BeauJangles Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 43 Topic Count: 229 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 10,900 Content Per Day: 2.92 Reputation: 12,145 Days Won: 68 Joined: 02/13/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/14/1954 Share Posted March 26, 2020 8 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: With the proper context...less we lead people to their destruction....to keep the commands without faith in Jesus Christ... Oh, indeed. I couldn't agree more. Our doctrine needs to have essential balance in all things lest we topple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Behold Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 7 Topic Count: 87 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,795 Content Per Day: 1.34 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 3 Joined: 07/30/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2020 On 3/24/2020 at 8:14 AM, johnthebaptist said: What the law does is keep us out of trouble. In other words, when we sin, trouble enters into our lives. They law /10 commandments are certainly a lifestyle boundary that is related to God's holiness. But the real purpose of the law is to reveal you to be a sinner, according to the Law. And its from this revelation that we are to turn to the Cross and the One who hung on it so that we are set free from this "death" and "curse'. Christ has redeemed us from the "curse of the law", "being made a curse for us", and now we are "no longer under the law, but under GRACE" = IF< we are born again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,870 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,764 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2020 (edited) 34 minutes ago, BeauJangles said: Oh, indeed. I couldn't agree more. Our doctrine needs to have essential balance in all things lest we topple. This does have it's proper place but we need to clarify the context of "less we topple"... To distinguish which things can be topple and which things cannot be topple... And how to reconcile to the things that can be topple.... You said: "less we topple"... Making this personal....what exactly is that "less we topple"... Because there is something precious that cannot be topple... The keeping of the commandments gives what it gives....and the disobedience to the commandments can only topple what it can give... It cannot topple what it cannot give... Have I made my self clear...or I need to go at it from a different approach... Maybe with the faith in Jesus Christ there is a different approach.... Without the faith of Jesus Christ there is a different approach...one before the Cross and another after the Cross.... And we have monotheistic societies...who have incorporated the commandments in their belief system by their own declaration....and only have a history time after the Cross... Not so easy if we look from many angles.... Keeping the commandments can be a reason to denied the Savior... Edited March 26, 2020 by Your closest friendnt Spellings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeauJangles Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 43 Topic Count: 229 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 10,900 Content Per Day: 2.92 Reputation: 12,145 Days Won: 68 Joined: 02/13/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/14/1954 Share Posted March 26, 2020 2 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: You said: "less we topple"... Making this personal....what exactly is that "less we topple"... Yeah, bro. I did say it. If we allow ourselves and doctrine to become unbalanced, what's gonna happen? Remain perpendicular? Hardly. If that's the point your making, I get it. Otherwise, I have no idea what you're rambling on about. It's starting to sound like philosophical meandering to me. I'll opt out of the topic at this point and wished I had previously when having the opportunity to do so, including saying, "Please don't quote me." Let's keep it that way, shall we? I'm out now, go for it with whomever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnthebaptist Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Non-Conformist Theology Followers: 6 Topic Count: 118 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 4,361 Content Per Day: 2.30 Reputation: 2,109 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/25/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/03/1953 Share Posted March 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Behold said: They law /10 commandments are certainly a lifestyle boundary that is related to God's holiness. But the real purpose of the law is to reveal you to be a sinner, according to the Law. And its from this revelation that we are to turn to the Cross and the One who hung on it so that we are set free from this "death" and "curse'. Christ has redeemed us from the "curse of the law", "being made a curse for us", and now we are "no longer under the law, but under GRACE" = IF< we are born again. We can debate the real purpose of the law, but when we sin, trouble enters our lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplejeff Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 12 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,689 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 20 Joined: 06/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2020 10 minutes ago, Betha said: not heard that one before. Does not God now write them on fleshly hearts ? In Romans it is written that foreigners to TORAH, without TORAH, when they DO what TORAH SAYS (i.e. what Yahweh Says), they ARE JUSTIFIED. When