Genesis 2:8

[Marathoner]

As for the issue of the pre-incarnate Christ (I didn't avoid it this time) and the Word made flesh, it is good to remember the words of the Preacher from the first verse of Ecclesiastes 3. There is a time for everything... there is an appointed time for every matter under heaven.  

"Under heaven." God, who knows the end from the beginning, is incomprehensible to us... and yet He chooses to reveal Himself to us in the person of His Son. All things have come to pass in the eyes of our Father in heaven. Hence distinctions between the heavenly and the earthly have been lost over the centuries. We see through a glass darkly. 

Edited March 6, 2021 by Marathoner
clarity

[Frits]

1 hour ago, Marathoner said:

I generally avoid the term "pre-incarnate" but I understand it to mean this: before the plan of our Father from the beginning was revealed to us all, the Word made flesh.

Hi Marathoner,

Nice to see you here, you're most welcome!

Can one scripture provide evidence to support this?

"before the plan of our Father from the beginning was revealed to us all, the Word made flesh"

I think the above suggestion is unbiblical, and I will explain that.

Because when the Word of God became flesh as stated in Jh.1:1, the time had come that the man Jesus Christ came into the world with a body of flesh and blood.

Then this Son of God Jesus of Nazareth grows up to be a grown man, and is baptized with the Holy Ghost.
After completing all the work on earth and in heaven that God the Father commanded Him to do, HE PAYS WITH HIS OWN FLESH for the sins of all people at all times, on the cross of Calvary!

If God the Father, I AM, Yahweh, the angel of the Lord or whatever you want to call Him was already made flesh, why did our Lord Jesus still have to be on the cross?

Why do we nowhere in the Bible read of a Sacrifice as great as that of the Lord Jesus? Glory to Him who is due all glory.
The Lord Jesus paid for our sins once and for all with His own human body!
This Sacrifice is unique, once and forever, with which the Lord Jesus has brought about eternal salvation. Hallelujah!

Heb 9:12 KJV
Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
(Notice the word "once".)

God never took flesh other than in His Son Jesus Christ, and then came to dwell in the flesh of all who belong to the Body of Christ.
He, Jesus Christ, has bought us with His Own precious Blood, that Blood that flowed into that fleshly body of the man that was nailed to the cross.

Think about it,
God bless you.

[Marathoner]

3 hours ago, Frits said:

Hi Marathoner,

Nice to see you here, you're most welcome!

Can one scripture provide evidence to support this?

"before the plan of our Father from the beginning was revealed to us all, the Word made flesh"

I think the above suggestion is unbiblical, and I will explain that.

Because when the Word of God became flesh as stated in Jh.1:1, the time had come that the man Jesus Christ came into the world with a body of flesh and blood.

Then this Son of God Jesus of Nazareth grows up to be a grown man, and is baptized with the Holy Ghost.
After completing all the work on earth and in heaven that God the Father commanded Him to do, HE PAYS WITH HIS OWN FLESH for the sins of all people at all times, on the cross of Calvary!

If God the Father, I AM, Yahweh, the angel of the Lord or whatever you want to call Him was already made flesh, why did our Lord Jesus still have to be on the cross?

Why do we nowhere in the Bible read of a Sacrifice as great as that of the Lord Jesus? Glory to Him who is due all glory.
The Lord Jesus paid for our sins once and for all with His own human body!
This Sacrifice is unique, once and forever, with which the Lord Jesus has brought about eternal salvation. Hallelujah!

Heb 9:12 KJV
Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
(Notice the word "once".)

God never took flesh other than in His Son Jesus Christ, and then came to dwell in the flesh of all who belong to the Body of Christ.
He, Jesus Christ, has bought us with His Own precious Blood, that Blood that flowed into that fleshly body of the man that was nailed to the cross.

Think about it,
God bless you.

Many passages of scripture have been shared in this topic and they speak for themselves, my friend. We know that the Son of God is the image of the invisible God, that He is the Word of God in the bosom of Father since the beginning and in His own words, Christ said He is I AM who was before Moses. 

Scripture aplenty has already been shared; why not read them to understand? As for the Word made flesh and His crucifixion and resurrection from the dead, surely you know this was our Father's plan from the beginning: the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. There's no need to repeat what has been given over and over again. What needed to be shared has been given. The Lord bless you.    

Edited March 7, 2021 by Marathoner

[DeighAnn]

Why is it we have no problem with angels being called men, but call a man an angel and all h*ll breaks loose.  

WHICH of course would solve the problem here, IMHO. 

God HAD to FORM the FIRST souls on and OF the earth Himself cause there were no women to do it yet but after that 

Jeremiah 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

He knew all of us too, hence 'return to'.  

[DeighAnn]

7 hours ago, Frits said:

Then this Son of God Jesus of Nazareth grows up to be a grown man, and is baptized with the Holy Ghost.
After completing all the work on earth and in heaven that God the Father commanded Him to do, HE PAYS WITH HIS OWN FLESH for the sins of all people at all times, on the cross of Calvary!

I don't understand where 'completing all the work'  before the cross comes from?  Doesn't He still have to reign for the Lords Day?  all the way up until

1 Corinthians 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

1 Corinthians 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

1 Corinthians 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

1 Corinthians 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

[Ozarkbound]

11 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

I don't understand where 'completing all the work'  before the cross comes from?  Doesn't He still have to reign for the Lords Day?  all the way up until

1 Corinthians 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

1 Corinthians 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

1 Corinthians 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

1 Corinthians 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

His completed work was offering himself so that we can be saved.

[Your closest friendnt]

6 hours ago, Frits said:

Hi Marathoner,

Nice to see you here, you're most welcome!

Can one scripture provide evidence to support this?

