missmuffet Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.80 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, ytLiJC said: i am not trying to impose anything on you some biblical words and verses can be taken literally, because their translation somehow turns out to be in line with the modern standards of literacy, but many other scriptural words and expressions are kind of figurative in a specific way, because the scriptural terms refer, first of all, to spiritual things/concepts, which are usually not known/familiar to people who haven't practiced the faith right(eously) enough, because they can be discerned/determined/understood only through righteous practice of faith Blessings Most words of the Bible can be taken literally and should be taken literally. There is some figures of speech within the pages of the Bible but those are obvious. If someone told you " it is raining cats and dogs" would you think there were cats and dogs coming from the sky? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytLiJC Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 357 Content Per Day: 0.15 Reputation: 65 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, missmuffet said: Most words of the Bible can be taken literally and should be taken literally. There is some figures of speech within the pages of the Bible but those are obvious. If someone told you " it is raining cats and dogs" would you think there were cats and dogs coming from the sky? rather fewer scriptural words and verses - most scriptural words and expressions are figurative rather than literal for modern people here is an example of how many scriptural words are figurative and don't give a direct full explanation about the things they refer to: 1 Corinthians 9:9-11 (NHEB) "it is written in the Law of Moses, "Do not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain." Is it for the oxen that God cares, or does he say it assuredly for our sake? Yes, it was written for our sake, because he who plows ought to plow in hope, and he who threshes in the hope of having a share. If we sowed to you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we reap your fleshly things?" so how many other words in Scripture have special meanings?! Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.80 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2017 16 minutes ago, ytLiJC said: rather fewer scriptural words and verses - most scriptural words and expressions are figurative rather than literal for modern people here is an example of how many scriptural words are figurative and don't give a direct full explanation about the things they refer to: 1 Corinthians 9:9-11 (NHEB) "it is written in the Law of Moses, "Do not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain." Is it for the oxen that God cares, or does he say it assuredly for our sake? Yes, it was written for our sake, because he who plows ought to plow in hope, and he who threshes in the hope of having a share. If we sowed to you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we reap your fleshly things?" so how many other words in Scripture have special meanings?! Blessings No, many give the words in the Bible their own meaning which leads to false doctrine. Something that is dangerous and Christians should keep a distance from that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytLiJC Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 357 Content Per Day: 0.15 Reputation: 65 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2017 18 minutes ago, missmuffet said: No, many give the words in the Bible their own meaning which leads to false doctrine. Something that is dangerous and Christians should keep a distance from that. i think systematic reading of Scripture is not the basis of what the spiritual servants and religious worshipers have to do as such - let's for example remember the case with the highly educated eunuch (of great authority under the queen of the ethiopians) (Acts 8:27-40), and especially what he said to St Philip when he asked Him "do you understand what you read?" ('cause he read the book of Isaiah) - he said "how could i, unless someone guides me?" - that man was so educated and fluent in foreign languages (including hebrew) and nevertheless said he can't be sure he understands what he reads - i don't think that most people can understand Scripture only by reading it Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.80 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, ytLiJC said: i think systematic reading of Scripture is not the basis of what the spiritual servants and religious worshipers have to do as such - let's for example remember the case with the highly educated eunuch (of great authority under the queen of the ethiopians) (Acts 8:27-40), and especially what he said to St Philip when he asked Him "do you understand what you read?" ('cause he read the book of Isaiah) - he said "how could i, unless someone guides me?" - that man was so educated and fluent in foreign languages (including hebrew) and nevertheless said he can't be sure he understands what he reads - i don't think that most people can understand Scripture only by reading it Blessings I reject your theology and your opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytLiJC Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 357 Content Per Day: 0.15 Reputation: 65 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2017 1 hour ago, missmuffet said: I reject your theology and your opinions. when it comes to spiritual things i have no my own(private) theology or opinion Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OakWood Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 867 Topics Per Day: 0.24 Content Count: 7,331 Content Per Day: 2.00 Reputation: 2,860 Days Won: 31 Joined: 04/09/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/28/1964 Share Posted December 23, 2017 11 hours ago, ytLiJC said: i think systematic reading of Scripture is not the basis of what the spiritual servants and religious worshipers have to do as such - let's for example remember the case with the highly educated eunuch (of great authority under the queen of the ethiopians) (Acts 8:27-40), and especially what he said to St Philip when he asked Him "do you understand what you read?" ('cause he read the book of Isaiah) - he said "how could i, unless someone guides me?" - that man was so educated and fluent in foreign languages (including hebrew) and nevertheless said he can't be sure he understands what he reads - i don't think that most people can understand Scripture only by reading it Blessings If people can't understand scripture by reading it... then what hope is there for any of us? God is not just interested in saving only intellectuals and scholars. but he is concerned about saving everybody. Anybody who can read can also understand scripture... but only if they read what it says without pre-conceptions and without the pride of assumption. If God says the grass is green, then the grass is green. If God says the sky is blue, then the sky is blue. If God