tsth Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted February 18, 2005 2 Thess. 3:7 For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us, for we were not disorderly among you; 8 nor did we eat anyone's bread free of charge, but worked with labor and toil night and day, that we might not be a burden to any of you, 9 not because we do not have authority, but to make ourselves an example of how you should follow us. 10 For even when we were with you, we commanded you this: If anyone will not work, neither shall he eat. This passage came to mind as my husband was sharing with me about some of the homeless guys he works with. He told me about how they will admit that they know the routine for eating 5 meals a day, every day, if they so choose. They know the rounds to make. They hit the 2 homeless shelters, (one of which my husband preaches at), they go to the local park ministry that gives out lunches everyday, etc. Now, if the homeless shelter continues to feed these guys who want to wander, and they continue to drink and use the shelter for food purposes, is it serving the purpose that God intended? My husband was recently troubled, because the shelter was expounding on the fact that they had to remodel and expand, because of the "growth" in their shelter??? His feelings were, that if the shelter were truly abiding in the calling that they claim, then wouldn't they be diminishing in size, rather than boasting of their growth? Are we serving the purpose, by ALWAYS providing the food for the stomachs? Or are we a stumbling block to facilitate those who WILL NOT work? What do you think? Are we REALLY acting in love, by being enablers? (For clarification here, I am not speaking of the family who is in dire straits! I am speaking of the weekly street guy who shows up for lunch EVERY DAY.) Are the homeless shelters really doing what's right in regard to him? In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silviawang Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 128 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 825 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 153 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/16/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted February 18, 2005 After I began my career 2-3 years, I had been feazed by a lot of problem in the working ,so I abdicate and maintained by my parent(in our country it is not too shy),and at that time I always doubt why to work? why so tire, to stay at home is very tiresome but I can not encourage myself re -begin to work till I read a book named <the vocational principle of American>,tracking this clue ,I understanding Christianism, although this is not the whole reason I follow Jesus Christ, but it do change my opinion about the world ,surely the credo of calling is a great spirit treasure in Christianism ,I do not know why <the vocational principle of American> can encourage a person live in a remote country and make she live under God happily but who inherit it from born defy it.so regret!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayin jade Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.87 Content Count: 43,799 Content Per Day: 6.19 Reputation: 11,244 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted February 18, 2005 Im glad that book helped you silviawang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khristeeanos Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 109 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,278 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 29 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/07/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted February 18, 2005 2 Thess. 3:7 For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us, for we were not disorderly among you; 8 nor did we eat anyone's bread free of charge, but worked with labor and toil night and day, that we might not be a burden to any of you, 9 not because we do not have authority, but to make ourselves an example of how you should follow us. 10 For even when we were with you, we commanded you this: If anyone will not work, neither shall he eat. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is sort of off topic, but sort of on topic. This passage does NOT say, "If a man CANNOT work..." Just wanted to say that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Christian Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 42 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 205 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/10/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted February 18, 2005 This is an interesting subject. I too have often wondered about this. I worked with a young man a couple weeks ago that was living at a shelter, but he went to work every day, complied with all the rules, and was saving his paychecks in order to get a place to live. He is rebuilding his life. He told me how these other guys would say, "There's no work." and he would say, " Have you went here..have you went there?" "Well, no." was the reply. He told me , "Joe, I just don't understand how they just sit all day. I messed my life up, but I'm trying to rebuild it, they could do the same if they wanted." He is a good young man that made unwise choices, and he paid for it, took responsiblity for his actions and is making an honest living now. I even helped him a little ( what I could ) especially since I saw he was helping himself. By the way, if anyone is so inclined, his name is Greg. I'm sure he would appreciate your prayers. Also, he was saved at that shelter! And I believe he has a place to live out on his own, now. Good for you, Greg! PTL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abigailwc Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 51 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 499 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/29/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/08/1964 Share Posted February 18, 2005 What do you think? Are we REALLY acting in love, by being enablers? (For clarification here, I am not speaking of the family who is in dire straits! I am speaking of the weekly street guy who shows up for lunch EVERY DAY.) Are the homeless shelters really doing what's right in regard to him? Mark 12:29-31 Jesus answered him, "The first of all the commandments is: "Hear, O Israel, the LORD our God, the LORD is one. And you shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.' This is the first commandment. And the second, like it, is this: "You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no other commandment greater than these." Eventhough when we love as God wants us to, some people might take advantage of it, it does not matter. We are to be a light to this world of darkness, and we do that by obeying Him, by bearing the fruit of the Spirit. The rest is up to Him. Blessings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted February 18, 2005 What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted February 18, 2005 This is an interesting subject. I too have often wondered about this. I worked with a young man a couple weeks ago that was living at a shelter, but he went to work every day, complied with all the rules, and was saving his paychecks in order to get a place to live. He is rebuilding his life. He told me how these other guys would say, "There's no work." and he would say, " Have you went here..have you went there?" "Well, no." was the reply. He told me , "Joe, I just don't understand how they just sit all day. I messed my life up, but I'm trying to rebuild it, they could do the same if they wanted." He is a good young man that made unwise choices, and he paid for it, took responsiblity for his actions and is making an honest living now. I even helped him a little ( what I could ) especially since I saw he was helping himself. By the way, if anyone is so inclined, his name is Greg. I'm sure he would appreciate your prayers. Also, he was saved at that shelter! And I believe he has a place to live out on his own, now. Good for you, Greg! PTL! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Dear Joe, You have heard the very same things and seen the same things that my husband has. And how wonderful, when a man has truly repented and begun to turn around and acknowledge his sin, such as Greg. That is when we are overjoyed, to see one who does not deny he is a sinner, but takes hold of the salvation and power of Jesus Christ, to change his life. We want to encourage him so very much. Praise God for Greg! In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted February 18, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.94 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted February 18, 2005 This is sort of off topic, but sort of on topic. This passage does NOT say, "If a man CANNOT work..." That's the question, though. Are they really incapable of working? My first thought when I read the OP was - what if instead of Homeless Shelters, mission groups offered Job Training centers? I know of a mission in Baltimore called Helping Up Missions that has that type of focus. Their motto is "A hand up, not a hand out." Mind you, they do offer shelter-type services, but aim is not "a night's cot" but place these men can get back on their own two feet with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Botz Posted February 19, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 76 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,492 Content Per Day: 0.61 Reputation: 191 Days Won: 18 Joined: 03/29/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted February 19, 2005 Suzanne I think you bring up a really important observation. I work with the poor and the down and outs when I have the opportunity...we do a regular food run plus we have a drop in centre. At the drop in centre there are the familiar faces who never seem to get anywhere...maintain the same petty grievances...and jealously vie for the goods that are donated and come through the door...sometimes it is hard not to react. And yet others come whom G-d brings and they are truely seeking and are desperately hard up , unloved , rejected and unwanted and you see the change come into their lives and suddenly it is all worthwhile...and who knows how G-d might yet move in the ones that are hanger ons. I think as long as those that are really in need are being cared for physically and spiritually...then there is also room for the others...they are an inevitable result of any project that seeks to help all people without discrimination and unconditionally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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