Salvation...Can it be lost???

[apothanein kerdos]

But maybe you just think you are saved Eric? If you live a life of un-repented sin (I don't think you do I am just offering an example), you can consider yourself anything you want including saved. But the bible is clear that those who practice such things will not inherit the Kingdom of God, and we have specific descriptions of what practicing those things consists of in Galatians and in Corinthians.

The danger of holding on to an idea of eternal security (the term does not appear in scripture), is that it may give people who do not have a true saving faith in Christ, an excuse to not repent, to not fully turn their lives over to Christ and believe. I worked with a guy once when I was in college, a major pothead and he smoked pot on the job and was involved with various women sexually, but he claimed to be a Christian. We were on break one day and I said you know you shouldn

[Pilgrim7]

Cardcaptor,

Are you overwhelmed yet. Take heart, there are those who understand what you are saying. They have been saved by grace through faith and now they obey their God. They have not been saved by the law or works, because the Law can not save, it condemns.

The Law has two purposes;

1. It shows one what he is a sinner, and points out his specific sins and shows that He is condemned for the wages of sin is death.

2. It also shows him that he has a carnal heart, one that is 'not subject to the law of God' and can't be for the carnal heart loves sin.

He needs a solution for both these conditions. The law can supply neither. That which condemns cannot forgive, and it cannot do anything about the carnal heart, cannot make it subject to God.

This is where Jesus Jesus comes in with the New Covenant. When we realized our lost condition, that we were condemned to death because of sin, it drove us to Christ, the only one who could deliver us from this body of sin and death. Jesus took care of both problems shown by the Law of God.

1. Now by faith, Jesus forgave us our transgression of His Law, and removed the penalty of death.

2. Now He takes care of the second problem. He, the living Law, the sum total of all righteousness now comes to dwell in our heart, thus the 'new Covenant' promise is fulfilled, the law of God is now written in the heart. The 'New heart' is subject to the law of God. Now He lives His life through those in whom He dwells they 'hear His voice and follow Him'.

Now the 'New Creation' has been created unto 'good works'. Yet the carnal nature is still present to war against the Spirit. This is where the will comes in. The 'New Heart' does not make one a holy automaton. He is free to follow either the flesh of the Spirit. He has a love for God and His will, but still has the love of the flesh. His faith is very weak. If he chooses to abide with Christ, if he choses to walk in the Spirit and not the flesh, His faith will grow. If He chooses to walk in the flesh instead of the Spirit, his faith will shrivel and die. He will quench the Spirit and harden his heart against God. In this way works have everything to do with the quality of the faith and thus whether one endures the trial of their faith to the end and hears the words of Christ, 'well done, though faithful servant'.

God Bless,

Dennis

[angels4u]

Cardpactor,

You say that when a born again Christian dies while commiting a sin, he/she will straight go to hell?

What kind of sins are we talking about? You know we sin every day ,we try not to but before we realize it we might say something mean or do something else. So you think that if lets say we gossip while we die we go to hell?

[Ovedya]

Thanx for your personal version of this powerful biblical story. However you failed to answer my loving query. Was the Prodigal Son no longer his father's son when he was in the far country? Hmm. Excellent query indeed. And it will not curl up in the corner and stay curled.

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

Whatever!!

I would be interested in your answer.

Me too. In all my years as a Christian, hearing the arguments against eternal security, I have yet to run across someone who made a convincing case against the argument that Aurthur just presented.

Did the prodigal son ever at any point stop being the genetic son of his father?

[Kabowd]

Thanx for your personal version of this powerful biblical story. However you failed to answer my loving query. Was the Prodigal Son no longer his father's son when he was in the far country? Hmm. Excellent query indeed. And it will not curl up in the corner and stay curled.

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

Whatever!!

I would be interested in your answer.

Me too. In all my years as a Christian, hearing the arguments against eternal security, I have yet to run across someone who made a convincing case against the argument that Aurthur just presented.

Did the prodigal son ever at any point stop being the genetic son of his father?

Exactly. So far "whatever" is basically the best response I've seen thus far...lol.

[eric]

Smalcald,

I am not referring to eternal security. I never mentioned eternal security. I am talking works.Am I living in an unrepentant state?.........No, not as far as I can tell. Do I err?.....yes sometimes. Do I err intentionally?...... no I do not. Do I think I will be barred from eternal life with the Lord because I trip sometimes?........Absolutrly not.

Listen. I have been before the Lord and acknowledged the fact that I am a sinner in need of salvation. I have repented publically, I have receiveid Christ as my Lord and Saviour, I have been obedient and have been baptised in the Name Of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.

Now, as I understand from the bible, that is all that is required of me to guaratee my redemption, so if you or cardcaptor can provide me with works I have to do to further guarantee my redemtion. you are saying the work that Jesus said He had finished on the cross is not sufficient.

I would dearly like to know what works are required of me, that would stop me from eternal damnation.

I rest my case.

eric.

[Avodah]

Was the Prodigal Son no longer his father's son when he was in the far country?

I don't believe this was answered.

[eric]

And neither has post #150. and I still need what works I have to perform in order to be saved.

eric

[Arthur Durnan]

Hmm. The lights are on, nobody's home. Anyways...whatever...I'm faced now with a much deeper query: How come wrong numbers are never ever busy? Adios, amigo, I'm heading for Starbucks up the street and later, Baron von Richthofen's Flying Circus re-run.

GOD BLESS AMERICA INDEED!

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

[Pilgrim7]

Brother eric,

The Scriptures tell what works that the 'Saved person' does which demonstrate His faith. The Scriptures are the 'sword of the Spirit' who leads all beleivers into all truth by the washing of the Word.

2Tim 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned [them];

3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the HOLY SCRIPTURES, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

3:16 ALL SCRIPTURE [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

I just love it when God makes things crystal clear. All Scripture is how we know what good works the 'saved person' is to do when he is created unto 'good works'. It is interesting that the only Scripture in existence at that time was the 'Old Testament'. So I think that God is telling us that even the 'Old Testament' is to be used as doctrine, reproof, correction and instruction is righteousness, obedience and good works.

God Bless,

Dennis