OneLight Posted October 31, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.23 Reputation: 9,762 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2019 Here are the questions I asked: 3 hours ago, OneLight said: What translation are you using? Every translation I looked through states the same: NASB, KJV, AKJV, NKJV, ASB, NIV, etc. Please provide what your bible says and what the translation is. who do you say Jesus was praying to? Himself? Whose voice spoke from Heaven at His baptism and at the mount of Transfiguration? Please tell me, according to your theology, who was Jesus praying to when He prayed to the Father? (Matthew 26:39; 26:42; 26:53) Was He praying to Himself? At His baptism, scripture tells us that "a voice came from heaven, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."" Who in heaven is speaking? Who is heaven is calling Jesus "My beloved Son" (Matthew 3:16-17; Mark 1:9-11; Luke 3:21-22) Again, we read in Matthew 17:5; Mark 9:7 and Luke 9:35 “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear Him!” and “This is My beloved Son. Hear Him!” Who is speaking? Who is calling Jesus "My beloved Son"? You never directly answered these question, but redirected your answer to scripture that supports your "oneness" belief, which, by doing so, avoids having to give an answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101G Posted October 31, 2019 Group: Non-Trinitarian Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 38 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/13/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, OneLight said: What translation are you using? Every translation I looked through states the same: NASB, KJV, AKJV, NKJV, ASB, NIV, etc. Please provide what your bible says and what the translation is. KJV 18 minutes ago, OneLight said: who do you say Jesus was praying to? Himself? not to, but with, "to" only in intersession for someone else. and that "with" is with his diversified self, or as G243 allos states his numerical difference that is in flesh. 18 minutes ago, OneLight said: Whose voice spoke from Heaven at His baptism and at the mount of Transfiguration? Please tell me, according to your theology, who was Jesus praying to when He prayed to the Father? (Matthew 26:39; 26:42; 26:53) Was He praying to Himself? At His baptism, scripture tells us that "a voice came from heaven, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."" Who in heaven is speaking? Who is heaven is calling Jesus "My beloved Son" (Matthew 3:16-17; Mark 1:9-11; Luke 3:21-22) the answer is right in the scripture ... "a" ... voice came from heaven. 18 minutes ago, OneLight said: Again, we read in Matthew 17:5; Mark 9:7 and Luke 9:35 “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear Him!” and “This is My beloved Son. Hear Him!” Who is speaking? Who is calling Jesus "My beloved Son"? you are still not getting it ... are you listening, Matthew 17:5 "While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him." this we have addressed before. now are there any other question you like to ask?. PICJAG. Edited October 31, 2019 by 101G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101G Posted October 31, 2019 Group: Non-Trinitarian Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 38 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/13/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2019 (edited) lets advance this discussion futher. SINCE SPEAKING IN THE "plural", this is a good way to understand the topic as to who raised our Lord Jesus up. scripture, Genesis 1:26 "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth." here we have the plurality of God, correct? well lets see. for the very next verse states this. Genesis 1:27 "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them." question, how did God go from "US" and "OUR" in verse 26 which a plurality, to "HIS" and "HE" in verse 27 which is a singularity of person. NOW, one question, just one question. did more than one person make man as Genesis 1:26 points out or did God who is one person make man, which one? please read both scriptures again. and note, we're using the KJV of the bible. looking to hear your answer. PICJAG. Edited October 31, 2019 by 101G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted October 31, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.23 Reputation: 9,762 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2019 Here are the questions I asked and your answers. I am editing it so other readers can easily follow the conversation What translation are you using? Every translation I looked through states the same: NASB, KJV, AKJV, NKJV, ASB, NIV, etc. Please provide what your bible says and what the translation is. who do you say Jesus was praying to? Himself? Whose voice spoke from Heaven at His baptism and at the mount of Transfiguration? Please tell me, according to your theology, who was Jesus praying to when He prayed to the Father? (Matthew 26:39; 26:42; 26:53) Was He praying to Himself? At His baptism, scripture tells us that "a voice came from heaven, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."" Who in heaven is speaking? Who is heaven is calling Jesus "My beloved Son" (Matthew 3:16-17; Mark 1:9-11; Luke 3:21-22) Again, we read in Matthew 17:5; Mark 9:7 and Luke 9:35 “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear Him!” and “This is My beloved Son. Hear Him!” Who is speaking? Who is calling Jesus "My beloved Son"? 