MorningGlory Posted November 29, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.11 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted November 29, 2015 14 hours ago, Kan said: I don't doubt that such books exist, but I question whether they are Luther's writing, or just made out to be that. Because the reformation was anti Catholic, so it would not surprise me if history and books were written or rewritten in order to blacken the cause of the reformation, and especially people like Martin Luther, who was the most hated reformer of all, because he was not burned at the stake, for one. The Papacy has been very busy eliminating all records of its atrocities as well as any historical records of its policies and the dates connected with its reign. The internet has been one way of ridding the world of valuable references, and it is advised by any of you who know better, to refrain from disclosing any sources about the Papacy, from universities etc. Every move the Papacy makes is predictable, and has been known about for many decades. Vilifying Luther, no surprise there at all. The book I spoke of has been accepted as the work of Martin Luther for 475 years; go ahead and try to pretend that it just isn't so but that won't change anything. Please post your sources for the information you furnished above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted November 29, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.11 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted November 29, 2015 19 hours ago, Davida said: Whaaat?? ahuh......He did. He did what?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted November 30, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.35 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2015 18 minutes ago, Davida said: I believe that certainly, God did indeed use Martin Luther. His act of translating the Bible into German finally opened the door for the Word of GOD to spread & made the Gospel & Salvation available to all peoples--think of that.....it was a difficult , amazing and great thing! Christians -- in following Christ -- must be just in their judgements. There is absolutely no question that God used Martin Luther mightily -- in spite of his faults and prejudices. In addition to his translation, he wrote many hymns. "A Mighty Fortress Is Our God" (German: "Ein feste Burg ist unser Gott") is one of the best known hymns by the reformer Martin Luther, who wrote many hymns. Luther wrote the words and composed the melody sometime between 1527 and 1529. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted November 30, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.11 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2015 16 minutes ago, Davida said: I believe that certainly, God did indeed use Martin Luther. His act of translating the Bible into German finally opened the door for the Word of GOD to spread & made the Gospel & Salvation available to all peoples--think of that.....it was a difficult , amazing and great thing! Satan must have despised Luther because of it. Luther mentioned being under spiritual attack while he was translating. I give my thanks & High Praise GOD in heaven for reaching Luther and casting him in this role for us. I am glad that GOD set us free from the Papacy and that we have Protestantism and all can read the Bible in their own language. I understand your disgust at Luther's writings that vilified the Jews , and rightly so... he did come out from under the Papacy so didn't surprise me. I won't argue that he brought the Bible to the common man but I can't see how a supposed man of God could be filled with so much hate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thereselittleflower Posted November 30, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 58 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 5,457 Content Per Day: 1.69 Reputation: 4,220 Days Won: 37 Joined: 07/01/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2015 2 hours ago, Davida said: I believe that certainly, God did indeed use Martin Luther. His act of translating the Bible into German finally opened the door for the Word of GOD to spread & made the Gospel & Salvation available to all peoples--think of that.....it was a difficult , amazing and great thing! Satan must have despised Luther because of it. Luther mentioned being under spiritual attack while he was translating. I give my thanks & High Praise GOD in heaven for reaching Luther and casting him in this role for us. I am glad that GOD set us free from the Papacy and that we have Protestantism and all can read the Bible in their own language. I understand your disgust at Luther's writings that vilified the Jews , and rightly so... he did come out from under the Papacy so didn't surprise me. Davida, that all is simply not true. The scripture had been translated into the vernacular in many languages throughout the history of christianity long before Luther came along. The printing press changed everything in regards to how easy it was to have a copy of the scriptures. Before the printing press making a copy of scriptures was a laborious, highly time consuming process that took years for one copy. They were done by hand. They were worth several years wages. They were considered priceless and could only be afforded by the most wealthy. Parishes, well before Luther, once they were able to obtain a copy, had to protect it against thieves. They could have locked them up and kept them from the masses, but they didn't do that. They put them out on podiums, chaining them down to discourage theft. But they were there and available. The Church Luther rebelled against also took advantage of the opportunity of the printing press, had the scriptures translated into the vernacular, and printed. People were required to buy a copy and have them in their homes and to read them. Luther's German version was not at all necessary for any of this to happen. In the 1500's there were more than 40 vernacular editions of the bible. France had 18 before 1547. Spain had begun publishing vernacular versions in 1478. Germany, in fact, had its first vernacular version of the scriptures in the 8th century. During the middle ages, there were numerous dialects in England, without any written vocabulary, so there was no written language to