Steam or sail?

[Deborah_]

For millennia, sea travel was dependent on the wind. Ocean currents can carry you a long way, but only very slowly; to make any real progress, sails must be hoisted to catch the breeze. A basically simple idea, yet sailing ships are far from being primitive in their design. By the middle of the 19th century, the fastest sailing ships (such as the Cutty Sark) were capable of 17.5 knots and could sail halfway round the world in less than 3 months. But without a favourable wind, they were virtually helpless. 

 

And then steamships were invented. Independent of the wind, they could travel happily in any direction and were never becalmed. They were also more manoeuvrable and could negotiate the newly constructed canals more easily. There were some disadvantages: the cost of the fuel, and the space required to store it. But their sheer dependability won the day; the sailing ships could not compete and (as far as commercial shipping was concerned) virtually disappeared from the oceans. 

 

In the Bible, the Holy Spirit is often compared to the wind (e.g. Ezekiel 37:9,10; John 3:8; Acts 2:2-4). And the Church is dependent on Him for both power and direction; without Him, we are virtually helpless. Yet that very fact can be tremendously frustrating, because we have an innate yearning for predictability. We want to be able to plan an event (such as a healing service) and be certain of both His presence and His power. What if the Holy Spirit doesn’t show up….? We fear embarrassment, or (worse) humiliation.

 

And so we do our best to ‘help’ Him along. We play uplifting music to create a suitable ‘atmosphere’. We generate a tide of emotion, encourage people to speak out any ‘words of knowledge’ (by which we mean any casual thought that might cross their minds), and make use (often unconsciously) of all the techniques of crowd manipulation. And we get results….

 

And this worries me. The very predictability of some of these events, the ‘guarantee’ of miracles, the obvious emotional manipulation that goes on - all this makes me suspect that this is really of the flesh, not from God. We are powered by the steam of human effort, not the wind of the Spirit. We daren’t sit back and wait for Him to work as and when He chooses; although we would never admit it, we are too afraid of failure. And so we march on in our own strength, building our own little kingdoms…  and wonder why we still seem to be missing something.

[angels4u]

Hi Deborah .

Good post ,you are very right to say that many time people like to work up feelings  if we are not filled with the Holy Spirit we will never feel the awe of His Holiness , so often preachers think they can command God or the Holy Spirit to do things as they think it should happen. God is not like that ,to Him belongs the glory and power and when His people are filled with His Spirit He will be where His people are..

Psalm 99English Standard Version (ESV)

The Lord Our God Is Holy

99 The Lord reigns; let the peoples tremble!
    He sits enthroned upon the cherubim; let the earth quake!
² The Lord is great in Zion;
    he is exalted over all the peoples.
³ Let them praise your great and awesome name!
    Holy is he!
⁴ The King in his might loves justice.^[a]
    You have established equity;
you have executed justice
    and righteousness in Jacob.
⁵ Exalt the Lord our God;
    worship at his footstool!
    Holy is he!

⁶ Moses and Aaron were among his priests,
    Samuel also was among those who called upon his name.
    They called to the Lord, and he answered them.
⁷ In the pillar of the cloud he spoke to them;
    they kept his testimonies
    and the statute that he gave them.

⁸ O Lord our God, you answered them;
    you were a forgiving God to them,
    but an avenger of their wrongdoings.
⁹ Exalt the Lord our God,
    and worship at his holy mountain;
    for the Lord our God is holy!

 

[missmuffet]

I really do not know what you are asking.

[Deborah_]

I really do not know what you are asking.

I think it's a question that we should all be continually asking ourselves. 

[Ezra]

And this worries me. The very predictability of some of these events, the ‘guarantee’ of miracles, the obvious emotional manipulation that goes on

- all this makes me suspect that this is really of the flesh, not from God. [/quote]

Deborah,

You are absolutely correct in that this should be a concern for all Christians. Emotional manipulation is completely unscriptural, and is indeed "of the flesh". Unfortunately, some preachers are so anxious to "prove" something that they resort to these practices, which are spiritually detrimental.  When the Holy Spirit is in control, He will do as He pleases, and Christians must simply wait in His presence.  That is the lesson from Acts 2:1-4.

[peacemakerIND]

 

And this worries me. The very predictability of some of these events, the ‘guarantee’ of miracles, the obvious emotional manipulation that goes on

- all this makes me suspect that this is really of the flesh, not from God.

Deborah,

You are absolutely correct in that this should be a concern for all Christians. Emotional manipulation is completely unscriptural, and is indeed "of the flesh". Unfortunately, some preachers are so anxious to "prove" something that they resort to these practices, which are spiritually detrimental.  When the Holy Spirit is in control, He will do as He pleases, and Christians must simply wait in His presence.  That is the lesson from Acts 2:1-4.

Yes brother.. every Christian need to make self examination.. do you like to comment on some preachers who are so Anxious,., i love to say,., i am anxious in many times.. not to only worrying.. working from 27 years,, still lot of work to do..

See the prophets ,, they tore (tare) the cloths .. like Jeremiah, Joel and Many other wept for nations,..

Jesus also wept when he saw Jerusalem while he is preparing to cross.. Apostle Paul is also wept and shouted like a mad fellow... For me i started work 27 years back.. God blessed me to lead thousands of souls in different different areas and villages.. still millions going to die. work is more.. i don't know what is my weakness but i know i need to hurry to do better works as well as possible.. A Christian writer wrote in a book,,. book name is ''A desire and vision for Lord'' ,, He quoted like this.. A person who is burning in His heart, may appear like a mad fellow in this society.

yesterday a young man died.. while i am doing the process of funereal service.. I was warned by Holy spirit to do more gospel work to spread the gospel work.,. Every day fire in heart is growing.. because my life is short.. David livingstone who is missionary to Africa wanted to go back once again even he is in sickness..and went to mission and died in mission fields.. FEW PEOPLE ONLY KNOWS.. TIME IS SHORT.. BUT many people not knowing the emergency.. Even though God is using all people in different ways.. Praises to God..  I thank you for your great postings to encourage others..

Edited November 7, 2015 by peacemakerIND

[missmuffet]

I really do not know what you are asking.

I think it's a question that we should all be continually asking ourselves. 

Would you please tell me what the question is.

[Ezra]

I really do not know what you are asking.

I think it's a question that we should all be continually asking ourselves. 

Would you please tell me what the question is.

The question is "Is emotional manipulation valid?"

[missmuffet]

I really do not know what you are asking.

I think it's a question that we should all be continually asking ourselves. 

Would you please tell me what the question is.

The question is "Is emotional manipulation valid?"

Thank you Ezra for clearing that up for me.

[missmuffet]

Are you talking about spiritual manipulation?