Israel (Jews) and Our Views

[GoldenEagle]

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words as they say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

The two in the middle in blue "Remnant Jew" and "Ethnic Jew" are part of Israel.
 

The two to the left in green ("Grafted-in Gentile" and "Remnant Jew") are the Church.

 

The two to the right in orange ("Ethnic Jew" and "Gentile") are not part of the Church or the Lost.

 

Does this explain your position Shiloh?

God bless,

GE
 

[Salty]

 

 

 

I believe God's word and Israel is defined as the seed of Jacob and the nation of those people. That's God word. So i suggest that you take your own advice and stop thinking otherwise than God's word. You accuse others of which you do yourself. You're teaching false things. Your views are no different to those who believe in replacement theology, and look at what that caused.

 

 

Then is the seed of Israel excluded... from God's Salvation Promise by Faith first given to Abraham? You don't see how you contradict yourself and God's Word.

 

Even the seed of Israel MUST believe that Promise by Faith which is The Gospel of Jesus Christ, in order to be saved. Now if you want to go against Apostle Paul on that per Romans 11 and Galatians, then you go directly against the foundational NT Books of Christian Doctrine.

 

 

I'm not contradicting God's word you are. Don't patronise me. I understand scripture better than you do. You obviously haven't read Romans 11 but you have such a sense of superiority that you think that you're the only person who can interpret it. Such pride, eh? Yet you have interpreted it wrong. For the last time Israel refers to Jacob's seed. and NOT to Gentiles. To say otherwise is to contradict scripture which you seem to do quite a lot. But you accuse others of doing so.

 

 

When you're done ranting, can you answer my simple question above?

[Guest shiloh357]

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words as they say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

The two in the middle in blue "Remnant Jew" and "Ethnic Jew" are part of Israel.

The two to the left in green ("Grafted-in Gentile" and "Remnant Jew") are the Church.

 

The two to the right in orange ("Ethnic Jew" and "Gentile") are not part of the Church or the Lost.

 

Does this explain your position Shiloh?

God bless,

GE

 

Yes, I believe so.

[GoldenEagle]

 

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words as they say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

The two in the middle in blue "Remnant Jew" and "Ethnic Jew" are part of Israel.

The two to the left in green ("Grafted-in Gentile" and "Remnant Jew") are the Church.

 

The two to the right in orange ("Ethnic Jew" and "Gentile") are not part of the Church or the Lost.

 

Does this explain your position Shiloh?

God bless,

GE

 

Yes, I believe so.

 

I wonder if others such as Salty, Openly Curious, Butero,  OakWood, Macs Son, JohnDB, Reformed Baptist, 19Duggarfan, gray wolf, Qnts2 etc. would agree with this?

[Salty]

The confusion I have is that you seem to think there are two peoples of God in the earth or at least it sounds like it to me I'm not clear on it.

Also it seems as you think the Jews or the nation of Israel are the only children of God in the earth right now. Because the church want exist until the end times. Yes I'm not clear on your views thus yet but I'm trying bear with me.

 

That is exactly what the Jews think, whether believing or unbelieving, like shiloh357 said, "Israel is Israel; the Church is the Church." But that's not correct per God's Word.

 

Not only do deceived Jews believe that, but so do Christian Dispensationalists.

 

Those of us who know how to read, well know that Christ's Church is built upon Christ as its Chief Cornerstone, and His Apostles and the OT prophets as its foundation.

 

Ephesians 2

¹⁹ Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

²⁰ And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

²¹ In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:

²² In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

 

So were those Apostles and prophets not children of the 'seed' of Israel? even Christ Jesus born of the tribe of Judah?

 

Since when then are those NOT... part of The Church that we believing Gentiles also are members of?!?

 

How many of the 'seed' of Israel are members of Christ's Church today? so did those seed born Israelites who became part of Christ's Church by Faith lose the Promises of God?!?

 

Do unbelieving Jews still manifest God's Promises? what were those Promises? One of those Promises to Israel from God is that there would never fail a man of Israel to sit upon the throne of David, unto all generations (2 Sam.7).

 

Well, Zechariah, king of Judah, was the last one born of the seed of Israel to sit upon David's throne in Jerusalem, and that was all the way back in Jeremiah's days when Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon ended that throne in Jerusalem. It still has yet to be up there again since. So where's God's Promise to Israel with that one today???

 

I can go on and on about His Promises that have been lacking fulfillment among the unbelieving Jews and the holy land since the Romans destroyed Jerusalem and the temple in 70 A.D.

 

So it actually looks like the unbelieving Jews have had a major falling out with our Heavenly Father, and we know why that is, because of their rejection of His Son Jesus of Nazareth as The Messiah. Yet some of God's Promises are still with the unbelieving Jews today, especially the one that He said He would always leave 'one tribe' in Jerusalem for His servant David's sake, and for Jerusalem's sake (1 Kings 11). His Promise that He would gather them still exists, and His Promise to remove His blindness He put upon them when the times of the Gentiles is fulfilled, still exists. But then they still must... choose to believe on Jesus Christ in order to be part of His Eternal Kingdom of the world to come.

 

Thus no one can be saved without becoming a member of Christ's Church by Faith on God's Promised Saviour Jesus Christ. That applies to the seed of Israel too.

[Salty]

 

 

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words as they say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

The two in the middle in blue "Remnant Jew" and "Ethnic Jew" are part of Israel.

The two to the left in green ("Grafted-in Gentile" and "Remnant Jew") are the Church.

