Sequence-of-Events Analysis

[Marcus O'Reillius]

1 hour ago, Sister said:

The sealing of the 144,000 is the "picking up of them", ...it's the same event.....

I categorically reject another "This means that, and that means this," willy-nilly, form of exegesis.

Words mean things.  To seal is not to gather.

The 144,000 will shortly follow the Lamb into two battles on the Day of the Lord's Wrath.  The sealing they undergo is in preparation not only for that, but perhaps also for immunity from the desolations themselves which will follow.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

1 hour ago, Sister said:

The measuring of the altar is them...the 144K.  It has to be....

You have convinced yourself, I will not change your mind, but I would be remiss if I did not inform you that God gave that task to John, and you can "see" him measuring the Temple in the latter chapters of Ezekiel.

i categorically reject this assignment of the 144,000 of yours.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

Sister, as to the rest of your post, it is nonsensical to me.  While you may think you are looking at the big picture, your method, as is incorporated by so many before - " a little here, a little there" - allows all kinds of errors to be introduced and once again we have all kinds of assignments where "this means that, and that means this."

The Sequence-of-Events analysis, which I have put together and have posted here, is an entirely new way of looking at the whole of end-time prophecy.  It allows me to assemble in one outline of a timeline, the order of events that God has conveyed to us in the major, linear narratives as I have detailed from the Olivet Discourse, the book of Revelation, the book of Daniel, and with the aid of some of Paul's letters to the Thessalonians.

There are other references in my book, and I even incorporate passages from the Songs of Solomon to demonstrate how God has revealed His Plan for all of us: Gentile and Jew to be with Him for eternity.  May He have blessed your day down under, as my day is about to begin in Aspen, Colorado.

[WilliamL]

2 hours ago, Sister said:

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This is how I summarize chapter 14's EVENTS:

• 144,000 assembled on Mount Zion; Jesus standing on the earth.

I know there is a physical Mt Zion, but this one is not it. 

They are standing on Mt Zion, which is the Kingdom of God.  They are standing in heaven before the throne of God.  They are redeemed from the earth, standing in heaven.

 Revelation 14:3   And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

Heb. 12:22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, 23  to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect...

This is the Mount Zion spoken about, the heavenly one. At this time spoken about in Rev. 14, Jesus has not yet come to stand upon the Mount of Olives to fight the final battle of the Day of the Lord.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

This is the Mount Zion spoken about, the heavenly one. At this time spoken about in Rev. 14, Jesus has not yet come to stand upon the Mount of Olives to fight the final battle of the Day of the Lord.

In context, Hebrews 12:22 is contrasting this mountain they have come to back to Mount Sinai which no one could touch, and furthermore, the author may be figuatively alluding to Jesus as the mountain which fills the land in the Millennium.

Hebrews is not an eschatological work, and I do not consider this verse as establishing Mount Zion as a place in the Heavenly realm.

• The 144,000 are "mustered" in conjunction with the sixth Seal.
• The sixth Seal precedes their mention with the sign of the Day of the Lord: the sun/moon/star sign.
• Which is followed by a second earthquake.
• The 144,000 are sequenced before the Great Multitude's arrival in Heaven.
• The 144,000 are also shown in Rev 14 as being with Jesus on Mount Zion.
• This happens before the Harvest from the clouds of the earth, just like the sixth Seal.
• Angels said Jesus will alight as He went up from the Mount of Olives.
• Zechariah 14:4 has Jesus on the Mount of Olives.
• On the Day of the Lord's Wrath, the Time of Jacob's Trouble, the Lord leads an army against Jerusalem as per Joel 2.

I conclude that the second earthquake of the sixth Seal records Jesus' touchdown on the Mount of Olives, splitting it in two.  From the newly formed cleft, some of the Remnant Jews will escape the coming carnage.  On this NEW hill, Jesus then "musters" His Army.  They are sealed, and made ready for the two battles the prophets indicate come on the Day of the Lord.  The assault on Jerusalem comes from the east.  The graveyard the muslims put by the East Gate will not stop Him from entering the Temple grounds.

 

[WilliamL]

1 hour ago, Marcus O'Reillius said:

In context, Hebrews 12:22 is contrasting this mountain they have come to back to Mount Sinai which no one could touch, and furthermore, the author may be figuatively alluding to Jesus as the mountain which fills the land in the Millennium. Hebrews is not an eschatological work...

