Cardinal Burke contradicts the Pope

[Ezra]

Contrary to what Pope Francis has said publicly, Cardinal Burke has come out publicly to state that Allah and the Lord God Almighty are not the same.  But even there he pulled his punches.  He say Allah is a "governor" instead of Allah is a "despot". But he does recognize that Islam is at war against Christianity.

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2016/09/08/cardinal-raymond-burke-muslims-christians-dont-worship-god/

 

 

[markdohle]

Allah simply means God.  In the East, Christians call God Allah.  As for the God question, there is one God.  We do have our ideas about God, even Christians seem to worship their own ideas of God.  Yet God exist in His own right, no matter what we project on to Him, or even if we do not believe in Him.  No one owns God, nor is He some piece of property owned by any one religion, though Jesus is Lord, people who do not this, still worship God, just not in its fullness I believe. 

[Ezra]

30 minutes ago, markdohle said:

Allah simply means God. 

Except that in the Koran Allah is at war with the one true and living God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, as well as with Jews and Christians.  Therefore Allah can be none other than Satan.  I could provide multiple quotes from the Koran to establish this.

[markdohle]

19 minutes ago, Ezra said:

Except that in the Koran Allah is at war with the one true and living God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, as well as with Jews and Christians.  Therefore Allah can be none other than Satan.  I could provide multiple quotes from the Koran to establish this.

Lifting quotes out of context is dangerous.  Here are some below that state otherwise to what you have said.  I am not trying to convince you about what you think of Islam, not my place, nor is it possible ;-)......yet there is always more to be looked at so that our judgments may be fair. 

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

This verse is often quoted to show that Islam is intolerant.

O YOU who have attained to faith! Do not take the Jews and the Christians for your allies: they are but allies of one another and whoever of you allies himself with them becomes, verily, one of them; behold, God does not guide people who are unjust. (Quran 5:51)

Quran is a complete book of guidance and while studying various issues it should be kept in mind that a particular issue may be discussed over several chapters or several verses in the same chapter. A complete understanding can only be achieved by understanding the whole issue as presented over all the verses and chapters and not by looking at only part of the Quran. God specifically warns us against doing just that, upholding part of the Quran while disregarding the rest. 

.. Then is it only a part of the Book that ye believe in, and do you reject the rest? but what is the reward for those among you who behave like this but disgrace in this life? – and on the Day of Judgment they shall be consigned to the most grievous penalty. For God is not unmindful of what ye do. (Quran 2:85)

To understand the issue of befriending the Jews, Christians or people of any other faith, we have to study all the concerned verses from the Quran collectively. 

Let us look at some other verses about this issue. The following two verses regulate relations with any people, regardless of faith: 

As for such [of the unbelievers] as do not fight against you on account of [your] faith, and neither drive you forth from your homelands, God does not forbid you to show them kindness and to behave towards them with full equity: for, verily, God loves those who act equitably. (Quran 60:8)

God only forbids you to turn in friendship towards such as fight against you because of [your] faith, and drive you forth from your homelands, or aid [others] in driving you forth: and as for those [from among you] who turn towards them in friendship; it is they, they who are truly wrongdoers! (Quran 60:9)

From the above verses, we learn that we are only discouraged from befriending those who fight Muslims because of their religion. Now let’s go back to the verse immediately after 5:51, to see if it sheds some further light on the issue. 

And yet you can not see how those in whose hearts there is disease vie with one another for their good will (the hostile Jews and Christians), saying [to themselves], "We do fear lest a change of fortune bring us disaster." But God may well bring about good fortune [for the believers] or any [other] event of His own devising, whereupon those [waverers] will be smitten with remorse for the thoughts which they had secretly harboured within themselves-  (Quran 5:52)

During the time of the Prophet when the Jews and Christians were in open conflict with the Muslims, there were some Muslims who were more concerned about maintaining there alliances with the Jews and Christians at the expense of the Muslim community. The above verse is referring to such situations where Muslims with doubts in their hearts will ally themselves with the enemy.

