make this mess beautiful.

 

 

....I have had my own suffering, I'm there in my own life now, stuck in the moment, pain on every side. Just so grateful for His grace and mercy to see me through my storms of life. I will say He has pulled me through and empowered me with His strength to press forward just recently with a job promotion at work, I didnt deserve it, but somehow He found favor with me and for that I see His work in my life more and more. Where we see stress. God sees opportunities for us grow.

 

I'm not sure about the heart but yes if you're saying through suffering God allows people to see their need for Him I agree. I agree God is always there for us. Perhpas indeed God allows suffering to call more people to him and break down the walls of sin  :thumbsup:

 

God indeed is the ultimate artist: See

I'm sorry for your suffering sister. How can we pray for you?

Currently my sister is going through a divorce. This is very hard for her and our family. We've also had a very bad pest problem we've been dealing with... So I don't know what you're going through but I sympathize. And our High Priest does too!

Hebrews 4:15

15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin.

I like that: "Where we see stress God sees opportunities for us to grow."

 

 

praying for you GE. and thank you for this post, its a very good one, it helps me to be more attentive to God and that I'm not alone. I have been struggling with decisions that my  23 yr old daughter has been making, ungodly decisions with her marriage, she is very disrespectful to me with all of it, and I take care of my 18 month old grandson most nights and weekends, I just need God's strength for me to be there for my grandson, he needs me, feels like i'm being a mom instead of a grandma here and it can be a bit much at times and with starting Ovetime at work soon its going to get even harder. Trusting in the Lord here. :)


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Posted

Desi,Dear sister,

 Do you mean that in your opinion, I have strayed a little off the path??

I'm sorry for what you're going thru Dear Sister and I will be praying for you!!

GBU


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Posted (edited)

GE,

 I'm gonna throw my hat in this perverbial ring...

AS A parent ,I understand the basics, There have been times in my childrens lives,no matter how much it pained me to do so,it was better for me to let them get that perverbial skinned knee,then for me to save them from it.....they learned more from the skinned knee.

 

Did I cause the skinned knee???, NO!

 

This is how I see this subject....GOD Doesn't "Cause" the skinned knee....

BUT In HIS Goodness,LOVE,MERCY for HIS Children,HE will Turn that skinned knee into something Beautiful!!

 

WE live in a fallen world,GOD gave us all Free Will, HE want's children,NOT Robot's

I think we all at one time or another go thru our own "Season in hell"...to coin a phrase.

From FEBURARY 2008 to about NOW...I've spent my own season in hell as it were....

I lost both of my parent's,was attacked by my only sister and one of my brothers because of our mother's penchant for pitting her children against each other,i've done all that i can to repair the damage that i can...

2 surgeries, the shingles, followed by another surgery...painful recoveries...nerve damage left by 1 of the surgeries.....

 

NOW did GOD cause these to teach me a lesson??

OF COURSE NOT!

as a  father would you intentionally hurt or make you're child sick..OF COURSE NOT!

 

People seem to get the notion in their heads that GOD causes their suffering...NOT TRUE!

The Promise was and still is that HE WOULD WALK WITH ME ALL THE DAY"S OF MY LIFE...HE never once promised me a bed of rose's,why should HE?? HIS certainly wasn't !!

has HE kept HIS promise..YES!!

He's held me when the pain was so bad all i could do was cry....HE gave me understanding for what was happening,YES HE WILL IF YOU ASK......

HE can use me just as I am.....I don't need to be whole to reach out to hurting people,all i need is an open heart.. the last thing a hurting person needs is to be told "Well honey,GOD sent this to you for a reason"..SAY WHAT??!!

tho well meaning, this doesn't help a hurting soul at all..

some folk's seem to think that i'm too fre and open about my personal life.. i say why not??

if something in my life can be used to reach out and help a hurting soul, then i'm gonna give it all that i got...which is why i'm being so long winded in this thread...

 some will say ..ahh but scripture says.....yes it does,but it must be put in an understandable format, as it applies to this or that person's need....i know for a fact,that when well meaning brother's,sisters threw scripture at me..it did more wounding then healing....