22 minutes ago, 101G said: 1. KJV Here is John 1:1 from the KJV: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." It is no different than what I quoted. Yet your reply to me was: 5 hours ago, 101G said: ERROR, John 1:1c states the WORD is GOD, so there is no one else, read John 1:1c again It is clear to see that "is" is not in the scripture as you claim, so there is no error. Strange that you did not ask me if I believed Jesus is God as I would of answered yes. The difference is, I believe in a triune God, not the oneness theology. 22 minutes ago, 101G said: 2. not to, but with, "to" only in intersession for someone else. and that "with" is with his diversified self, or as G243 allos states his numerical difference that is in flesh. That is twisting scripture to fit a theology. In Matthew 25:53 we read Jesus speaking about the Father: Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels? Since Jesus does not lie, if what you say is true then scripture should read that "Thinkest thou that I cannot now give me more than twelve legions of angels?" Scripture does nto read that way because it was not meant that way. 22 minutes ago, 101G said: 3&4. the answer is right in the scripture ... "a" ... voice came from heaven. you are still not getting it ... are you listening, Matthew 17:5 "While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him." Nice try, but whose voice would call Jesus "My beloved Son" if the voice were not the Father of Jesus? No matter how hard you try, you cannot prove through scripture that the Father, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are the same entity displayed three different ways. As for any more questions, no. When a persons mind is closed, it is closed. I have given you scripture and you have twisted it. I have given you examples and your ignore it. I have explained why your theology is incorrect, asking questions to get you to think, and you redirect. There is no reason to continue running in circles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101G Posted October 31, 2019 Group: Non-Trinitarian Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 38 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/13/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2019 49 minutes ago, OneLight said: It is clear to see that "is" is not in the scripture as you claim, so there is no error. Strange that you did not ask me if I believed Jesus is God as I would of answered yes. The difference is, I believe in a triune God, not the oneness theology. did the Lord Jesus stop being God? no, Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever." so he is God. 51 minutes ago, OneLight said: That is twisting scripture to fit a theology. In Matthew 25:53 we read Jesus speaking about the Father: Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels? Since Jesus does not lie, if what you say is true then scripture should read that "Thinkest thou that I cannot now give me more than twelve legions of angels?" Scripture does nto read that way because it was not meant that way. well let's see if he said "I PRAY TO the Father". no in pray he said, I pray the Father. now show in prayer where he said "I pray to the Father?", scripture please. 53 minutes ago, OneLight said: Nice try, but whose voice would call Jesus "My beloved Son" if the voice were not the Father of Jesus? No matter how hard you try, you cannot prove through scripture that the Father, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are the same entity displayed three different ways. As for any more questions, no. When a persons mind is closed, it is closed. I have given you scripture and you have twisted it. I have given you examples and your ignore it. I have explained why your theology is incorrect, asking questions to get you to think, and you redirect. There is no reason to continue running in circles. not trying, as we gave the example, Genesis 22:11 "And the angel of the LORD called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I."Genesis 22:12 "And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me." did God say that abraham was withholding his Son from him yes or no. no, the angel said that for God. so who's trying to twist the scriptures. the bible said "a" voice, it didn't say the Father spoke, you assumed that. seeing that we addressed your questions, are you going to address the Genesis 1:26 & 27 question? PICJAG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hands On Posted November 1, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 227 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 126 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/13/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted November 1, 2019 On 10/30/2019 at 5:01 AM, Jayne said: There are, of course, passages in the Bible that declare all three. I think that's awesome. It's indisputable proof that God is Triune and that Jesus, himself, is God. Acts 2:24 = "But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches. John 10:18 = "“No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This charge I have received from my Father.” Romans 8:11 = "The Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead. If the same Holy Spirit lives in you, He will give life to your bodies in the same way." God's word never contradicts itself. The Father is God. Jesus is God. The Holy