Chapter 5 Verse 57 of the Quran makes it clear again, who are not to be taken as friends; O you who believe! take not for friends and protectors those who take your religion for a mockery or sport,- whether among those who received the Scripture before you, or among those who reject Faith; but remain conscious of God, if you are (truly) believers. (Quran 5:57)

God teaches us throughout the Quran that there are righteous Jews and Christians. As such there is no prohibition for Muslims to be friends with Jews, Christians or people of any other faith who are of good character.

Quranic verses referring to the righteous Jews and Christians:

Of the people of Moses there is a section who guide and do justice in the light of truth. (Quran 7:159)

And We caused Jesus, the son of Mary, to follow in the footsteps of those (earlier prophets), confirming the truth of whatever there still remained of the Torah; and We sent him the Gospel, wherein there was guidance and light, confirming the truth of whatever there still remained of the Torah, and as a guidance and admonition unto the God-conscious. (Quran 5:46)

Verily, those who have attained to faith [in this divine writ], as well as those who follow the Jewish faith, and the Christians, and the Sabians – all who believe in God and the Last Day and do righteous deeds-shall have their reward with their Sustainer; and no fear need they have, and neither shall they grieve. (Quran 2:62)

Not all of them are alike: Of the People of the Book are a portion that stand (For the right): They rehearse the Signs of God all night long, and they prostrate themselves in adoration. They believe in God and the Last Day; they enjoin what is right, and forbid what is wrong; and they hasten (in emulation) in (all) good works: They are in the ranks of the righteous. (Quran 3:113-114)

And there are, certainly, among the People of the Book, those who believe in God, in the revelation to you, and in the revelation to them, bowing in humility to God. They will not sell the Signs of God for a miserable gain! For them is a reward with their Lord, and God is swift in account. (Quran 3:199)

The following verse from the Quran capsulates this issue:

O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that you may know each other (not that you may despise (each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of God is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And God has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things). (Quran 49:13)

 

[enoob57]

Satan has always wanted to be ... but never will even begin as pathetic his attempts to be... God has produced creation and His Written Word to lead us to Himself. All else is under the control of the fallen one rebuked by Christ to eternal damnation... Love, Steven

[markdohle]

10 minutes ago, Davida said:

That is a very  common misconception that is often perpetuated.  The word Allah is not equal to the word "God" and does not mean the same as the term GOD it means  'the god."  Christians should abstain from thinking the term is interchangeable with our word -- GOD.  Because if you use the term allah you are not referring to the God of the Bible who is revealed in the Old Testament and it is in direct conflict with the Judeo-Christian ideas and spiritual understanding of GOD. 

The origin is from the Arabic word  Al-ilah  which  was  contracted to the term " Allah"  which means "the god".  Al-iah was the name of the chief of the gods worshipped among the Arab pagans.  This term was noted as  the chief god in their pantheon, the Kaaba with it's three hundred and sixty idols.

The Hindus call their top god --- Vishnu . It would be unthinkable for Christians to think it is the same meaning as our  word -  GOD - YHWH. or to refer to the CHRISTIAN GOD as --the Great Supreme Buddha.

Arabic-speaking Coptic, Roman Catholic, Orthodox, Maronite, evangelical, and Reformed Christians worship Allah, which is simply the word or term for God in another language. Islam does not hold a copyright to the term. In fact, Arab Christians existed before Islam appeared on the scene. Christians who worship Allah number in the millions, and their biblical version of Allah differs from the Qur’anic version. To demean or demonize the word for God in another language does a great disservice to believers who speak that language. Opportunities to win a hearing or dialogue between Christians and Arabic-speaking Muslims vis-à-vis Jesus Christ are also minimized.

It is time for all of us, especially Christians, to exercise caution when it comes to attacking the term for God in a language foreign to most of us. No other term exists in Arabic for the God Christians claim to be the one, true God. Western Christians do not normally use Hebrew terms for God in their languages. They cannot expect Arab Christians to use any other term or word for theirs. Allah is equivalent to the English God, the French Dieu, or the Spanish Dios.http://www.equip.org/article/allah-does-not-belong-to-islam/

[ayin jade]

The allah of islam is not the same as our God. Allah of islam has many attributes that contradict the bible. 

[enoob57]

13 minutes ago, markdohle said:

Arabic-speaking Coptic, Roman Catholic, Orthodox, Maronite, evangelical, and Reformed Christians worship Allah, which is simply the word or term for God in another language. Islam does not hold a copyright to the term. In fact, Arab Christians existed before Islam appeared on the scene. Christians who worship Allah number in the millions, and their biblical version of Allah differs from the Qur’anic version. To demean or demonize the word for God in another language does a great disservice to believers who speak that language. Opportunities to win a hearing or dialogue between Christians and Arabic-speaking Muslims vis-à-vis Jesus Christ are also minimized.

It is time for all of us, especially Christians, to exercise caution when it comes to attacking the term for God in a language foreign to most of us. No other term exists in Arabic for the God Christians claim to be the one, true God. Western Christians do not normally use Hebrew terms for God in their languages. They cannot expect Arab Christians to use any other term or word for theirs. Allah is equivalent to the English God, the French Dieu, or the Spanish Dios.http://www.equip.org/article/allah-does-not-belong-to-islam/

The term god & The God are only identified by God Himself through the 'IS' of Himself... His Identifying attributes- 'IS' -and not anything else could be and should be set forth in the foundation of the heart... He cannot be brought down except by The Son who came and has return to and cannot be confused by any other attempt to do so! There exist only One True God and He 'IS' defined only in His creation and written Word 'the Bible 66 books' all else is the blasphemies of satan...  Love, Steven

[Ezra]

3 hours ago, markdohle said:

Lifting quotes out of context is dangerous. 

I don't believe this admonition applies in the context of the Koran.  ISIS has recently rebuked the Pope for calling Islam a religion of peace. There is nothing "out of context" in view of the fact that Radical Islam has declared war on the West, particularly Christians and Jews (called "infidels").

There are far too many left-liberal deluded westerners who think there can be peaceful co-existence with Islam. Once they establish their worldwide Caliphate, you can wring your hands till you're blue in the face.  

Now the Brits and the Europeans are finally waking up to the results of their deluded liberalism.  The UK is building a wall in Calais a la Donald Trump!  It is probably too late. And let's not forget that it is deluded Pope Francis who has been urging Europe to take in even more migrants. But he has a wall around the Vatican!

[just_abc]

Some personal thoughts :

 

A certain word for God is used by Christians in several different languages.  It is also found in Bibles in different languages.  It is used in sermons.  In Bible studies.  Even in prayer.

There are many born again Christians who love the Lord.. and who pray to Him using that word in some languages.  It is a very normal usage for Christians in some languages to use that word for God.  It is normal for Christian churches in some places to use that word.  It is normal for Bibles in some languages to have that word ..

For example ..If one were to look up many reputable Bahasa Indonesia {Indonesian language} bibles .... and look up verses such as John 3:16 .. one would often find that word there.    

The usage of that word by Christians is not something new.  It is not something that is only by one little small group of people..  or simply by a fringe group etc..   

That word has been used by fellow Christians and churches ..and used in Bibles.. for a long long time.

 

____

However that said..  just because both Christians and non-Christians might use the same general term for God in some languages [including the english language]  to refer to a Creator.....  that does NOT mean that both Christians and non-Christians have the same understanding of who that Creator really is.

And it does NOT mean that Christianity and non-Christian religions are the same thing..  because they are not.

 

Just some personal thoughts.  No offence meant to anyone.

 

Thanks.

 

 

   

 

 

Edited September 11, 2016 by just_abc