translate into. Latin was the universal written language in Europe up to the 1400's and the only one to be generally used. In fact, Sir Isaac Newton, in the 1660's, would not write his Principlicae Mathematica in English - his audience was too large, and English still too obscure a written language at the time. There is a great deal more to the story of the bible and it's translations than one is led to believe from your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thereselittleflower Posted November 30, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 58 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 5,457 Content Per Day: 1.69 Reputation: 4,220 Days Won: 37 Joined: 07/01/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2015 2 hours ago, Ezra said: Christians -- in following Christ -- must be just in their judgements. There is absolutely no question that God used Martin Luther mightily -- in spite of his faults and prejudices. In addition to his translation, he wrote many hymns. "A Mighty Fortress Is Our God" (German: "Ein feste Burg ist unser Gott") is one of the best known hymns by the reformer Martin Luther, who wrote many hymns. Luther wrote the words and composed the melody sometime between 1527 and 1529. I am very hard pressed to find God using someone with such very significant issues and problems to lead people from darkness to light. In fact, I have found none. I do not believe God changes how He leads people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted November 30, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.35 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2015 4 hours ago, thereselittleflower said: I am very hard pressed to find God using someone with such very significant issues and problems to lead people from darkness to light. In fact, I have found none. I do not believe God changes how He leads people. Your comments are understandable in that the RCC regarded Luther as an arch heretic. But Pope Benedict saw Luther in a different light: But now here comes Pope Benedict XVI, a fellow German, visiting his homeland and speaking to German Evangelical Christians, i.e. Lutherans, as we call them here. The Holy Father seems comfortable talking about Luther with Lutherans, even talking with obvious regard and sympathy for Luther. Shocking? ...True enough. But Luther was the original Protestant. Pope Benedict shows how a Catholic can have a certain sympathetic reading of Luther, notwithstanding the same Catholic’s rejection of Luther’s repudiation of the Catholic Church. In this way, a Catholic can see what is most important when it comes to assessing Luther—not denying the problems with him but also not overlooking what Luther got right or demonizing him. This is quintessential Benedict XVI. And it is, in fact, quintessential Vatican II, which represents on this matter a line of theological development that required a deep, Spirit-guided re-reading of the Church's tradition and a penetrating and balanced assessment of the situation of divided Christianity following the emergence of Protestantism in the 16th century.... In his address Benedict makes a number of key points regarding Luther. First, there is Luther’s “burning question”, as Benedict puts it: “what is God’s position towards me, where do I stand before God?” This remains the central question of life today, even though many people don’t realize it. Second, there is Luther’s Christ-centered spirituality. For Luther, “This God has a face, and he has spoken to us. He became one of us in the man Jesus Christ – who is both true God and true man," explains Pope Benedict. According to Luther, Christ is the interpretative center of the Bible, notes Benedict, which presupposes “that Christ is at the heart of our spirituality and that love for him, living in communion with him, is what guides our life.” Benedict clearly thinks on both of these points Luther is right and that calling attention to this fact is important for all Christians today. Of course the fact that, in this particular address, Pope Benedict doesn’t critique Luther on other points hardly amounts to an endorsement of Luther’s overall approach to Christianity, anymore than the fact that German’s Lutheran leadership invited the German Pope to address them means they are ready to enter into full communion with the Catholic Church. http://www.catholicworldreport.com/Blog/939/the_pope_martin_luther_and_our_time.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kan Posted November 30, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,661 Content Per Day: 0.49 Reputation: 1,292 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/21/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2015 11 hours ago, MorningGlory said: The book I spoke of has been accepted as the work of Martin Luther for 475 years; go ahead and try to pretend that it just isn't so but that won't change anything. Please post your sources for the information you furnished above. You would have to prove that Luther was wrong about certain Jews he was dealing with at the time. I won't jump onto the train of politically correct fans, without further consideration. As for sources of info, sorry, I won't make that mistake again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thereselittleflower Posted December 5, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 58 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 5,457 Content Per Day: 1.69 Reputation: 4,220 Days Won: 37 Joined: 07/01/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2015 On 11/30/2015, 1:00:17, Ezra said: Your comments are understandable in that the RCC regarded Luther as an arch heretic. But Pope Benedict saw Luther in a different light: http://www.catholicworldreport.com/Blog/939/the_pope_martin_luther_and_our_time.aspx I wasn't Catholic when I came to that conclusion Ezra. It had nothing to do with the Catholic Church. \ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken Posted December 5, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,379 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2015 I read scripture, have read scripture, will read scripture and look to the Spirit of God to guide me in the meaning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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