spiderman1917 Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 33 minutes ago, Hawkins said: The Bible never says that God is the father of everyone. A father will kill a wolf with no mercy if the wolf trying desperately to kill his son. In the Bible, God is a good Shepherd of His sheep. He's not a father of the wolves. I accept Jesus as my Lord and savior, does that mean im his son? I'm saved? God gave me a conscience. I've asked God to mold and guide my conscience because I don't follow ancient text when my conscience tells me "that's sick, unjust, and wrong". People are blind. They don't choose to be blind. It isn't their fault. Christianity is divided and splintered into thousands of denominations. All claim that they are the most Biblical. They are confused and it isn't their fault. God knows people don't choose to be blind. I pray for and seek understanding because I am blind in many areas. I read the Bible and see the contradictions and all the verses that lead people to opposite beliefs and become far more confused. Blind people are not choosing to be blind. God will take that into account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,242 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 16,657 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 5, 2017 Part of the torment of hell is eternal separation from God. All that is good and pure, even light itself is from God. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkins Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 289 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/25/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted September 5, 2017 16 minutes ago, spiderman1917 said: I accept Jesus as my Lord and savior, does that mean im his son? I'm saved? God gave me a conscience. I've asked God to mold and guide my conscience because I don't follow ancient text when my conscience tells me "that's sick, unjust, and wrong". People are blind. They don't choose to be blind. It isn't their fault. Christianity is divided and splintered into thousands of denominations. All claim that they are the most Biblical. They are confused and it isn't their fault. God knows people don't choose to be blind. I pray for and seek understanding because I am blind in many areas. I read the Bible and see the contradictions and all the verses that lead people to opposite beliefs and become far more confused. Blind people are not choosing to be blind. God will take that into account. My advice is, don't trust you intelligence. Human IQ is low. Bible is made up of human accounts of testimonies/witnessing of who God is. Humans on the other hand may have read it by employing their limited intelligence. Thus they read contradictions or "God is not moral". It's warned that if you choose to rely on your limited knowledge to judge God, "the same day you eat of it, the same day you shall surely die". That said. God's morality is different from that of humans. We humans base our morality on a physical body. That is, it is immoral to have a physical body harmed or killed. God's morality is based on souls. It is thus immoral to leave the souls harmed and unsaved. God ordered to kill the Canaanites or else they will kill the Jews and will put God's message of salvation to an end. If the Jews are wiped out by the Canaanites, we don't have a gospel today for our souls to be saved. All mankind will thus wind up in an eternal hell. God is thus immoral. The history however is, God killed the Canaanites such that the Jews survived to bring forward His message of salvation to today's humans, such that much more human souls are saved along humanity. God is thus moral. Your human intelligence however won't be able to see it this way. So the advice is, quit using your IQ (because it's not reliable and shakes the faith of both you and others when applied), and put more faith in God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman1917 Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 8 minutes ago, Willa said: Part of the torment of hell is eternal separation from God. All that is good and pure, even light itself is from God. Perhaps a trillion years of suffering for 80 or so years of sin is enough. Could you imagine how long a trillion years is? Well eternity is longer. God can do anything including get a person out of hell. Don't you think some people repent after they go to hell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,242 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 16,657 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 5, 2017 No. Hell is not purgatory. Hell is final judgement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman1917 Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 (edited) If you guys are right that is the most depressing thing I've ever heard of. My conscience tells me it's sick and wrong. How could I tell a family the gospel is good news when so many of their family and friends will be tortured for trillions and trillions and trillions of years??? It sounds absolutely ridiculous to me. Hold a flame to your finger for 30 seconds and you will be screaming in agony and in pain for days. Now imagine your whole body burned in the worst possible agony for trillions of years. It is the most horrifying, depressing, miserable teaching and reality I have ever heard of, and Christianity is bad for my mental health when it includes such toxic madness! Should I follow an ancient text when I find it