Guest Butero Posted May 14, 2016 Share Posted May 14, 2016 5 hours ago, RustyAngeL said: I re-read my comments to Hazard, and I don't think they were very clear. What I was saying is that under the Old Covenant, the Sabbath Day was Saturday. That is all it ever was. For instance, nobody called Tuesday the Sabbath. Therefore, Paul was never saying we can now call Monday, Tuesday, Friday, etc., the Sabbath for us. He was just saying that we aren't to judge others based on the observance of the Sabbath. Technically, I suppose you could do that, but it wouldn't make sense to do it, and that is not the point Paul was making. The Christian Sabbath is the rest we enter into when we accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior. It is not a calendar day, however, if a believer wants to continue to observe the Sabbath Day, they are free to, but they shouldn't judge those who don't, and we shouldn't attack those who do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 14, 2016 20 hours ago, angels4u said: googling is allowed! why not? Otherwise some people mi 4 minutes ago, Butero said: I re-read my comments to Hazard, and I don't think they were very clear. What I was saying is that under the Old Covenant, the Sabbath Day was Saturday. That is all it ever was. For instance, nobody called Tuesday the Sabbath. Therefore, Paul was never saying we can now call Monday, Tuesday, Friday, etc., the Sabbath for us. He was just saying that we aren't to judge others based on the observance of the Sabbath. Technically, I suppose you could do that, but it wouldn't make sense to do it, and that is not the point Paul was making. The Christian Sabbath is the rest we enter into when we accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior. It is not a calendar day, however, if a believer wants to continue to observe the Sabbath Day, they are free to, but they shouldn't judge those who don't, and we shouldn't attack those who do. Amen Butero,we have 7 days a week Shabbath , (Rest in Jesus ) ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 14, 2016 20 hours ago, angels4u said: Who said: Who alone stretches out the heavens And tramples down the waves of the sea; ? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 14, 2016 Maybe we should not wait for people until they come back to ask another question ,(they might not come back )please ask your question right away,that way we keep it going. Kwik you ask one question too girl:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Butero Posted May 14, 2016 Share Posted May 14, 2016 12 hours ago, HAZARD said: You are free to observe Saturday, or any other day if you so wish. Paul wrote, But why dost thou judge they brother? or why dost thou set at nought they brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ . . . . So the every one of us shall give account of himself to God. Let us not therefore judge one another any more." If the law of Moses, including the fourth commandment, was in force in the new covenant the above statement would never have been written by Paul. Each Christian can do as he pleases concerning the Sabbath and is not to be judged by his brother "Any More." Christian experiences do not come by the law. "Receive ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?. . . .the law is not of faith: but. the man who doeth them [things of the law] shall live in them. . . . how turn ye AGAIN to the weak beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire to be in bondage?" (Gal. 1:6-9; 2:15-21; 3:1-12, 19-25; 4:1-3, 19-31; 5:1-9, 11-21). "Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years [that the law required]. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed labour upon you in vain" (Gal. 3:1-12; 4:9-11). Going back to observe Sabbaths according to the law is spoken of here as going back into the bondage of the law. If one does this he is a debtor to do the whole law (Gal. 5:3). The law was added because of transgressions, TILL THE SEED [Christ] SHOULD COME to whom the promise was made . . . But before faith came [that Christ brought in the gospel and the new covenant, Heb. 12:1, 2],we were kept under the law, shut up unto that faith WHICH SHOULD AFTERWARDS BE REVEALED. . . .Wherefor the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, THAT we might be justified by faith. BUT AFTER that faith is come, WE ARE NO LONGER UNDER A SCHOOLMASTER" (Gal 3:19-25). Not being under the law here is explained as being out from under its authority like one who is no longer under a schoolmaster when we graduate from school. The law is not in force and it has no claim or authority over the person under the new covenant. He is under the obligation to keep the new covenant laws and commandments, which include new laws that were never part of the old covenant, as well as those that God saw fit to make a part of the new covenant. The law, including the ten commandments, has been "CAST OUT"; "Tell me YE DESIRE TO BE UNDER THE LAW, do ye not hear the law. For it is written that Abraham had TWO SONS. . . . he who was of the BONDWOMAN was born after the flesh; but he of the FREEWOMAN was by promise. WHICH THINGS ARE AN ALLEGORY: for THESE ARE THE TWO COVENANTS; THE ONE FROM MOUNT SINAI, which GENDERETH TO BONDAGE, is [Hagar]. . . .and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and IS IN BONDAGE with her children. But Jerusalem which is above IS FREE, which in the mother of us all. . . .Now we, brethren, as Isaac, are the children of promise. BUT AS EVEN SO IT IS NOW. Nevertheless what sayeth the Scripture? CAST OUT THE BONDWOMAN [the first or old covenant FROM MOUNT SINAI] AND HER SON [those under the law]; for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. So then brethren, WE ARE NOT CHILDREN OF THE BONDWOMAN [the old ten commandment covenant and its many laws], BUT OF THE FREE [the new covenant]. Stand fast therefor IN THE LIBERTY wherein Christ hath made us FREE, and BE NOT ENTANGLED AGAIN, WHITH THE YOKE OF BONDAGE [the old covenant]. . . . For I testify again to every man that is circumcised [no man had any part in the old covenant unless he was circumcised], that he is a debtor TO DO THE WHOLE LAW" (Gal. 4:21-31; 5:1-5, 18). I am not arguing in favor of keeping the Saturday Sabbath, or a Sabbath based on any calendar day. I am just saying his point isn't to suggest we all just pick and choose the day of our choice to make our Sabbath. There is no need to even pick a calendar day to observe. As to your position on the law, there is a balance here that many choose to forget. The reason why we are not under a schoolmaster today is because we have the Holy Spirit as our teacher and guide, and if we are led by the Spirit, we are not under the curse of the law. If we refuse to be led by the Spirit, and we walk after the lusts of the flesh, that law remains in tact in our lives. We are choosing to put ourselves back under the law whether we acknowledge that is the case or not. This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. Galatians 5:16-18 If you are not walking in the Spirit, you are still under the law. Notice what it goes on to say. