Mary Was Just A Woman

[apothanein kerdos]

"this rock" is reflective in the Greek.

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SJ makes an excellent point; the Greek is reflective in this passage. Matthew

[Smalcald]

Smalcald, tell me why...Peter was married, refused to allow people to bow to him and give him undue honour and worship, did not forgive sins or claim this power once in Scripture, was the apostle to the Jews/not Gentiles, never once in the NT is said to reside in Rome, and obviously was not infallible and rebuked by Paul on at least one occassion???

Why does the Pope in Rome live richly, proudly, and recieve honour of men???  Why is he not the apostle to the Jews?  Why does he not wash the disciples feet?  Why is he not the one dying at the stake upside down and being fed to lions?

The last time I heard of a Pope dying...it was either an assassination by a Cardinal or friend, or because he slept with someone's wife...hardly a godly man I presume.

Oh yeah, and why is the present pope a Nazi?  I suppose it's not really his fault I guess, some say that he was forced to fight (why didn't he refuse)?  But that is not my concern.  My concern is this:

Of all the people the Vatican had to choose to become the new pope...they JUST HAD TO PICK THE NAZI!!!  Good sense of judgment those bishops and cardinals have don't they???

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He is not a Nazi.

But let me say, I do find all of the robes and luxury of the Vatican and the Pope as repulsive as Pat Robertson, Jim Lehay, Jerry Jenkins, and Benny Hine's lavish wealth and conspicuous consumption, which they have taken from the Lord. I find the unrepentant adulterer Haggee as repulsive as Pope's who have done the same, and indeed I find the Bishop of the Episcopal Church Spong, who denies the physical resurrection of Christ to be much worse than any Pope who at least publicly confesses Christ. Priests don't forgive sins, they proclaim forgiveness of sins, and we are told to confess our sins to each other, that is one of the biblically based things the Catholics do. We could take a lesson on that front.

Now the scripture was clear I quoted in Matthew, but did that mean Peter was a Pope or supreme leader? I don

[apothanein kerdos]

Smal....why do you insist on saying the "scripture was clear" when both I and horizon have shown you from the Greek that it was not meant towards Peter? It is a clear cut case when we turn to the Greek. IT simply is not meant for Peter.

[Pax]

"this rock" is reflective in the Greek.

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SJ makes an excellent point; the Greek is reflective in this passage. Matthew

[Guest juda]

Idolatry its been going around for centurys and I am not knocking any religions but the Catholic's never got rid of it. :emit-questioned: She was a very important women in scripture a very important vessal for God but thats it. Statues and rituals strick rules are all old buy products of the old sect Jesus is off the cross get into the century man. And you don't kiss the Popes ring you kiss Jesus's feet upon entering heaven. He is and until rapture will be at the right hand side of the Father. Blessings, juda

Edited July 30, 2005 by juda

[halifaxchristian]

Smalcald, tell me why...Peter was married, refused to allow people to bow to him and give him undue honour and worship, did not forgive sins or claim this power once in Scripture, was the apostle to the Jews/not Gentiles, never once in the NT is said to reside in Rome, and obviously was not infallible and rebuked by Paul on at least one occassion???

Why does the Pope in Rome live richly, proudly, and recieve honour of men???

[halifaxchristian]

Oh yeah...and the pope we have now was a Nazi. Are you debating that??? I sure hope not.

[halifaxchristian]

Horizoneast...never underestimate the lengths that the Jesuits will take to destroy Protestantism and true Christianity. I guarantee that there are Dominican, Malta, and Opus Dei Knights and Jesuit spies infiltrating Christian forums. No question in my mind. After all, that is what they are paid for, isn't it???

God bless,

Michael.

[Smalcald]

Halifax,

You know you seem to simply use the Scriptures as you see fit. You have created this whole fantasyland of Catholic conspiracies, which are totally non-biblical. Stick to the bible, yet when you do all you seem to see is a reflection of your own personal biases, you play into the basic Catholic criticism of Solo Scripture. You did not come close to showing anything with your retreat on that scripture, which was clear, Jesus was talking directly to Peter. That does not mean Peter was Pope though, as there was no such concept. I guess it comes down to what the meaning of "is" "is" as quoted by one of our more famous American

[Assisi]

Jesus is our rock.

But in the verse in Mathew I posted, no Jesus was referring to Peter as the rock of the Church that Jesus founded; the paragraph is obviously saying that. I find it puts us in a much weaker situation when we reach to make our point. The verse obviously refers to Peter as the Rock of the Church in this context.

.

We can't all be right, God is not the God of division.

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You are in agreement with these Protestant Scholars Smalcald. Naturally, Protestants aren