"...and every eye shall see him..."

[WilliamL]

1 hour ago, Montana Marv said:

Yes Scripture says every eye will see Him descend to the Mt of Olives. 

No, Scripture does not say this at all. You are adding to the Word.

Every eye certainly did not see him ascend from the Mount of Olives, only his disciples. Therein lies a clue as to their type of vision.

[Montana Marv]

Omegaman

First of all, those (in the physical body) on earth must be within viewing distance to be an eyewitness.  The Ascension is similar to the Second Coming, but reversed.  No added bells and whistles.

Now Christ returning with the clouds, and you even know that many have interpreted this being the Church or Bride and maybe other Saints from times past.

Now here you will need to follow this thought.  If Lazarus (the poor man) was seen by the rich man in the Parable (Luke 16:19..), the Spiritual/Souls of Men what ever you want to call it also has eyes.   So if All See Him Returning, if All means All, then all mankind will view this, All angels and heavenly creatures will view this.  Those in Heaven and those on Earth, and below the Earth.  It is the grand entrance for the King of Kings and the  Lord of Lords..

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

[Omegaman 3.0]

Who are you addressing William, did someone say that there is an area that should not be discussed? The topic has and is being discussed.

Possibilities so far:

Natural, real, physical eyes.

Technologically assisted, physical eyes.

Some sort of supernatural way.

My question is, if the Bible is not specific on the details, that we have even gotten to concensus on just that much, is there any point, in expanding upon how much we do not know from our vain reasoning?

Perhaps, just perhaps, every eye will see Him, and that is enough. I admit to being gun shy, of asking questions like how or why, when the Bible does not give an answer. I hate being presumptuous, as guesses are often just dangerous, erroneous, misleading, and distracting. Answers that begin with the word "perhaps", are not that informative. If I had to ask a question on this topic, I would ask, why do we need to know, or how will that answer help, or things along that line. But, that is just me, I am weird that way. Just an opinionated observation, be curious if you want, but don't forget to ask about the pin dancers also.

[tigger398]

I thought we were discussing the second coming. lol This is getting to confusing for my stuffed head. I needs to go to work. Merry Christmas everyone.

[Montana Marv]

4 minutes ago, WilliamL said:

No, Scripture does not say this at all. You are adding to the Word.

Every eye certainly did not see him ascend from the Mount of Olives, only his disciples. Therein lies a clue as to their type of vision.

William

I did not say or imply that everyone saw the Ascension.  I have said that according to Rev 1:7 - Look, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him; all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of Him, So shall it be Amen.

What I have implied is the Disciples saw Him go up, He will return in like manner, yet all will see His Return.  Acts 1:11- Men of Galilee.. Why do you stand here looking into the sky, This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[WilliamL]

36 minutes ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Who are you addressing William, did someone say that there is an area that should not be discussed? The topic has and is being discussed.

Ezra said, "we are not called to speculate on the mechanics of how this will occur." As though this particular topic of End Time scripture should be off-limits.

...My question is, if the Bible is not specific on the details, that we have even gotten to concensus on just that much, is there any point, in expanding upon how much we do not know from our vain reasoning?

So what if we don't have consensus?  how is our lack of consensus on this any different at all from all the other lacks of consensus in the Eschatology forum? This subject has much to teach us, if we are willing to dig, because as I quoted earlier to Theresa, "All scripture is profitable for doctrine..."

If you are not willing to dig on this particular topic of Scripture, then maybe you need to ask yourself why it makes you uncomfortable. Like it seems to be making others uncomfortable.

In that fact alone lies a real clue as to what people may really be nervous about; and it will be the same thing that will grossly upset most of the people who see Christ's Coming in the clouds. Kapish?

[WilliamL]

2 hours ago, Montana Marv said:

Yes Scripture says every eye will see Him descend to the Mt of Olives.

 

44 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

William

I did not say or imply that everyone saw the Ascension. 

I did not say that you did. I objected to your statement at the top, which Scripture does not say; you say it. However, in this statement of yours I do agree:

59 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Now here you will need to follow this thought.  If Lazarus (the poor man) was seen by the rich man in the Parable (Luke 16:19..), the Spiritual/Souls of Men what ever you want to call it also has eyes.   So if All See Him Returning, if All means All, then all mankind will view this, All angels and heavenly creatures will view this.  Those in Heaven and those on Earth, and below the Earth.  It is the grand entrance for the King of Kings and the  Lord of Lords..

 

[Omegaman 3.0]

2 hours ago, WilliamL said:

o what if we don't have consensus?  how is our lack of consensus on this any different at all from all the other lacks of consensus in the Eschatology forum? This subject has much to teach us, if we are willing to dig, because as I quoted earlier to Theresa, "All scripture is profitable for doctrine..."

If you are not willing to dig on this particular topic of Scripture, then maybe you need to ask yourself why it makes you uncomfortable. Like it seems to be making others uncomfortable.

In that fact alone lies a real clue as to what people may really be nervous about; and it will be the same thing that will grossly upset most of the people who see Christ's Coming in the clouds. Kapish?

Oh, we won't have consensus, I accept that. You can of course dig, but sometimes there is a lot of dirt before you find a nugget. Sometime mines, are just worked out, until there is no profitable ore left. All scripture is profitable, but it is not endlessly profitable. You can find the things that it is meant to say, and after that, all you do from there, is add to scripture - that is NOT  profitable.

By the way, it does not in the least make me uncomfortable. The topic is okay, but dredging for things that are not there, is what led to gnosticism. I do not think there is any danger of the here, nothing is at stake. The topic of eschatology, is important (I think) but it is not critically so. Most likely, it will not change what is going to happen, not add to our walk, not build faith or the faithful, and not increase our love of God. Perhaps that is overstated, but I think you understand what I am saying there about the issue of eschatology in general. 

The, we go off on a tangent aspect, the visible coming of Christ. Then, to take a side aspect of a side aspect of a side aspect, it is hard to anticipate a lot of benefit. Then of what benefit there is there, we are going to wallow in the speculations, instead of the revelation of the word. Not for me. Have fun though!

Oh, you asked "Kapish?" No non capisco! I don't think anyone is nervous talking about it. I just have a rule, that I sometimes fail to follow: If the Bible is silent, then we should be also. I see so much error that arises for the approach to scripture that starts with "Why would God, or how will God, what is God's purpose, or other similar approaches, instead of "What does the Bible say about . . .?" One invites speculation, the other seeks to know.

 

[WilliamL]

28 minutes ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

...I just have a rule, that I sometimes fail to follow: If the Bible is silent, then we should be also. ...

Ah, but the Bible is not silent about this topic, far from it. This one verse has connections to a great many other verses. But the Sabbath comes on, when I thankfully divest myself from my computer, to allow my eyes and nerves a rest.

To be resumed...

[Omegaman 3.0]

2 minutes ago, WilliamL said:

To be resumed...

OK, well, I won't promise to participate, but I might take a peek to see what you have to add. Shabot shalom (hope I said that correctly)