"before the plan of our Father from the beginning was revealed to us all, the Word made flesh"

I think the above suggestion is unbiblical, and I will explain that.

Because when the Word of God became flesh as stated in Jh.1:1, the time had come that the man Jesus Christ came into the world with a body of flesh and blood.

Then this Son of God Jesus of Nazareth grows up to be a grown man, and is baptized with the Holy Ghost.
After completing all the work on earth and in heaven that God the Father commanded Him to do, HE PAYS WITH HIS OWN FLESH for the sins of all people at all times, on the cross of Calvary!

If God the Father, I AM, Yahweh, the angel of the Lord or whatever you want to call Him was already made flesh, why did our Lord Jesus still have to be on the cross?

Why do we nowhere in the Bible read of a Sacrifice as great as that of the Lord Jesus? Glory to Him who is due all glory.
The Lord Jesus paid for our sins once and for all with His own human body!
This Sacrifice is unique, once and forever, with which the Lord Jesus has brought about eternal salvation. Hallelujah!

Heb 9:12 KJV
Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
(Notice the word "once".)

God never took flesh other than in His Son Jesus Christ, and then came to dwell in the flesh of all who belong to the Body of Christ.
He, Jesus Christ, has bought us with His Own precious Blood, that Blood that flowed into that fleshly body of the man that was nailed to the cross.

Think about it,
God bless you.

Hello brother Frits, hope that your stress level has returned to normal.

I am glad you take a stance but it is not good for your health. 

I like this kinds of discussions but is not easy to discuss matters of this sort, if someone did not spent time to examine and distinguish one thing from the other, even what they say, it becomes difficult, they defend their mind is not a available. 

I would like to asked you something and only if you could.

It's about the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit which Jesus call "the Paracletous", the Holy Ghost. 

My cousin almost kill me, very fanatic and why?

I am right to tell him, something he did not want to hear.

I said the Paracletous came into the world for the first time on the day of the Penticost. And came "to the born from above people" or to those who were under the blood of Jesus Christ, to those who were in Christ Jesus, who were in his eternal Life, to those who had eaten from the tree of Life. 

To those who will never die, and they will never be resurrected because they are in the Life, in the eternal Life. 

Why he got so upset, I am wondering about that, why he was disturbed? 

What did I say and his doctrine was disturbed, can you point where I said something that flare him up, and became very furious. 

Is this a strange request? 

Is it an unusual request?

If you find something that I said and needs to be brought to my attention I will revisit it and take another look.

Thank you and God bless you. 

I remember the story of the three men in the furnace. The king said when he looked in the Furnace "we put three men , why I see a four one and he looks as if there is something special about him, engulfed in some glory that I do not recognize and he can not be a human but he looks line a human. 

The King show their guardian Angel that was with them all the time to protect them and who will continue to be with them, the Lord let him with whom he has to deal with, and not only him but everyone who will come against them. 

It does not say that everyone else show their guardian Angel. Or even if the three youths showed him. 

Or the Lord just opened the eyes of the King to see him, and to know with who he deals with .

He put the fear of the guardian Angel in him.

Jesus Christ said that Abraham had seen his day, not that Abraham show him.

Abraham died knowing that one day the Christ of God will come to where he was to take them to the Heavenly promise Land, as we know Abraham did not own a home as long as he live in the promise Land.

And that did not bother him, and he was not waiting for the Christ to take him from there and live with him in the Land of Canaan and establish the Kingdom of David, no of course not.

Abraham was looking forwards for the Messiah the Christ Jesus to take him from there unto the Heavenly Promise Land to be with him in and look at him sitting on the Heavenly Throne of David.

What a day that was for Abraham !

Abraham in Heaven and his bones still with us. 

We are like the Lord who created us "a spirit person in a human body".

Waiting for our freedom from this body and the cares of this world, and to go to where our Savior is in the Heaven, we are his Inheritance and he wants to take us to him but he has to wait till the time when this body can not sustain it self anymore and dies.

Thank you for the blessing we do not need it anymore to sweat in it and feel hot or cold.

People lived and are living for thousands of years in the place of the dead without their bodies who have decay and are no more.

Why complain if we live in Heaven without our earthly bodies.

The same way our Creator was living without an earthly body before, as a Spirit person. He has a body now and we do not have one when we are with him in Heaven. 

And that's ok, at least we are not in the place of the dead. 

[DeighAnn]

Just now, Ozarkbound said:

His completed work was offering himself so that we can be saved.

Thank you,  I had read it like "ALL" His work had ended at the cross.  Sorry.  I started thinking BUT what about the cup to be poured out on the day of vengeance?  Those were tears of blood and sure it's hard getting basically tortured and then killed, but having to do that vengeance thing,  upon the whole world, I'd rather do the 'die myself'  than to have to do that, and HE has to do them both, ohhh,  even as mean and evil as they are.

[Your closest friendnt]

47 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Why is it we have no problem with angels being called men, but call a man an angel and all h*ll breaks loose.  

WHICH of course would solve the problem here, IMHO. 

God HAD to FORM the FIRST souls on and OF the earth Himself cause there were no women to do it yet but after that 

Jeremiah 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

He knew all of us too, hence 'return to'.  

This was said only for the Messiah Jesus Christ, he is one who open the way for the Nations to come to God. With his obedience all the way to the Cross. 

[DeighAnn]

3 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

This was said only for the Messiah Jesus Christ, he is one who open the way for the Nations to come to God. With his obedience all the way to the Cross. 

Maybe I am very tired and am having a hard time understanding but could you
're word' this for me as I don't think I know what you are saying, unless  you are saying is the mystery was revealed "that in Christ salvation would be opened up to all the nations/ethnos".  and then I get it.  I am sorry and pretty much gonna call it a night.