 

The two to the right in orange ("Ethnic Jew" and "Gentile") are not part of the Church or the Lost.

 

Does this explain your position Shiloh?

God bless,

GE

 

Yes, I believe so.

 

I wonder if others such as Salty, Openly Curious, Butero,  OakWood, Macs Son, JohnDB, Reformed Baptist, 19Duggarfan, gray wolf, Qnts2 etc. would agree with this?

 

 

I definitely agree with the fact that God chose the 'seed' of Israel for His commission in The Gospel of Jesus Christ from the start of the 'Seed of the Woman' in Genesis, and the believing remnant of the seed of Israel helped fulfill it, and still are fulfilling it today as original called out ones that became the early foundation of Christ's CHURCH, His Apostles and prophets of Eph.2.

 

The ones in Green are in Christ's Salvation and are His Church, and all represent 'God's Israel' as 'one' body. The unbelieving Israelites inside the orange also represent the seed of Israel, but not Israel in The Promise like was handed down from Abraham all the way down to Joseph's sons Ephraim and Manasseh, and that because of their 'unbelief'.

 

I also avow that God's Promises REMAINED with the believing remnant of the seed of Israel, and those Promises are just alive today within Christ's Church as 'one' Body as they ever were, while many (but not all) of those Promises have been removed from unbelieving Jews and the holy land today because of the rejection of Jesus of Nazareth as The Christ. When the unbelieving seed of Israel convert to Christ Jesus they become part of His Body The Church, and are back in the Promises again by that association. Christ's Church is neither wholly Gentillic nor wholly Israelite, but made up of both together, as One Body.

 

If this is not true, then it would mean there is another Way of Salvation instead of by Faith on The Father through His Son Jesus Christ. God's Word testifies only One Way, and that is through the Blood of Jesus Christ.

[Qnts2]

 

 

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words as they say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

The two in the middle in blue "Remnant Jew" and "Ethnic Jew" are part of Israel.

The two to the left in green ("Grafted-in Gentile" and "Remnant Jew") are the Church.

 

The two to the right in orange ("Ethnic Jew" and "Gentile") are not part of the Church or the Lost.

 

Does this explain your position Shiloh?

God bless,

GE

 

Yes, I believe so.

 

I wonder if others such as Salty, Openly Curious, Butero,  OakWood, Macs Son, JohnDB, Reformed Baptist, 19Duggarfan, gray wolf, Qnts2 etc. would agree with this?

 

 

Yes,  I agree.

[Reformed Baptist]

 

 

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words as they say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

The two in the middle in blue "Remnant Jew" and "Ethnic Jew" are part of Israel.

The two to the left in green ("Grafted-in Gentile" and "Remnant Jew") are the Church.

 

The two to the right in orange ("Ethnic Jew" and "Gentile") are not part of the Church or the Lost.

 

Does this explain your position Shiloh?

God bless,

GE

 

Yes, I believe so.

 

I wonder if others such as Salty, Openly Curious, Butero,  OakWood, Macs Son, JohnDB, Reformed Baptist, 19Duggarfan, gray wolf, Qnts2 etc. would agree with this?

 

No I wouldn't

 

The universal church, as a concept, is those whom are God chosen in every generation, it's first members were Adam and Eve, and it included all the elect of the Old Testament, both pre Israel and during Israel's existence - however it was never all Israel, and it was never exclusively Israel. With the day of pentecost there come as shift in the focus, as the church becomes gentile dominated with a remnant of Israel also being chosen. 

[Guest shiloh357]

The universal church, as a concept, is those whom are God chosen in every generation, it's first members were Adam and Eve, and it included all the elect of the Old Testament, both pre Israel and during Israel's existence - however it was never all Israel, and it was never exclusively Israel. With the day of pentecost there come as shift in the focus, as the church becomes gentile dominated with a remnant of Israel also being chosen. 

 

 

That is not anywhere in the Bible.

[GoldenEagle]

 

I definitely agree with the fact that God chose the 'seed' of Israel for His commission in The Gospel of Jesus Christ from the start of the 'Seed of the Woman' in Genesis, and the believing remnant of the seed of Israel helped fulfill it, and still are fulfilling it today as original called out ones that became the early foundation of Christ's CHURCH, His Apostles and prophets of Eph.2.

 

The ones in Green are in Christ's Salvation and are His Church, and all represent 'God's Israel' as 'one' body. The unbelieving Israelites inside the orange also represent the seed of Israel, but not Israel in The Promise like was handed down from Abraham all the way down to Joseph's sons Ephraim and Manasseh, and that because of their 'unbelief'.

 

I also avow that God's Promises REMAINED with the believing remnant of the seed of Israel, and those Promises are just alive today within Christ's Church as 'one' Body as they ever were, while many (but not all) of those Promises have been removed from unbelieving Jews and the holy land today because of the rejection of Jesus of Nazareth as The Christ. When the unbelieving seed of Israel convert to Christ Jesus they become part of His Body The Church, and are back in the Promises again by that association. Christ's Church is neither wholly Gentillic nor wholly Israelite, but made up of both together, as One Body.

 

If this is not true, then it would mean there is another Way of Salvation instead of by Faith on The Father through His Son Jesus Christ. God's Word testifies only One Way, and that is through the Blood of Jesus Christ.

 

Thanks for clarifying and sharing your perspective Salty.

I believe a lot of what you are talking about to me seems like Remnant Theology which is different than say what Shiloh has referred to as Replacement Theology (also known as Supersessionism).

 

God bless,

GE