tells us there was a flood, then there was a flood. We do not need clerics and sages to translate it for us, because if we do that then we are vulnerable to the interpretations of false teachers who claim to be smarter than we are. The highly educated eunuch could not understand the book of Isaiah because he did not read it with the humility that God expects us to have when we read scripture. His education led him to have pre-conceived ideas about things. He had learned the doctrines of Men and he complicated everything that he heard without appreciating the simplicity of the message. He believed that he already knew the answers before he read them... but he didn't. God does not lie to us, nor does he speak in riddles. If God says that the Earth was created in six days, then it was literally created in six days. It's not a puzzle or a metaphor; it's a message that anybody can understand. Some people over-complicate things and believe that 'six days' is a metaphor, or an parable, or a secret code for 'six billion years'. But it is not. The fools that believe such things have listened to the doctrines of liars who claim that the Earth is billions of years old. They are trying to compromise and find a middle ground between the theories of Evolutionists and Darwinists, and the word of God! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmbld Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,491 Content Per Day: 0.54 Reputation: 1,457 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/23/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/02/1971 Share Posted December 23, 2017 I didn’t think education of foreign languages or other helped or hurt understanding scripture, rather we need the Holy Spirit to teach us. Simply reading it might be where all the strange doctrines come from, but relying on the Holy Spirit will reveal Truth if one is willing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne Posted December 23, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 107 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,820 Content Per Day: 1.30 Reputation: 4,806 Days Won: 2 Joined: 03/31/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) The Ark and flood were literal. So says Genesis. So says Matthew, Luke, 1 Peter, and 2 Peter. The Ethiopian eunuch understood what he was reading. His question was about whom the prophecy was speaking - Isaiah or someone else. That was his lack of understanding. Edited December 23, 2017 by Jayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytLiJC Posted December 24, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 357 Content Per Day: 0.15 Reputation: 65 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted December 24, 2017 (edited) 9 hours ago, OakWood said: If people can't understand scripture by reading it... then what hope is there for any of us? God is not just interested in saving only intellectuals and scholars. but he is concerned about saving everybody. Anybody who can read can also understand scripture... but only if they read what it says without pre-conceptions and without the pride of assumption. do you think the only hope is scripture?!, what came first, the Word that comes directly from the mouth of God, or, scripture, given that scripture is a written record of the Word that was first spoken by God?! also, remember the parable of the sower from Matthew 13:3-23, from which it becomes clear that there could be people to not understand the verbal testimony or the written record of the word of God yes, God has to save all humans and souls in the universe, but this doesn't mean each of them has necessarily to become and be a spiritual servant in this (cycle of) eternity, because claiming such a thing is like claiming that every subject has to become and be a president, premier, minister or another political leader - why must every national/citizen be(come) a political leader?! 9 hours ago, OakWood said: If God says the grass is green, then the grass is green. If God says the sky is blue, then the sky is blue. If God tells us there was a flood, then there was a flood. We do not need clerics and sages to translate it for us, because if we do that then we are vulnerable to the interpretations of false teachers who claim to be smarter than we are. but this doesn't mean that the religious worshipers don't have to practice the faith right(eously) enough, because how can we be sure that the meaning of everything God said was quite literal, especially when Scripture is full of revelations of scriptural words, expressions and prophecies that were previously mentioned (i.e. by previous Prophets/Saints)?! - an example of such a scripture is 1 Corinthians 9:9-11 that was already mentioned in a previous post 9 hours ago, OakWood said: The highly educated eunuch could not understand the book of Isaiah because he did not read it with the humility that God expects us to have when we read scripture. His education led him to have pre-conceived ideas about things. He had learned the doctrines of Men and he complicated everything that he heard without appreciating the simplicity of the message. He believed that he already knew the answers before he read them... but he didn't. here it is evident that there is a contradiction to what you say above, because first you say that the meaning of everything written in Scripture is (quite) literal, then you say that a highly educated eunuch cannot understand what is written in Scripture because of his high education?!?! - if an eunuch is highly educated, how could he not understand the words whose meaning is quite literal, given that such a man could understand words whose meaning is figurative, let alone the simplicity of a simple message (after all, he is highly educated)?! 9 hours ago, OakWood said: God does not lie to us, nor does he speak in riddles. If God says that the Earth was created in six days, then it was literally created in six days. It's not a puzzle or a metaphor; it's a message that anybody can understand. Some people over-complicate things and believe that 'six days' is a metaphor, or an parable, or a secret code for 'six billion years'. But it is not. The fools that believe such things have listened to the doctrines of liars who claim that the Earth is billions of years old. They are trying to compromise and find a middle ground between the theories of Evolutionists and Darwinists, and the word of God! i agree with the idea of literal six days(144 hours) creation, because, after all, God is the system Administrator and Provider of life and He has to provide the souls with abundant and eternal life as soon as possible - billions of years of (vain) evolution would frustrate/thwart His plans - so i say you are incredible with what you say about evolution - evolution is vain, God needs no evolution but as for the riddles, read the passage mentioned above (i.e. Matthew 13, more specifically, verses 10-13) - parables are a kind of riddles Blessings Edited December 24, 2017 by ytLiJC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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