Spirit is God. The Father is not the Son nor the Holy Spirit. The Son is not the Father nor the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is not the Father nor the Son. But all are God. Hence the use of all three Persons responsible for the resurrection. Although difficult for our finite minds to fully comprehend generally,that is how it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted November 2, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,466 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,378 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted November 2, 2019 On 10/30/2019 at 10:59 AM, OneLight said: Nope, three Entities that make up one God. Hope you don't mind I copied your diagram for future use. This diagram is worth 100 words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted November 2, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.23 Reputation: 9,762 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted November 2, 2019 3 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said: Hope you don't mind I copied your diagram for future use. This diagram is worth 100 words. No problem at all. I got it from the web - free with no legal issues. Use away! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted November 3, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 0 Topic Count: 905 Topics Per Day: 0.19 Content Count: 9,646 Content Per Day: 2.02 Reputation: 5,832 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/07/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted November 3, 2019 On 10/30/2019 at 11:03 AM, 101G said: if this is true, then who was sent according to Isa 48:16 Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me. is the "Lord God" the Father, and the Spirit is the Holy Spirit who sent the Son? yes or no. PICJAG. You see division where there is none. It could refer to the Father and the Holy Spirit or Jesus (preincarnate) and the Holy Spirit. The LORD (adonai / YHVH) refers to each in the Godhead Jesus said he was the Great I AM (YHVH) in John 8:58 / Exodus 3:14-15. The Spirit is the LORD (2 Corinthians 3:17) The Father is LORD (Matthew 11:25). One God three individuals who are the one God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choir loft Posted November 3, 2019 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 69 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,209 Content Per Day: 0.38 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/23/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/10/1947 Share Posted November 3, 2019 (edited) On 10/29/2019 at 11:01 PM, Jayne said: There are, of course, passages in the Bible that declare all three. I think that's awesome. It's indisputable proof that God is Triune and that Jesus, himself, is God. Acts 2:24 = "But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches. John 10:18 = "“No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This charge I have received from my Father.” Romans 8:11 = "The Holy Spirit raised Jesus from the dead. If the same Holy Spirit lives in you, He will give life to your bodies in the same way." God's word never contradicts itself. The Father is God. Jesus is God. The Holy Spirit is God. The Father is not the Son nor the Holy Spirit. The Son is not the Father nor the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is not the Father nor the Son. But all are God. Hence the use of all three Persons responsible for the resurrection. "I and the Father are ONE." - Jesus as quoted by John 10:30 Sh'ma Yisrael Adonai Eloheinu Adonai Echad - Deuteronomy 6:4 English translation: Hear O Israel the Lord thy God, The Lord is ONE. The Hebrew word Echad is used here instead of the Hebrew word Yachid. Yachid means an absolute one - as in the number one, as in a single person being one person alone. Echad means one as in a unity. The most commonly used English term similar to this is the term used to describe the United States - E pluribus Unum, or One from Many, a union. Echad therefore implies a unity of divine personality. Jews don't extrapolate their oldest prayer into its meaning in Christ. Gentiles continue to think of God as separate deities as illustrated by attempts on these pages to explain it. Mostly they don't even know this ancient prayer exists or what it really means. Now, you do. "Before Abraham was, I AM" - Jesus as quoted by John 8:58 Jesus declared Himself to be HASHEM, meaning the Name of God. This statement created the greatest contention created between Jesus and the priests of ancient Israel. In these five words alone, Jesus told us He is God. He explains the mystery of who He really is. Jesus IS GOD. I have been with you all this time, and still you do not know Me? Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me? The words I say to you, I do not speak on My own. Instead, it is the Father dwelling in Me, performing His works. Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me—or at least believe on account of the works themselves. - Jesus as quoted by John 14:9 - 11 It was necessary for God to die upon the cross so that the requirement of the LAW be fulfilled. If Jesus wasn't God, then the LAW is not fulfilled and no one is saved from their sins. that's me, hollering from the choir loft... Edited November 3, 2019 by choir loft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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