You ignore the context, which is fully eschatological; and there is nothing to allude to Jesus being the mountain, except in your imagination.

1 hour ago, Marcus O'Reillius said:

I conclude that the second earthquake of the sixth Seal records Jesus' touchdown on the Mount of Olives...

There is no second earthquake mentioned in the 6th Seal, other than in your imagination. And the passage certainly does not "record Jesus' touchdown," except in your imagination.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

WilliamL:

Oh really?  Mark.

[Sister]

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"As you explained?"  I know of no explanation, and I think you are quite mistaken in your placement.

Marcus

My explanation was that there were three reapings.  All taken from chapter 14.

The First group to be reaped is the 144,000, the FIRST-FRUITS.  I explained there are two types of sealings.  Only 144K are sealed with the Father's name on their foreheads and know that song that no man knows but them, and the 24 elders in heaven.  So because they follow the Lamb, they have been fed by him....this is that same song he gave the apostles, ....that same doctrine is what they have been given which is why they are chosen.  The details given about them are the clues as to why they are reaped first, which is why they are standing before the throne of God in heaven, where the 24 elders are and the four beasts.  They did what was commanded and followed that same doctrine which was provided to all of us.

If you need some more information, I can provide and show why they are taken up first;

John 6:51   I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

 John 6:56   He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.

 

That flesh we ought to eat, is Christ's doctrine.  The only place we can find this is in the scriptures where there is truth.  It has been provided for us already, so no need to go to man's books, written by man and depend on his interpretation, through his eyes, because men make mistakes.  So for someone to say, heh I've written a book, come to MY book, and you will find truth, is going against what Christ taught us.  Christ will feed us himself, from his words, and when he sees that we have obeyed this commandment, and searched out his word because we love truth, then he will provide the holy spirit to give understanding of those scriptures and to tie it all together.  This can not be given from man, but from only from Christ himself.  So in proving truth, we should refer men to the scriptures, and this is where whatever is said by one's opinion can be verified or rebuked.  So I ask you again, to please read Rev 14, and look at it real carefully this time, and forget about what you have already stated, or written, but look at it with fresh eyes again because in that chapter, it shows us, and when I say clearly, I mean clearly, because the Word of God does not lie, that when we analyse that chapter, you will see a little jewel there,  a rythmn, that there are three reapings and that order is laid out already. It's subtle, and it's vague, but it's there.

When you go to Rev 7, you will also see a rythmn concerning the resurrection, who is chosen first, and who comes next, and when you go to Rev 11, there's a rythm there also, with the measuring of the temple, and those left outside in the court who are given to the gentiles, ....and if we are not inside the temple measured, then the only place we can stay is in the outer court to be trodden on by the gentiles.  In all three scenarios, there are a small elite group, and a large group, and they tie in perfectly, in absolute harmony with all three chapters.  The jewel is staring us in the face, and we dismiss it so easily.

All I ask is to look at it again with fresh eyes, and see for yourself what is being shown to us, and instead of us becoming the shepherd, we need to hear the shepherd, for he is the only one who truly leads.

Have a blessed day yourself.

 

Edited August 12, 2016 by Sister

[Sister]

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You have convinced yourself, I will not change your mind, but I would be remiss if I did not inform you that God gave that task to John, and you can "see" him measuring the Temple in the latter chapters of Ezekiel.

Right, that's true.  So how does John measure the worshipers in the temple?  Is he measuring them from heaven?  from the grave?  What significance does this hold?  Try and look at it through John's eyes.  Can you please explain?  If not I will, because I just picked something up.

The measuring of the temple in Ezekiel is a physical temple.  There's a room there for animal sacrifices.  The temple in Rev 11 is a spiritual one. We don't sacrifice animals anymore, but sacrifices of the heart. Now John's vision was of a future temple, what he would see in the last days,... not the temple back then, and there is no temple currently standing there to measure, so the believers standing at "the altar", inside the temple are exactly what is measured, .....It's just a small room, not the whole building.  Who are they then?

 

[Marcus O'Reillius]

18 hours ago, inchrist said:

You have the two witnesses resurrected in both 6^th and 7^th bowl?  

Thank you!

I corrected that oversight in editing; you have finally contributed something that was actually useful.

I will correct my papers when I return home.