irrational, disturbing, psychotic, cruel, disgusting, and sick?? Edited September 5, 2017 by spiderman1917 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steward George Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Steward Followers: 110 Topic Count: 10,465 Topics Per Day: 1.26 Content Count: 27,774 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 15,465 Days Won: 129 Joined: 06/30/2001 Status: Online Birthday: 09/21/1971 Steward Share Posted September 5, 2017 4 minutes ago, spiderman1917 said: Should I follow an ancient text when I find it irrational, disturbing, psychotic, cruel, disgusting, and sick?? Here's the problem, you're trying to rationalize God. But His Thoughts are SOO MUCH HIGHER than our thoughts. With tough passages of the Bible -- I just trust what He says and for anything that is too difficult ... I'll wait patiently till I'm convinced in my Spirit what He wants to explain to me. Isa 55:6 "Seek the LORD while he may be found; call upon him while he is near; Isa 55:7 let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; let him return to the LORD, that he may have compassion on him, and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. Isa 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the LORD. Isa 55:9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts. His thoughts are soooo much higher than ours. Sometimes you just have to trust HIM and trust His Word -- even when you don't quite understand it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman1917 Posted September 5, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 5, 2017 I will admit that it is good to respect and fear God. I can see why Christ used so many hyperboles (exaggerations). I kid you not, I was in a mental hospital where a young man plucked out his eyes to purge himself of lust and pornography addiction. He was just doing what Jesus told him to do. He didn't understand that Jesus was making a huge exaggeration to make a point. Jesus did exaggerate at times. Should I pluck out my eyes, because I know my eyes lead me to sin? If not, you confirm my point that Jesus was exaggerating to make a point. Sometimes parents do that to scare their children into avoiding a certain behavior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 4 hours ago, spiderman1917 said: Nothing in the Bible says every belief must come from Scripture. If you are talking about God, your beliefs about God must come from the only place where He has revealed Himself. The Bible is the only objective, infallible information we have about God and about who He is and what He will or will not do. You cannot just make up stuff about God in your mind and expect God to conform to what you want to believe about Him. You have align your beliefs about with the Bible and what He has said about Himself in the Bible. Quote God told me he is more merciful than I am. And He is more holy than you are and it is that holiness that operates within a system of perfect justice, which says that sin must be punished. Quote Jesus died for everyone. His sacrifice had infinite merit. It atoned for all sin. But our appropriation of the benefits of His are not automatic. You have trust in Jesus and His finished work on the cross in order to gain eternal life and that is available to anyone willing to accept Him. Quote I just can't be happy or have any peace knowing that people are tortured forever. The belief in hell is bad for my mental health. So what are you doing to reach them for Christ so they don't go to Hell? Quote I know that sin causes grievious consequences and there is a terrible punishment for sin, but that doesn't mean it is eternal. Hell isn't punishment for sin. Hell is the consequence of rejecting Christ. That is an eternal decision and it has an eternal consequence: Hell. Quote Jesus paid the debt. Scripture says nothing unclean shall enter heaven. Would you consider yourself unclean? All of us are unclean outside of Christ; it is only through Christ that we are made clean and acceptable to God the Father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted September 5, 2017 Share Posted September 5, 2017 42 minutes ago, spiderman1917 said: If you guys are right that is the most depressing thing I've ever heard of. My conscience tells me it's sick and wrong. How could I tell a family the gospel is good news when so many of their family and friends will be tortured for trillions and trillions and trillions of years??? It sounds absolutely ridiculous to me. Hold a flame to your finger for 30 seconds and you will be screaming in agony and in pain for days. Now imagine your whole body burned in the worst possible agony for trillions of years. And by denying the reality of Hell, by not telling people about Jesus you are enabling them to go Hell. Is that something you want to live with? Quote It is the most horrifying, depressing, miserable teaching and reality I have ever heard of, and Christianity is bad for my mental health when it includes such toxic madness! Should I follow an ancient text when I find it irrational, disturbing, psychotic, cruel, disgusting, and sick?? There is nothing irrational about Hell. If you find it so disturbing, what are you doing to share Christ with people so they don't go to Hell? What's irrational is finding out the truth about Hell and knowing the way of escape, but electing to reject the way of escape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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