those who HAVE TORAH do NOT DO what TORAH SAYS (i.e. what Yahweh Says), they are NOT JUSTIFIED. And Romans 2 explains God's View/ Statement of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Behold Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 7 Topic Count: 87 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,795 Content Per Day: 1.34 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 3 Joined: 07/30/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, Betha said: So are you saying we need to keep them 'after we 'have been saved ? He's saying we keep them because we are saved. Before, we could not keep them, and Jesus died to free us from the "curse of the law"... (10 commandments, etc.) But now that we are "under Grace" and not under the law, and because we have the Holy Spirit (Christ in us), we have now the power to walk upright according to the commandments, understanding that we are not doing this to keep ourselves saved. As if THAT becomes our reason for keeping them, we are now become "self savers", we have "fallen from Grace", and we are "in the flesh", and Christ is replace on the Cross by ourselves. Edited March 26, 2020 by Behold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRose Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Non-Trinitarian Followers: 2 Topic Count: 93 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 271 Content Per Day: 0.18 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/10/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2020 Paul at2 Corinthians 3: 3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. He is clearly saying the Corinthians are believers and should set a Christian example to other people in Corinth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Behold Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 7 Topic Count: 87 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,795 Content Per Day: 1.34 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 3 Joined: 07/30/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2020 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Betha said: Are you saying the 10 Coms are a curse we need to be redeemed from ? Are you born again? If so, then you are "no longer under the law, but under Grace".... "under the law", means that before God accepted your Faith to give you His righteousness, you were "under the law". you were cursed by it. This means the Law had dominion and held judgement over you until Christ's sacrifice and death and resurrection FREED YOU from the Law's dominion and CURSE. Now, you are no longer under the law, you are "under Grace"....IF you are born again. "under Grace":= is the spiritual "new creation" "In Christ", status, or standing, that is now become the recognized position you have, as a "son of God". The NT does not refer to a born again person as a sinner. It refers to you as a "Royal Priesthood", and a "SAINT". The law, now has no power to judge you as a sinner, IF you are born again... And if you do things that were considered SIN before you were saved, they are now only considered "works of the flesh". The Law alone defined you as a sinner before you were born again...... and once the Law has been replaced by the New Law, (New Covenant) (New Testament) which for the born again is "Grace", then the Law has no more authority to define you, ever again, as anything. What defines you now is the Blood Atonement and the Grace of God and "justification by Faith". If you will take 10 mins and read and meditate on Romans 4:8, you will discover that if you "sin", God Himself does not charge you with ANY OF THEM EVER AGAIN....And why? Because He has already charged Christ with them all, and Christ was SLAIN as full payment due YOU for ALL yours.. Christ died on earth for your sin, so that you will never again be esteemed as a sinner by GOD, and in eternity you will never be judged for any sin...... And once again, that is because Christ has already DIED FOR THEM ALL on EARTH. If you are born again, then you are now the "righteousness of God, IN CHRIST". Edited March 26, 2020 by Behold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted March 26, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,870 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,764 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 26, 2020 15 minutes ago, Betha said: Are you saying the 10 Coms are a curse we need to be redeemed from ? Your comment is well taken.... This is what Paul is trying to teach the churches with fear of death from the jews... For if Paul was talking about the curse of disobedience to the Law he would have been applauded by the Jews. Paul have made it clear that he was talking about the curse of obedience to the Law... Both during the times before Jesus Christ...because the Law could not give Life to the worshippers....only gave them the life apportionment from the Law...in the simplest of words "THE LAW DID NOT GIVE THEM WHAT YOU AND EVERY BELIEVER HAVE" The LIFE GIVER.... they were alive to God with the death inheritance... They were not like the Gentiles "dead to God with the dead inheritance"... At the Cross things changed.... Paul is saying the curse of obedience to the Law it was when it was in effect it could not remove the separation the veil....and Paul talked about another curse of the Law...."the wages of sin is death".... And one more....the curse of the un cleanliness in the Law...the need to purified once self from uncleanliness ....and the disobedience to religious calendar and the Sabbath... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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