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these: Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:19-21 You don't have to worry about keeping laws if you are led by the Spirit, but that doesn't give us license to sin freely and think all is well with our soul. These are based on laws. If the result of committing adultery is that I won't inherit the Kingdom of God, who cares if one claims I am not under the law? I still wind up on the outside as a castaway. The key is that we should walk in the Spirit. Lets continue. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. Galatians 5:22-23 The point is not to say we are not to care about God's standards anymore. We should care about them more than ever, but we can live by them by walking in the Spirit. The Spirit will never lead us to break God's standards of holiness. And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another. Galatians 5:24-26 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 14, 2016 7 minutes ago, Butero said: I am not arguing in favor of keeping the Saturday Sabbath, or a Sabbath based on any calendar day. I am just saying his point isn't to suggest we all just pick and choose the day of our choice to make our Sabbath. There is no need to even pick a calendar day to observe. As to your position on the law, there is a balance here that many choose to forget. The reason why we are not under a schoolmaster today is because we have the Holy Spirit as our teacher and guide, and if we are led by the Spirit, we are not under the curse of the law. If we refuse to be led by the Spirit, and we walk after the lusts of the flesh, that law remains in tact in our lives. We are choosing to put ourselves back under the law whether we acknowledge that is the case or not. This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. Galatians 5:16-18 If you are not walking in the Spirit, you are still under the law. Notice what it goes on to say. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these: Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:19-21 You don't have to worry about keeping laws if you are led by the Spirit, but that doesn't give us license to sin freely and think all is well with our soul. These are based on laws. If the result of committing adultery is that I won't inherit the Kingdom of God, who cares if one claims I am not under the law? I still wind up on the outside as a castaway. The key is that we should walk in the Spirit. Lets continue. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. Galatians 5:22-23 The point is not to say we are not to care about God's standards anymore. We should care about them more than ever, but we can live by them by walking in the Spirit. The Spirit will never lead us to break God's standards of holiness. And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another. Galatians 5:24-26 Agree completely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwikphilly Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 96 Topic Count: 307 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 18,138 Content Per Day: 4.62 Reputation: 27,818 Days Won: 327 Joined: 08/03/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 14, 2016 Does the Bible teach the "doctrine" of,,,,,,"original sin?........................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 14, 2016 13 minutes ago, kwikphilly said: Does the Bible teach the "doctrine" of,,,,,,"original sin?........................ I don't know if you would call it a doctrine..but yes the Bible talks about original sin,as we all live in a fallen world we were born in sin and we have lots of consequences of sin . I would say the original sin already exists between Genesis 1 verse 1 and 2 ,it happened long time ago because darkness over the earth? We all know about Adam and Eve but I think the original sin existed before that.. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. I'm curious to see what you think? Good question! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwikphilly Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 96 Topic Count: 307 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 18,138 Content Per Day: 4.62 Reputation: 27,818 Days Won: 327 Joined: 08/03/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 14, 2016 I think this is very debatable as fare as a "Doctrine" perhaps it would be better as another Topic entirely instead of a blank "yes or no " question? Consider this then..... Quote (1) Scripture plainly teaches that sin is not inherited. “[T]he son shall not bear the iniquity of the father” (Ezekiel 18:20); every person is responsible for his own conduct (Romans 14:12). (2) Human sinfulness commences in that period of one’s life that is characterized as youth (Genesis 8:21; Jeremiah 3:25). (3) A child must reach a certain level of maturity before he is able to choose between evil and good (Isaiah 7:15, 16). (4) The qualities of little children are set forth as models for those who would aspire to enter the kingdom (Matthew 18:3; 19:14) and for those already in the church (1 Corinthians 14:20). Surely the Lord was not suggesting that we emulate little, totally corrupt sinners! (5) The human spirit is not inherited from one’s parents; rather, it is given by God (Ecclesiastes 12:7; Hebrews 12:9). Hence, at birth it must be as pure as the source from whence it comes. Clearly, babies are not born in sin. https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/276-original-sin-and-a-misapplied-passage I would have answered "no" but I do think I should withdraw the question as it does not seem appropriate now that I've thought about it,,,,,,,,fair? With love-in Christ,Kwik Why don't you go ahead & post the next question Angels,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 14, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 14, 2016 4 minutes ago, kwikphilly said: I think this is very debatable as fare as a "Doctrine" perhaps it would be better as another Topic entirely instead of a blank "yes or no " question? Consider this then..... I would have answered "no" but I do think I should withdraw the question as it does not seem appropriate now that I've thought about it,,,,,,,,fair? With love-in Christ,Kwik Why don't you go ahead & post the next question Angels,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Kwik, I must disagree as far as I know we are ALL born in sin ~~~ Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me. psalm 51:5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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