GOD has turned my ashes to joy..do i still have one of those day's sure...and i will as long as i'm on this Earth.BUT I know where to run when i fall down....

GBU All

 

 

I agree with your post. I like the illustration of the skinned knee. Yes God can turn something ugly into something beuatiful.  :thumbsup:

 

What difficult circumstances in your life has God allowed you to in turn reach out and help a hurting soul?

 

Sometimes people need less Scripture at least at first when they're hurting and need more compassion. I'd agree with you there too. :thumbsup:

 

Ultimately whatever God does is for His glory and our good. ;)

 

Phillipians 2:9-11

Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

 

Romans 8:28

And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him who have been called according to his purpose.

 

Thanks for your heart and thoughts sister!

God bless,

GE

Edited by GoldenEagle

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Posted

 

praying for you GE. and thank you for this post, its a very good one, it helps me to be more attentive to God and that I'm not alone. I have been struggling with decisions that my  23 yr old daughter has been making, ungodly decisions with her marriage, she is very disrespectful to me with all of it, and I take care of my 18 month old grandson most nights and weekends, I just need God's strength for me to be there for my grandson, he needs me, feels like i'm being a mom instead of a grandma here and it can be a bit much at times and with starting Ovetime at work soon its going to get even harder. Trusting in the Lord here. :)

 

 

 

 

Thanks for your prayers sister. I will be praying for you, your daughter, and your grandbaby. Praying for God's wisdom, grace, mercy, rest, and strength for you. :thumbsup:

 

Philippians 4:6-7

Do not be anxious about anything, but in every situation, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.

 

Matthew 11:28 

Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.

 

Isaiah 40:31 

But those who hope in the LORD will renew their strength.  They will soar on wings like eagles; they will run and not grow weary, they will walk and not be faint.

 

 

You are indeed not alone. That is a lie of our enemies. Greater is Jesus in you than the prince of this world. :)

1 John 4:4

You are of God, little children, and have overcome them, because He who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.

 

God bless you!

 

In Christ,

GE


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Posted

GE,

My Brother,Thank You for your very kind reply.

 

What difficult circumstances in your life has God allowed you to in turn reach out and help a hurting soul?

 

You asked me this question,here's one example...

My Mother was a very abusive Woman,both mentally and physically.....

I'm the oldest of 5 kid's....She abused us all.....

At times i encounter someone who say's,"Why don't you hate her?"  and if GODS so loving and kind,then where was HE when you were being abused?"

My answer's to these question's are simply this...

1)yes i could hate her,and would have every right to do so,BUT if she had really understood what she was doing,then she would have never done this in the first place..theres a big difference between knowing and understanding.

2) Where was MY GOD??, right there by my side....HE gave us all free will,HE want's children,not robot's..my mother unfortunately used her free will the wrong way....HE DID SAVE ME..HE kept my heart,my soul and my mind safe, I survived and I'm here to tell you about it...Did I hurt,Did I cry,Did i bear her rage on my body,yes i did,BUT,I knew all along that she didn't understand what she was doing,what she was cheating herself out of,that nobody on this planet could bring more harm to her then she did to herself...

Their next question's usually run in one of two direction's, it's either "She must have been abused as a child??..No she wasn't abused as a child..She was a spoiled brat,..then we continue this particular conversation.....is it mean of me to say that?? no, it's the truth,,my mother was a spoiled brat....(have you ever watched "Little house on the prairie" Have you ever seen "Young Nellie Olson?/" that's my mother in a nut shell..LOL

Or the conversation Comes in this form,"I'm an abuser,because I was abused"...

Really??,I'm sorry that you were abused,truely I am....BUT,It's time for you to own this and stop using this as an excuse for your action's....you don't like yourself very much do you??, there's a way for you to get out of this mess,and here's how....

GE, I hope this answer's your question?

GBU Brother

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