Sparks Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.03 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 4 hours ago, other one said: so far there are over 70 million people in the USA that have completed the vaccination series. The most effective is the Pfizer at about 95% Have you ever wondered how they get that 95% effective claim? In reality, the only way to tell if the vaccine was effective is to to wait a few weeks, and then actually give those people vaccinated a shot filled with the real Covid 19 virus, and see if they catch the virus, by direct injection of it. It's called a challenge test, but they only do that with animals because it's unethical to do it to humans. So, where do they get this 95% business? They assume (assumptions are not science) that because 5% caught Covid 19 after the vaccine, anyway, that the vaccine failed in those cases. But this does not mean that the other 95% of vaccines given were effective (negative inference fallacy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKay Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 385 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 7,692 Content Per Day: 1.92 Reputation: 4,809 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 1 hour ago, Sparks said: Have you ever wondered how they get that 95% effective claim? Science! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKay Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 385 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 7,692 Content Per Day: 1.92 Reputation: 4,809 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 1 hour ago, Sparks said: But this does not mean that the other 95% of vaccines given were effective (negative inference fallacy). I don't think any vaccine is 100%.(Well there might be some but I don't have to look it up right now) But given what is going on, 95% seems better good. Considering not getting the vaccine would mean you have 0% effectiveness. And from my understanding. The vaccine wasn't just to keep you from getting Covid. But to help your body be able to fight it off more effectively if you get Covid. So you could recover faster without serious effects. But I can't say for sure if I am right about that. But I think I heard that somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.03 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 44 minutes ago, LadyKay said: Science! "Guessing" and playing with statistics is not how science works. 38 minutes ago, LadyKay said: I don't think any vaccine is 100%.(Well there might be some but I don't have to look it up right now) But given what is going on, 95% seems better good. Considering not getting the vaccine would mean you have 0% effectiveness. Scientists have claimed 100% effectiveness with the Ebola vaccine in Sierra Leone when that outbreak occurred in 2014. The claim is as silly as it sounds. Again, unless they vaccinate people against Ebola and then do a challenge test shortly after, they cannot make any claim about efficacy. The problem is, they still do make claims. It's not a scientific approach. It's propaganda. As I recall, the only thing that did work was survivors donating their blood (antibodies). Ebola can kill in hours. 38 minutes ago, LadyKay said: And from my understanding. The vaccine wasn't just to keep you from getting Covid. But to help your body be able to fight it off more effectively if you get Covid. So you could recover faster without serious effects. But I can't say for sure if I am right about that. But I think I heard that somewhere. You have this part right. The Covid 19 vaccines don't prevent Covid 19. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,227 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,950 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 2 hours ago, Sparks said: Have you ever wondered how they get that 95% effective claim? In reality, the only way to tell if the vaccine was effective is to to wait a few weeks, and then actually give those people vaccinated a shot filled with the real Covid 19 virus, and see if they catch the virus, by direct injection of it. It's called a challenge test, but they only do that with animals because it's unethical to do it to humans. So, where do they get this 95% business? They assume (assumptions are not science) that because 5% caught Covid 19 after the vaccine, anyway, that the vaccine failed in those cases. But this does not mean that the other 95% of vaccines given were effective (negative inference fallacy). they wait a few weeks and test their blood for antibodies.... 5% of the Pfizer people did not have antibodies for the virus and would not have the means to fight off the actual virus. That's how they test all vaccines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.03 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 Just now, other one said: they wait a few weeks and test their blood for antibodies.... 5% of the Pfizer people did not have antibodies for the virus and would not have the means to fight off the actual virus. That's how they test all vaccines. All vaccines are tested on animals, first. This Covid 19 gene therapy is probably the first used without animal testing. Of course, they had plenty of time to do animal testing. But that's another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,227 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,950 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 6 minutes ago, Sparks said: All vaccines are tested on animals, first. This Covid 19 gene therapy is probably the first used without animal testing. Of course, they had plenty of time to do animal testing. But that's another story. the people have been researching the process for decades. This is not totally new technology, just the ok to use it. I heard about it a long time ago and is partly why I'm not afraid of it. what is kind of new is the ability to create the spike protein from scratch instead of using actual virus DNA. And it's a lot safer to not use the actual virus. They are tested on animals to see if they are harmed by it.. We learned that with the first trials which were done on volunteers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted May 2, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.03 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 2, 2021 2 hours ago, other one said: the people have been researching the process for decades. This is not totally new technology, just the ok to use it. I heard about it a long time ago and is partly why I'm not afraid of it. what is kind of new is the ability to create the spike protein from scratch instead of using actual virus DNA. And it's a lot safer to not use the actual virus. They are tested on animals to see if they are harmed by it.. We learned that with the first trials which were done on volunteers. I think you mean to say they abandoned this line of vaccinations because it was killing all the test animals, and caused something called antibody dependent enhancement. It's also important to note that the studies from long ago were on regular vaccines, not mRNA vaccines, which are not even vaccines but are instead gene therapy. We have never tried mRNA 'vaccines' on people, ever, so no it was not tested over decades. Moderna has never made anything before. Zero percent track record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted May 3, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,227 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,950 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted May 3, 2021 but the people behind how it works has worked on it for decades. And though we get our bodies to produce the marker proteins instead of using the virus itself, it still does the same thing as a standard vaccine.... gets the body to make antibodies. We'll see where it goes, but right now it looks very good to me. I have had the vaccine for a couple of months now and feel very good about it. They haven't used mRNA on humans but they have been working on it for a long time.... the breakthrough from what I read is the delivery method of encasing it in Nanoparticles so the body doesn't destroy it before it can do its job.. From what I read this week, birth control pills cause more problems than the mRNA is causing (blood clot wise anyway). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKay Posted May 3, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 385 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 7,692 Content Per Day: 1.92 Reputation: 4,809 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 3, 2021 7 hours ago, Sparks said: I think you mean to say they abandoned this line of vaccinations because it was killing all the test animals, Okay I want to know where you got this from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts