This is why I am here, how about you?

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Badjao33 said:

Not sure who you are speaking of, but that doesn't describe me at all. 

I am talking about Bethlehem Bible College and their racist, "Christ at the Checkpoint."  I have no interest seeing bigots pervert Scripture to support their vile, disgusting demonization of Jews and Israel.  They are anathema.  

[Guest shiloh357]

4 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

Most economists traditionally use a simple economic measure known as GDP to define prosperity. Whether measured in total for a country or on a per-capita basis, GDP is the most familiar and widely used measure of national progress. 

Any normal person knows the difference between genuine "prosperity"  having a lot of money.   I never said that Israel was richest nation in the middle east, but in meaningful terms, they are the most prosperous.

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We can just scratch them from the list then and meet with other Evangelical churches while we are there. 

Again, I have no interest nor do I have the time.   So drop it.

[Guest shiloh357]

1 hour ago, Badjao33 said:

This seems to be a common theme with Christians in America these days. the vast majority are not willing to step out of their comfort zones to seek knowledge or to share the love of Christ with others.

Just because I won't submit to the racist Arab narrative of the conflict, doesn't mean I am against sharing the love of Christ with others.   I simply recognize when racism is veiled in fake virtues, the way "Christ at the Checkpoint" does.   It isn't about sharing the Gospel.  It is about an attempt to dissuade Christians from supporting  Israel by getting them to buy into a false narrative that demonizes Israel, while ignoring Palestinian terrorism, or at least redefining terrorism so that Palestinian rocket and mortar attacks on Israel can be justified as "resistance"  and any defensive countermeasures Israel employs is cast as oppression, terrorism or persecution.

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It wouldn't only be a blessing for us to visit the birthplace of Christ, but also for those we encounter while we are there. The Church in the Bethlehem is suffering right now and we should make an effort to show them support. 

They suffer because of Palestinian terrorism.   Israel  isn't persecuting them.   I support the real believers in the Land, both Jews and Arabs.  I don't support the institutional "church" that shields and justifies Palestinian terrorism and seeks to vilify Israel.

Edited May 27, 2018 by shiloh357

[Guest shiloh357]

8 hours ago, Badjao33 said:

I'm not finding that from their own sources. 

 

I find it in your sources because I am honest about the different faces of anti-Semitism.

 

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We also believe that our discipleship requires a prophetic voice. We feel compelled to address the injustices that have taken place in the ongoing conflict between Israel and Palestine, particularly the Palestinian lands under occupation. We gather with many communities from around the world to say that our present circumstances are intolerable and do not reflect the righteousness of the Kingdom of God. We abhor violence. And we believe that standing up nonviolently to injustice is an acceptable expression of our faith. 

That's problem, right there.  That's the root of the bigotry of the Christ at the Checkpoint.  The assumption is that Israel's presence in the West Bank is an "injustice" and they refer to it as an "occupation."  The problem is that from the Palestinian perspective ALL of the land Israel inhabits, from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea, is an "occupation."   Actually, this is not about the righteousness of the Kingdom of God, at all.  It is about false narrative and a thin "Christian" veneer that is meant to demonize Israel in the name of Jesus.   It really is disgusting and vile.   It is one of the faces of anti-Semitism that always tries to couch their hatred for Israel in a pretext of caring about the "poor" Palestinians.

 

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We do not condemn the Jewish people and we reject any forms of anti-Semitism. In fact, there are many Israeli Jews who believe that the present Israeli treatment of the Palestinians does not reflect the deeper moral values of Judaism itself.

Yes, they are called the Neturei Karta.  They are a group of Orthodox Jews numbering around 5,000 who oppose the existence of the state of Israel and support Palestinian terrorism and the Arab war to annihilate Israel.    So while the folks at CAtCp claim to abhor violence, they are willing to hold up Jews who promote violence and destruction.  

 

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We simply wish to find a life in the entire Holy Land that is free of discrimination and injustice, where each person can live without prejudice toward their race or religion.

The Palestinians have had multiple opportunities to do just that.  Israel has made incredible concessions at every turn, has given up land, has provided Billions of $$$ in free healthcare and Muslim holy sites are always protected by Israel while the Palestinians  regularly desecrate Jewish holy sites like the Tomb of the Patriarchs.   But the people at CAtChp probably don't want to talk about that.  

They also don't want to talk about the discrimination that is taught in Palestinian schools that Jews are descended from apes and pigs.   >>> http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=786   Jews are dhumanized by the Palestinians as cancer and other diseases >>>   http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=760

So discrimination happens all of the time, but to the people at CAtCp, it only matters if the Palestinians are the targets. 

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This also means we reject theologies that lead to discrimination or privileges based on ethnicity.

So do we.  But Israel's right to the land has never been privilege of ethnicity.   It is guaranteed to them by an eternal covenant (Gen. 17: 8,9).   It is their land by virtue of Sovereign, Divine decree, not by virtue of ethnicity.   Yet the Palestinian claim IS based on ethnicity.   So spare us the hypocrisy.

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Worldviews that promote divine national entitlement or exceptionalism do not promote the values of the Kingdom of God because they place nationalism above Jesus. 

Actually, Israel's divinely appointed right to their biblical homeland promotes the values of God's faithfulness and integrity which are the hallmark of the Kingdom of God.

 

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Affirmation #1: Israelis and Palestinians

We affirm that all people are created in the image of God. In turn we are called to honor the dignity of every human being and to respect their inalienable rights. We affirm that Jews and Palestinians are loved by God and capable of living together within peace, justice and security. This is God’s view toward all of humanity, residing in any political boundary and manifested through the mission of Jesus in bringing to everyone, “life to the full” (John 10:10).

 

 Well then, the folks at CAtCp can tell the Palestinians to recognize the inalienable right of Israel to exist on their biblical homeland. >>>  http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=433  They can tell the Palestinians to respect the dignity of the Jews  and to cease and desist all denials of the Holocaust >>> http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=650  >>>   http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=655   

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Affirmation #3: The Palestinian-Israeli conflict 

As followers of Jesus Christ we regret more than 60 years of conflict. We look forward to the time when the conflict will end and both peoples will enjoy genuine reconciliation. We commit ourselves to be peacemakers and to this ministry of reconciliation. As such we stand resolutely against all forms of violence and racism, regardless of the perpetrators.

6.  All forms of violence must be refuted unequivocally.

 

The first thing the folks at CAtCp can do then, is tell the Palestinians to cease and desist all manner of terrorist attacks against the people of the nation of Israel, accept Israel's right to exist on their biblical homeland and call for the Palestinians to remove the call for the destruction of Israel from their official charter.   Until they do that, the people at CAtCp are nothing but a pack of liars.

 

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Opposing the current state of Israel and its policies against the Palestinian people doesn't make someone a racist or antisemitic. It has nothing to do with the Jewish people.

The problems is that Israel has no "policies" against the Palestinians.  That is simply made up complaint.   It is the Palestinians who have policies against Israel namely their own charter which calls for Israel's destruction and Palestinian Imams who regularly call for the annihilation of Israel and the worldwide extermination of the Jewish people from mosques that sit on Israeli soil.    Ignoring the Palestinian policies against Israel, and excusing their terrorism against Israel as "resistance" and falsely portraying the Palestinian people has a poor downtrodden defenseless people is anti-Semitic given how many countless times, Palestinians have blown up busses, restaurants, shelled Israel with rockets and mortar fire.   And then to treat Israel's defensive countermeasures as if they are attacking the Palestinians is just plain dishonest and without excuse.

 

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Jesus commands us to love all people regardless of their race or ethnicity and this is something that every person who puts their faith in Christ must do. A person simply can not be a Christian if they hate or discriminate against Jews. That of course  applies to any other people group as well. 

The whole Christ at the Checkpoint events drip with anti-Semitism and bigotry.   They are really not what they try to make themselves appear to be.  

Edited May 27, 2018 by shiloh357

[Guest shiloh357]

9 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

The Christ at the Checkpoint conference begins tomorrow and will be live streamed, so the world will have an opportunity to hear exactly what their position is on the issues this week. One of the speakers this year is Dr. Michael Brown and on Tuesday he will be debating Replacement Theology with Munther Isaac.  It will take place at 2pm Jerusalem time, so 7pm EST if my math is correct. It should be an interesting debate to watch. 

 

 

You provided enough insight on their position to make it a waste of time to watch.  The fact that Replacement theology has to be "debated," only proves just how disgustingly racist and vile the CAtCp event really is.  

I am not going to waste my time tomorrow watching it.  

 

Edited May 27, 2018 by shiloh357

[Guest shiloh357]

 

9 hours ago, Badjao33 said:

 

http://www.stephensizer.com/2012/03/christ-at-the-checkpoint-seven-affirmations/

I find it interesting that you link to Stephen Sizer.  He is VERY anti-Semitic, has spoken at Holocaust denial events, blames Jews for 9/11, which only backs up my point about CAtCp being anti-Semitic, racist event.  He is a very vile and horrible person and not an authentic Christian.  Anyone associated with, or that supports anything associated with Stephen Sizer  is anti-Semitic.

http://hurryupharry.org/2009/01/31/stephen-sizer-cites-another-holocaust-denier/

http://blog.camera.org/archives/2015/02/church_of_england_lowers_the_b.html

https://www.scojec.org/news/2012/12xi_cos/sizer.pdf

[Guest shiloh357]

14 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

I thought you might want to watch Dr. Brown try to shut them down. Here is a quote from an interview with Dr. Brown. 

"In the name of dialogue, CaTC had occasionally invited speakers that are from the Messianic Jewish perspective. This year, Dr. Michael Brown is such a guest. Dr. Brown is a biblical scholar with much integrity. There is no doubt that he can speak up and defend a biblical view of Israel and the Middle East. My doubts lie elsewhere though. I fear that Dr. Brown might have been invited to falsely validate a sense of fairness and authentic dialogue at CaTC. By his very participation, as needed and fruitful as it might be, he brings instant cred. Is it possible that the main reason why he was allowed as a speaker was to give the false impression of true dialogue towards reconciliation? When I see the rest of the speakers, I wonder! Dr. Brown needs our prayers as he will be like a gladiator singlehandedly fighting in a very antagonistic arena."  http://www.newantisemitism.com/antisemitism/christ-at-the-checkpoint-is-the-virus-spreading

 

[Guest shiloh357]

9 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

I just googled the affirmations of Christ at the Checkpoint and their denouncement of terrorism and this guys blog came up. I never heard of him and really didn't care who posted the information. I was just looking for a site that had the information I was looking for and his was at the top of the list. 

The point is that he is an anti-Semite and that he is associated with this even shows just how racist and unchristian it is.

[Guest shiloh357]

7 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

This is exactly why I will be watching. I know Dr. Brown as his school of Ministry has several missionaries here in Davao City, and personally I think he will be ripped to shreds in this upcoming debate based on my own dealings with him in the past. He is easily angered and I think he will loose his composure pretty early on. I will be watching for sure. 

I am surprised that you would be rooting for the enemy.  Tells me all I need to know.

[Guest shiloh357]

7 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

He very well could be. 

 

He is.

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I believe that all prophesy has been fulfilled and there are no future events, so I disagree with both sides. 

Fortunately for the truth, you are as wrong about that as you are about all of the other drivel you spew on this thread.